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Thread: Crossing into Canada with valid CWP

  1. #1
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    Crossing into Canada with valid CWP

    Obviously you can't carry into Canada, yes I know this. But as I was crossing the border the young woman at Canadian Customs asked if I had "another form of I.D." Granted I had already given her a valid birth certificate, as well as my drivers license.

    I assumed that she was referencing that on her screen I came up as a CWP holder. So I said yes, I do have another form of I.D. I have my permit to carry. I handed it to her, she closed the window, turned to the agent next to her and half shreaked "THIS F-IN KID HAS A PERMIT TO CARRY A GUN" And than of course, my friend and I were asked to pull aside so we could be searched (again, seeing as we had JUST been searched by the American border patrol, even had a dog run around and in the truck.

    The entire time the border patrol agent playing the bad cop routine, looking at us before he begins to search and stating "is there anything I'm going to find in here guys? If you tell me now it's going to be a lot easier on you". By this time my friends freaking out thinking that because we're young (20's) that the officer will plant something, or perhaps he'll find a pocket knife and we'll go to jail for years.

    But all in all, I was just curious if anyone else has been searched simply because they had a permit to carry? At least I think that is why we were searched? I asked the Canadian BP if that was the reason he searched us and he said no, but thanked me for telling him that I had a permit to carry. Then he began to reference that he did not even get to carry while on duty.

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    Regular Member crdonov's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shanebelanger View Post
    Obviously you can't carry into Canada, yes I know this. But as I was crossing the border the young woman at Canadian Customs asked if I had "another form of I.D." Granted I had already given her a valid birth certificate, as well as my drivers license.

    I assumed that she was referencing that on her screen I came up as a CWP holder. So I said yes, I do have another form of I.D. I have my permit to carry. I handed it to her, she closed the window, turned to the agent next to her and half shreaked "THIS F-IN KID HAS A PERMIT TO CARRY A GUN" And than of course, my friend and I were asked to pull aside so we could be searched (again, seeing as we had JUST been searched by the American border patrol, even had a dog run around and in the truck.

    The entire time the border patrol agent playing the bad cop routine, looking at us before he begins to search and stating "is there anything I'm going to find in here guys? If you tell me now it's going to be a lot easier on you". By this time my friends freaking out thinking that because we're young (20's) that the officer will plant something, or perhaps he'll find a pocket knife and we'll go to jail for years.

    But all in all, I was just curious if anyone else has been searched simply because they had a permit to carry? At least I think that is why we were searched? I asked the Canadian BP if that was the reason he searched us and he said no, but thanked me for telling him that I had a permit to carry. Then he began to reference that he did not even get to carry while on duty.
    when did this happen? just wondering

    xd-over

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    Regular Member SaintJacque's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shanebelanger View Post
    Obviously you can't carry into Canada, yes I know this. But as I was crossing the border the young woman at Canadian Customs asked if I had "another form of I.D." Granted I had already given her a valid birth certificate, as well as my drivers license.

    I assumed that she was referencing that on her screen I came up as a CWP holder. So I said yes, I do have another form of I.D. I have my permit to carry. I handed it to her, she closed the window, turned to the agent next to her and half shreaked "THIS F-IN KID HAS A PERMIT TO CARRY A GUN" And than of course, my friend and I were asked to pull aside so we could be searched (again, seeing as we had JUST been searched by the American border patrol, even had a dog run around and in the truck.

    The entire time the border patrol agent playing the bad cop routine, looking at us before he begins to search and stating "is there anything I'm going to find in here guys? If you tell me now it's going to be a lot easier on you". By this time my friends freaking out thinking that because we're young (20's) that the officer will plant something, or perhaps he'll find a pocket knife and we'll go to jail for years.

    But all in all, I was just curious if anyone else has been searched simply because they had a permit to carry? At least I think that is why we were searched? I asked the Canadian BP if that was the reason he searched us and he said no, but thanked me for telling him that I had a permit to carry. Then he began to reference that he did not even get to carry while on duty.
    Loyal subjects of the crown and commonwealth... They don't have to worry about those pesky natural rights.

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    Quote Originally Posted by crdonov View Post
    when did this happen? just wondering

    xd-over
    about a month or so ago?

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    Shane you had to give Birth Certificate, and drivers license and they STILL wanted another form of ID? That's nuts.

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    I hope you have already reported this border "guard" for unwarranted use of profanity and attacking your human rights to be treated fairly and nicely - I'm serious - if the guard really used the F word and addressed you, and adult, as a "kid" when you are an adult american citizen - bet you can get her fired if you work it

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    relieves me of any desire to enter that country.

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    Just another example of why to not cooperate unnecessarily with government agents.

    Note to self: "No, ma'am, that's all my ID." (My CCW permit is not an ID, its a license to carry a gun.)

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    Regular Member SaintJacque's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by citizen View Post
    just another example of why to not cooperate unnecessarily with government agents.

    Note to self: "no, ma'am, that's all my id." (my ccw permit is not an id, its a license to carry a gun.)
    qtf

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    I just spent a bit of time researching what documentation is required for land travel between the US and Canada, knowing that in the past few years the requirements had been tightened.

    According to every site I found, you need a passport, a passport card, a NEXUS card, or an EDL--mainly because you need one of these to get back into the US. If your DL was not an EDL, perhaps the border guard was trying to help you by making sure you had what you needed to get back into the US without a major hassle.

    Handing her your CWP was not the wisest thing to do, however her reaction, if it was as you described, was unprofessional, to say the least. You should contact her supervisor.

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    Identification and documentation

    I now carry a PPC and have separated my DL into the registration/insurance packet.

    I will get a NEXUS card for its BI and propose it as diversion from state performed BI's should they become required. My stumbling block is the trip to the interview site.

    My border crossing experiences are quite the opposite of the OP. The Canadians are mellow and the USCBP think they're still in Sandistan talking to ragheads.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shanebelanger View Post
    I assumed that she was referencing that on her screen I came up as a CWP holder.
    Would border patrol have that access?

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    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    Since the US has started requiring Canadian Citizens to have passports to enter the US (or another document in compliance with the WHTI), Canada has returned the favor and required US Citizens to have a passport to enter Canada.

    I thought this we pretty commonly known. I guess not.

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    Actually, according to both Canadian and American official sites, since US citizens will need a passport (or one of a handful of other documents) to get back into the US, the Canadians are requiring they have them before entering Canada to avoid a hassle on the return trip. A passport is not actually needed to enter Canada if you are an American citizen.

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    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    Actually;

    "If you are a citizen of the United States, you do not need a passport to enter Canada."

    http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/security-...dmiss-eng.html

    They do suggest; "you should carry proof of your citizenship, such as a birth certificate, certificate of citizenship or naturalization, as well as photo identification."

    I was referring to the actual situation at the border crossing where any American without a passport is given a hard time by Canadian agents, as is any Canadian without a passport given a hard time by US agents. This behavior started after the WHTI.

    Having crossed the border into Canada and back many times with passports from both countries, I'm pretty sure I know what the requirements are and some of them are not found on any website.

    Moving on.

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    Regular Member ODA 226's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buster81 View Post
    Actually;

    "If you are a citizen of the United States, you do not need a passport to enter Canada."

    http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/security-...dmiss-eng.html

    They do suggest; "you should carry proof of your citizenship, such as a birth certificate, certificate of citizenship or naturalization, as well as photo identification."
    Then how did "President" Obama manage to enter Canada?

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    Quote Originally Posted by buster81 View Post
    Actually;

    "If you are a citizen of the United States, you do not need a passport to enter Canada."

    http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/security-...dmiss-eng.html

    They do suggest; "you should carry proof of your citizenship, such as a birth certificate, certificate of citizenship or naturalization, as well as photo identification."

    I was referring to the actual situation at the border crossing where any American without a passport is given a hard time by Canadian agents, as is any Canadian without a passport given a hard time by US agents. This behavior started after the WHTI.

    Having crossed the border into Canada and back many times with passports from both countries, I'm pretty sure I know what the requirements are and some of them are not found on any website.

    Moving on.
    Yeah, the border agents state that you can cross into canada with a birth certificate and drivers license, and then some state that you can do this once but never again. I have crossed many times, they just search you but then again, I am only 20 so obviously there is some profiling there. Like when the dog went around the truck, I watched it closely to see if it would actually make any movement like it "found" something.

    Of course, the dog made no such movement but the officer motioned like it had and aggressively told us to pull the vehicle over. All in all I am extremely glad that I know how LEO's deal with citizens to gain the upper hand (THANK YOU OCDO). By knowing this, none of his scare-tactics worked and I answered the minimum amount of questions, typically with questions of my own.

    Most of the encounter was quite comical and i had a hard time not to laugh at his little show. The good cop/bad cop routine is quite grand when you have nothing to hide ;-) and it's always fun to see your friend scared out of his mind haha...

    **Not bashing LEO's in any way, I actually have genuine respect for them** -until they prove that they don't deserve it of course.

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    I don't know why you are trying to turn this into an argument. I was merely replying to your assertion:

    Since the US has started requiring Canadian Citizens to have passports to enter the US (or another document in compliance with the WHTI), Canada has returned the favor and required US Citizens to have a passport to enter Canada.
    by pointing out that they are concerned only with one's ability to return to the US, where we have a stronger requirement.

    Here is one of the statements that I found:

    The Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative (WHTI), which was introduced in 2004 by the U.S. government to strengthen U.S. border security and standardize travel documentation requires all U.S. citizens present a valid passport or equivalent travel document to enter or re-enter the United States.

    Technically, Canada Border Services does not require U.S. citizens to present a passport to enter Canada, however, Americans do need a passport or equivalent travel document to get back into the U.S. Thus, Canada and U.S. border requirements may be different on paper, but, are in practice, the same. Does it make sense to allow a U.S. citizen into Canada who does not have the proper documentation to return home? U.S. border laws essentially trump Canada's.
    Your latest post seems to mirror what I was saying and is a qualification of what you were saying, so why the argument?

  19. #19
    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    Um huh.

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    *shakes head*

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    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    *rolls eyes*

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    Moving on.

    (Watch how it is done.)

  23. #23
    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    Finally.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    I hope you have already reported this border "guard" for unwarranted use of profanity and attacking your human rights to be treated fairly and nicely - I'm serious - if the guard really used the F word and addressed you, and adult, as a "kid" when you are an adult american citizen - bet you can get her fired if you work it
    I've tried this....largely ineffective. They could care less what a Yank thinks or feels.

  25. #25
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    Just another example of why to not cooperate unnecessarily with government agents.

    Note to self: "No, ma'am, that's all my ID." (My CCW permit is not an ID, its a license to carry a gun.)
    +1

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