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MOCA open carry event at Portland City Hall, Tuesday September 14th, 2010

shanebelanger

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Messages
667
Location
Freeport, Maine, United States
I will keep everyone updated via this thread: post any and all questions and comments here.

P.S. There will be a lawyer flying up from Fairfax, Virginia to help us fight this.

Where: Portland City Hall 389 Congress St. Portland, Maine

Time: TBA

On the 14th of September there will be a Portland Public Safety Committee meeting lead by none other than Dan Skolnik. WE MUST SHOW UP TO THIS WITH AS MANY PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE. BUT REMEMBER, WE ARE NOT THERE TO INCITE A PROBLEM, on the contrary. We want to show them that we are typical, normal everyday folks just going about their daily lives. We do NOT want to draw attention to ourselves or be disruptive in ANY way. You can choose to OC or CC or do whatever you would like, I would simply like to have as many people on our side as possible. Don't feel like you need to carry to come to this. Our intention is simply to show them that the populace does not want more firearms laws.

RE:

Prohibition on Guns in Public Facilities

At Councilor Skolnik’s request Chief Craig and I met with him to discuss reasonable
steps the Maine Legislature could take to expand existing state laws prohibiting guns in certain
facilities.

Those prohibitions include court houses, jails, public school grounds and community
colleges and the Capitol complex in Augusta:

17-A M.R.S.A. § 1058: Guns prohibited in court houses (attached);
17-A M.R.S.A. § 757: Guns prohibited in jails (attached);
20A M.R.S.A. § 6552: Guns prohibited on school grounds (attached);
State Admin Rules 16-219 Department of Public Safety: Guns prohibited in Capitol complex
(attached);

State and federal law pre-empts local authority to regulate the right to bear arms. That is
why this limited approach to new state legislation makes sense. Portland can call on the
Legislature to expand its own laws in a way that conforms with the right to bear arms.

While that right is broad and well protected by law, its exercise can be reasonably
controlled in carefully defined situations and facilities, as demonstrated by the previously cited
statutes, as well as a state statute prohibiting guns in bars (which are generally private property;
see 17-A M.R.S.A. § 1057; attached).

With this goal in mind, the State could prohibit firearms in public facilities; that is,
facilities owned by a governmental body or agency such as city and town halls, recreational
facilities, and entertainment facilities or similar facilities owned by quasi-governmental agencies
and to which the public has access.

Councilor Skolnik will ask the Public Safety Committee to take this issue up at its
meeting on September 14th following a public hearing, the Committee will consider whether to
send a Resolution to the Council. The resolution may be framed in a number of ways, including
asking MMA to draft and support legislation that prohibit firearms in public facilities.

Some exceptions to such a prohibition would include, law enforcement personnel or for
events at which facilities have been leased for gun shows, worthwhile to examine whether someone with a Concealed Weapons Permit should be exempted.

Chief Craig will support legislation that is focused on public facilities and will ask
Maine’s police chiefs and sheriffs to support it. His guidance in the discussion to date has been
to define very specific expansions that do not impact hunters but do add to public safety. For
instance, in Portland he sees a need for greater public protection at places like City Hall,
Fitzpatrick Stadium, Merrill Auditorium, and the Expo.

The Public Safety Committee will work with PPD, the Cumberland County Sheriff’s
Office, and the Portland-area legislative delegation to determine reasonable steps to propose in
Augusta.
 
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Butch00

Regular Member
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Sep 27, 2009
Messages
215
Location
Alaska
Why the need for more legislation? Public facilities belong to we the people.
Would be more infringement on rights, doing nothing for public safety.
 

Maine CWP Training

Regular Member
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Jul 12, 2010
Messages
463
Location
Harrison
Portland Public Safety Committee
September 14, 2010 Hearing
To whom it may concern.

I urge you to abandon any notion with respect to the City of Portland regulating firearms.

Previously I cited the state preemption:

Title 25: INTERNAL SECURITY AND PUBLIC SAFETY
Part 5: PUBLIC SAFETY
Chapter 252-A: FIREARMS REGULATION HEADING: PL 1989, C. 359 (NEW)
§2011. State preemption
1. Preemption. The State intends to occupy and preempt the entire field of legislation concerning the regulation of firearms, components, ammunition and supplies. Except as provided in subsection 3, any existing or future order, ordinance, rule or regulation in this field of any political subdivision of the State is void.
[ 1989, c. 359, (NEW) .]
2. Regulation restricted. Except as provided in subsection 3, no political subdivision of the State, including, but not limited to, municipalities, counties, townships and village corporations, may adopt any order, ordinance, rule or regulation concerning the sale, purchase, purchase delay, transfer, ownership, use, possession, bearing, transportation, licensing, permitting, registration, taxation or any other matter pertaining to firearms, components, ammunition or supplies.

Contemplated municipal firearm regulations would prevent law abiding citizens from protecting themselves or innocent others in direct conflict with state statutes hereinafter cited for your consumption.

Title 17-A: MAINE CRIMINAL CODE
Chapter 5: DEFENSES AND AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSES; JUSTIFICATION
§101. General rules for defenses and affirmative defenses; justification
1. The State is not required to negate any facts expressly designated as a "defense," or any exception, exclusion or authorization that is set out in the statute defining the crime by proof at trial, unless the existence of the defense, exception, exclusion or authorization is in issue as a result of evidence admitted at the trial that is sufficient to raise a reasonable doubt on the issue, in which case the State must disprove its existence beyond a reasonable doubt. This subsection does not require a trial judge to instruct on an issue that has been waived by the defendant. The subject of waiver is addressed by the Maine Rules of Criminal Procedure.
[ 1997, c. 185, §1 (AMD) .]
2. Where the statute explicitly designates a matter as an "affirmative defense," the matter so designated must be proved by the defendant by a preponderance of the evidence.
[ 1981, c. 324, §24 (RPR) .]
3. Conduct that is justifiable under this chapter constitutes a defense to any crime; except that, if a person is justified in using force against another, but the person recklessly injures or creates a risk of injury to 3rd persons, the justification afforded by this chapter is unavailable in a prosecution for such recklessness. If a defense provided under this chapter is precluded solely because the requirement that the person's belief be reasonable has not been met, the person may be convicted only of a crime for which recklessness or criminal negligence suffices.

Title 17-A: MAINE CRIMINAL CODE
Part 1: GENERAL PRINCIPLES
Chapter 5: DEFENSES AND AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSES; JUSTIFICATION
§108. Physical force in defense of a person
1. A person is justified in using a reasonable degree of nondeadly force upon another person in order to defend the person or a 3rd person from what the person reasonably believes to be the imminent use of unlawful, nondeadly force by such other person, and the person may use a degree of such force that the person reasonably believes to be necessary for such purpose. However, such force is not justifiable if:
A. With a purpose to cause physical harm to another person, the person provoked the use of unlawful, nondeadly force by such other person; or [2007, c. 173, §24 (AMD).]
B. The person was the initial aggressor, unless after such aggression the person withdraws from the encounter and effectively communicates to such other person the intent to do so, but the other person notwithstanding continues the use or threat of unlawful, nondeadly force; or [2007, c. 173, §24 (AMD).]
C. The force involved was the product of a combat by agreement not authorized by law. [1975, c. 499, §1 (NEW).]
[ 2007, c. 173, §24 (AMD) .]
1-A. A person is not justified in using nondeadly force against another person who that person knows or reasonably should know is a law enforcement officer attempting to effect an arrest or detention, regardless of whether the arrest or detention is legal. A person is justified in using the degree of nondeadly force the person reasonably believes is necessary to defend the person or a 3rd person against a law enforcement officer who, in effecting an arrest or detention, uses nondeadly force not justified under section 107, subsection 1.
[ 1997, c. 351, §1 (NEW) .]
2. A person is justified in using deadly force upon another person:
A. When the person reasonably believes it necessary and reasonably believes such other person is:
(1) About to use unlawful, deadly force against the person or a 3rd person; or
(2) Committing or about to commit a kidnapping, robbery or a violation of section 253, subsection 1, paragraph A, against the person or a 3rd person; or [1989, c. 878, Pt. B, §15 (AMD).]

Respectfully,

Paul J. Mattson
NRA Certified Instructor / RSO
#63731855
Maine CWP Training
101 Main St.
Harrison, ME 04040
(207) 583-4723
CELL 232-7063

www.MaineCWPtraining.com
 

rhenriksen

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Messages
80
Location
Texas, , USA
email addy of committee, or its members?

Paul, I'm an out of state property owner, and while I can't attend in person I'd like to help by emailing whoever's appropriate w. my opposition. Can you suggest the right email addresses to use?

thanks,

RNH
 

Maine CWP Training

Regular Member
Joined
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Messages
463
Location
Harrison
No email addresses right now. Many are confidential. Here is the sponsor's response moments ago:

Thank you Sir for sending along the statutes.

I encourage you again to recognize the aim here is to act within those guidelines.

It is possible to act within those guidelines.

I am well aware of the guidelines.

I again thank you for sending the guidelines.

These guidelines are central to our discussion.

These guidelines do not prove the point I understand you to be making.

I ask you to participate with us in good faith, not in rancor. That helps no one. Thank you Sir.

Dan Skolnik
City Council, District 3
City of Portland
389 Congress St.
Portland, Maine 04101
207.831.7343
 

shanebelanger

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Aug 25, 2009
Messages
667
Location
Freeport, Maine, United States
Since when is Constitution and Statute "RANCOR?"

It isn't. Mr. Skolnik obviously does not believe in an individual's personal freedom. He does not see the common man fit to defend themselves if the need arises.

On another note, I don't understand how they can say that they "need more security" at these places, yet want to ban firearms? How does this make sense? Legally carried firearms ARE security.

The NRA and MOCA will work closely together on this and we will prevail. I find it interesting and quite entertaining that MOCA has been called the premier 2nd Amendment organization in Maine by major news organizations around the state, yet the elected officials refuse to contact MOCA after I have requested them to do so.
 
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Maine CWP Training

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Messages
463
Location
Harrison
CITY OF PORTLAND
PUBLIC SAFETY COMMITTEE MEETING
TUESDAY, SEPTEMBER 14, 2010
5:30 PM
COUNCIL CHAMBERS – PORTLAND CITY HALL

AGENDA

1. Approval of Minutes of July 13, 2010 Public Safety Meeting
2. Support for Legislation in Prohibiting Guns in Certain Public Facilities
 

Maine CWP Training

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Messages
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Location
Harrison
Skolnik objects to treatment by council
He believes his colleagues are isolating him, triggering some accusatory e-mails from


PORTLAND - City Councilor Dan Skolnik is criticizing other councilors for what he describes as a coordinated effort to ignore him and isolate him politically.

One councilor says Skolnik is having a personal crisis and needs professional help in managing his anger.

The tension, which has simmered for months, culminated this week in a series of e-mails between Skolnik and two other councilors, copies of which Skolnik provided to the entire City Council and local media outlets.

READ MORE
 
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