Results 1 to 13 of 13

Thread: Should we be educating 911 operators instead???

  1. #1
    Regular Member Motofixxer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Somewhere over the Rainbow
    Posts
    974

    Should we be educating 911 operators instead???

    Maybe this discussion has been had already but should we be questioning our 911 centers on their training and policies on Firearm or MWAG. The calls usually start with the operators so are they trained in the laws? Should they be informed? Maybe we need to question and change some focus on the call centers. They should be asking what the individual is doing, then if nothing is happening or suspicious simply disregard. They should be educating the callers too at the same time. Is that really too much to ask? I'm curious what their training involves and I might be contacting my local call center to see what they say.
    Click Here for New to WI Open Carry Legal References and Informational Videos--- FAQ's http://Tinyurl.com/OpenCarry-WI

    The Armed Badger A WI site dedicated to Concealed Carry in WI

    "To disarm the people... was the best and most effectual way to enslave them." -- George Mason, Speech of June 14, 1788

    http://Tinyurl.com/New-To-Guns to DL useful Info

  2. #2
    Regular Member Publius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Northern California Now NH soon
    Posts
    67
    I think we should definitely be educating on all fronts, the public, LEO's, and 911 dispatchers. So far it seems our focus has been on the public / LEO's.

    Anyone have some good ideas on how we could do out reach to dispatchers?

  3. #3
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Fairborn, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    13,063
    911 operator: 911, what is your emergency?
    Grandma Brady: (frantically) There is a man with a gun!
    9: Has he fired the gun? Or is he threatening someone?
    GB: He has a gun!
    9: What is he doing with the gun?
    GB: He has it! Do something!
    9: Is it in his hand? Is he trying to conceal it?
    GB: (pauses) (not so frantic) Well, the thingy on his belt is kinda hiding part of the gun.
    9: The holster?
    GB: Yeah, the holster thingy.
    9: The gun is in its holster?
    GB: (hesitantly) Ye-es...
    9: What else is the man doing?
    GB: (Getting a little bit frantic again) He is buying milk!
    9: Is he doing anything else?
    GB: (frustrated) Yeah, he's buying eggs, too! He has a GUN!
    9: (just a bit condescending) So, you are calling to report an armed grocery shopping?
    GB: YES! Wait. No. I am calling to report a man with a GUN!
    9: The gun is in its holster?
    GB: (thinking she has gotten somewhere) Yes. Can we send the police?
    9: And he hasn't taken it out of the holster?
    GB: (suspicious) Nooo.
    9: And...he isn't robbing or assaulting or threatening anyone?
    GB: (exasperated) No. He is doing none of those things. HE HAS A GUN. I demand you DO something.
    9: OK. We will pull an officer off patrol and send him to the...Where are you?
    GB: The Piggly-Wiggly. On Highway 17.
    9: ...to the Piggly Wiggly. On Highway 17.
    GB: (triumphantly) Right away! He has a gun.
    9: Ma'am, the officer will take a look. But, if the guy is just buying milk and eggs, the officer won't even talk to him. He'll just return to patrol.
    GB: What???
    9: Armed grocery shopping is not a crime.
    GB: But...but...but...He has a GUN!
    9: Yes, ma'am. That's not illegal.
    GB: Well...I never!
    9: I know you never. That's why you think it's illegal to carry a properly holstered gun. Anything else I can help you with?
    GB: (silence)
    9: Ma'am, anything else I can help you with?
    GB: (more stunned silence)
    9: Ma'am, are you still there?
    GB: (sound of frustration) *click*

    9: Adam-12
    Adam-12: This is Adam-12.
    9: We have a report of an armed grocery shopping over at the PW on The Bypass.
    A12: Oh, the humanity! On our way. Lights and sirens? I like lights and sirens.
    9: Funny, McCoy. Just drop what you're doing and get over there. Expect a where-the-beefer to jump your butt and demand a shootout.
    A12: Can I shoot HER?
    9: McCoy, this is an open line.
    A12: You mean I can't shoot her?
    9: No, I mean if you are going to shoot her, don't admit it on an open mike!
    A12: Roger! Forget I said it. On my way.

  4. #4
    Regular Member MatieA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Egbert, Wyoming, USA
    Posts
    403
    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    911 operator: 911, what is your emergency?
    Grandma Brady: (frantically) There is a man with a gun!
    9: Has he fired the gun? Or is he threatening someone?
    GB: He has a gun!
    9: What is he doing with the gun?
    GB: He has it! Do something!
    9: Is it in his hand? Is he trying to conceal it?
    GB: (pauses) (not so frantic) Well, the thingy on his belt is kinda hiding part of the gun.
    9: The holster?
    GB: Yeah, the holster thingy.
    9: The gun is in its holster?
    GB: (hesitantly) Ye-es...
    9: What else is the man doing?
    GB: (Getting a little bit frantic again) He is buying milk!
    9: Is he doing anything else?
    GB: (frustrated) Yeah, he's buying eggs, too! He has a GUN!
    9: (just a bit condescending) So, you are calling to report an armed grocery shopping?
    GB: YES! Wait. No. I am calling to report a man with a GUN!
    9: The gun is in its holster?
    GB: (thinking she has gotten somewhere) Yes. Can we send the police?
    9: And he hasn't taken it out of the holster?
    GB: (suspicious) Nooo.
    9: And...he isn't robbing or assaulting or threatening anyone?
    GB: (exasperated) No. He is doing none of those things. HE HAS A GUN. I demand you DO something.
    9: OK. We will pull an officer off patrol and send him to the...Where are you?
    GB: The Piggly-Wiggly. On Highway 17.
    9: ...to the Piggly Wiggly. On Highway 17.
    GB: (triumphantly) Right away! He has a gun.
    9: Ma'am, the officer will take a look. But, if the guy is just buying milk and eggs, the officer won't even talk to him. He'll just return to patrol.
    GB: What???
    9: Armed grocery shopping is not a crime.
    GB: But...but...but...He has a GUN!
    9: Yes, ma'am. That's not illegal.
    GB: Well...I never!
    9: I know you never. That's why you think it's illegal to carry a properly holstered gun. Anything else I can help you with?
    GB: (silence)
    9: Ma'am, anything else I can help you with?
    GB: (more stunned silence)
    9: Ma'am, are you still there?
    GB: (sound of frustration) *click*

    9: Adam-12
    Adam-12: This is Adam-12.
    9: We have a report of an armed grocery shopping over at the PW on The Bypass.
    A12: Oh, the humanity! On our way. Lights and sirens? I like lights and sirens.
    9: Funny, McCoy. Just drop what you're doing and get over there. Expect a where-the-beefer to jump your butt and demand a shootout.
    A12: Can I shoot HER?
    9: McCoy, this is an open line.
    A12: You mean I can't shoot her?
    9: No, I mean if you are going to shoot her, don't admit it on an open mike!
    A12: Roger! Forget I said it. On my way.
    +1!!
    If you do not test yourself every single day,
    then it is just another wasted day.
    --Semper Fi--

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Thomasville, NC, ,
    Posts
    93
    As a 911 dispatcher I can add a little insight.

    First of all, there are several different types of dispatchers. Some are employed and under the management of their respective law enforcement agencies. Others are usually seperate from the police department and managed under their local government offices. My department is like that. We work for the local police and fire departments, but we are an independant department under the management of the city.

    That being said, there is also no universal training procedure for 911 dispatchers like BLET for police officers. Training will vary from one department to another and mostly focuses on dipatching and not memorizing every local law (we leave that up to the officers). Our job is to get all important information about a situation, decide the emergency level of the call, and dispatch those calls to the right personell.

    If someone calls in a MWAG call an officer will probably be dispatched regardless of the benality of the information we recieve. This is the CYA side of my job. I'm not going to lose my job because I sent an officer out on an obvious open carrier. I very well could lose my job if I don't and something happens. We do our best to weed out unneccesary calls, but for the time being people carrying guns around, even if we realize it's legal OC, will get an officer sent out. It is still up to the officer to handle the call appropriately and ask dispatch questions about the call if they feel we haven't gotten all the information they require.

    I can't speak for every dispatch office, but the main focus of taking citizen phone calls is getting as much information as possible that is important for the responding officer's safety and to assess and locate the problem (or lack there of) quickly. I would hope that all dispatchers would instinctively ask the right questions pertaining to MWAG calls, but I know there will be exceptions.

    The best thing right now is to make sure your local LEOs know how to handle MWAG calls. They will be the first contact on the street and need to know how to handle things based on their own obsevations along with what dispatch tells them. Any officer familiar with OC will also request more information from dispatch before approaching a MWAG if they feel dispatch hasn't gotten all the information they needed to.

    A simple addition to our requests for LEO training to also include their respective dispatch offices should be enough.

    I'm typing this from work so I might have been unclear about some of this. Having to handle phone calls and radio traffic in the middle of some of my thoughts makes it difficult to keeps things flowing correctly.

  6. #6
    Regular Member Motofixxer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Somewhere over the Rainbow
    Posts
    974
    Racer X,
    That is some useful information and gives us some insight. I think it might be worthwhile to look into our local call centers and find out. Education is a powerful tool. If the call center dispatchers understand that it's perfectly legal for carrying a gun. That comes through in their interaction and conversations. Even going so far as to tell the caller that it is legal to carry a gun. I don't want to argue with the calling...so much as the view of the activity as being so negative. If people are educated and understand when they believe something is wrong and it's not, then they aren't likely to do that again. Most of the call recordings I have heard don't focus much on what the person is doing, but more the fact that there is a gun. I know the gun is an important issue but the presence of it is not necessarily the important issue, if that makes any sense. I think if people were focused on what the person was doing, and the caller was instructed on the legality of it. They will be educated and less likely to call in the future. Which helps almost everybody. Less unnecessary calls are good for everyone.
    Click Here for New to WI Open Carry Legal References and Informational Videos--- FAQ's http://Tinyurl.com/OpenCarry-WI

    The Armed Badger A WI site dedicated to Concealed Carry in WI

    "To disarm the people... was the best and most effectual way to enslave them." -- George Mason, Speech of June 14, 1788

    http://Tinyurl.com/New-To-Guns to DL useful Info

  7. #7
    Regular Member sultan62's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Clayton, NC
    Posts
    1,319
    I know that locally the 911 operators are under the Emergency Director, so separate from the Law Enforcement side of it.

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Eastern Prince William Co. VA, ,
    Posts
    306

    I Know a 911 Operator

    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    911 operator: 911, what is your emergency?
    Grandma Brady: (frantically) There is a man with a gun!
    9: Has he fired the gun? Or is he threatening someone?
    GB: He has a gun!
    9: What is he doing with the gun?
    GB: He has it! Do something!
    9: Is it in his hand? Is he trying to conceal it?
    GB: (pauses) (not so frantic) Well, the thingy on his belt is kinda hiding part of the gun.
    9: The holster?
    GB: Yeah, the holster thingy.
    9: The gun is in its holster?
    GB: (hesitantly) Ye-es...
    9: What else is the man doing?
    GB: (Getting a little bit frantic again) He is buying milk!
    9: Is he doing anything else?
    GB: (frustrated) Yeah, he's buying eggs, too! He has a GUN!
    9: (just a bit condescending) So, you are calling to report an armed grocery shopping?
    GB: YES! Wait. No. I am calling to report a man with a GUN!
    9: The gun is in its holster?
    GB: (thinking she has gotten somewhere) Yes. Can we send the police?
    9: And he hasn't taken it out of the holster?
    GB: (suspicious) Nooo.
    9: And...he isn't robbing or assaulting or threatening anyone?
    GB: (exasperated) No. He is doing none of those things. HE HAS A GUN. I demand you DO something.
    9: OK. We will pull an officer off patrol and send him to the...Where are you?
    GB: The Piggly-Wiggly. On Highway 17.
    9: ...to the Piggly Wiggly. On Highway 17.
    GB: (triumphantly) Right away! He has a gun.
    9: Ma'am, the officer will take a look. But, if the guy is just buying milk and eggs, the officer won't even talk to him. He'll just return to patrol.
    GB: What???
    9: Armed grocery shopping is not a crime.
    GB: But...but...but...He has a GUN!
    9: Yes, ma'am. That's not illegal.
    GB: Well...I never!
    9: I know you never. That's why you think it's illegal to carry a properly holstered gun. Anything else I can help you with?
    GB: (silence)
    9: Ma'am, anything else I can help you with?
    GB: (more stunned silence)
    9: Ma'am, are you still there?
    GB: (sound of frustration) *click*
    I know a person who is a 911 operator in Fairfax Co, VA. She said essentially, that is how they are trained to react. They send an LEO out of courtesy but realize that they will only say "Hi" to the MWAG and leave.

  9. #9
    Regular Member grinner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Pewaukee, WI
    Posts
    101
    Eye95 = Hilarious. Well done, sir.

  10. #10
    Campaign Veteran GLOCK21GB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Green Bay, Wisconsin, USA
    Posts
    4,348
    very funny.
    http://youtu.be/xWgVGu3OR4U AACFI, Wisconsin / Minnesota Carry Certified. Action Pistol & Advanced Action pistol concepts + Urban Carbine course. When the entitlement Zombies begin looting, pillaging, raping, burning & killing..remember HEAD SHOTS it's the only way to kill a Zombie. Stockpile food & water now.

    Please support your local,county, state & Federal Law enforcement agencies, right ???

  11. #11
    Guest
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    808
    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    911 operator: 911, what is your emergency?
    Grandma Brady: (frantically) There is a man with a gun!
    9: Has he fired the gun? Or is he threatening someone?
    GB: He has a gun!
    9: What is he doing with the gun?
    GB: He has it! Do something!
    9: Is it in his hand? Is he trying to conceal it?
    GB: (pauses) (not so frantic) Well, the thingy on his belt is kinda hiding part of the gun.
    9: The holster?
    GB: Yeah, the holster thingy.
    9: The gun is in its holster?
    GB: (hesitantly) Ye-es...
    9: What else is the man doing?
    GB: (Getting a little bit frantic again) He is buying milk!
    9: Is he doing anything else?
    GB: (frustrated) Yeah, he's buying eggs, too! He has a GUN!
    9: (just a bit condescending) So, you are calling to report an armed grocery shopping?
    GB: YES! Wait. No. I am calling to report a man with a GUN!
    9: The gun is in its holster?
    GB: (thinking she has gotten somewhere) Yes. Can we send the police?
    9: And he hasn't taken it out of the holster?
    GB: (suspicious) Nooo.
    9: And...he isn't robbing or assaulting or threatening anyone?
    GB: (exasperated) No. He is doing none of those things. HE HAS A GUN. I demand you DO something.
    9: OK. We will pull an officer off patrol and send him to the...Where are you?
    GB: The Piggly-Wiggly. On Highway 17.
    9: ...to the Piggly Wiggly. On Highway 17.
    GB: (triumphantly) Right away! He has a gun.
    9: Ma'am, the officer will take a look. But, if the guy is just buying milk and eggs, the officer won't even talk to him. He'll just return to patrol.
    GB: What???
    9: Armed grocery shopping is not a crime.
    GB: But...but...but...He has a GUN!
    9: Yes, ma'am. That's not illegal.
    GB: Well...I never!
    9: I know you never. That's why you think it's illegal to carry a properly holstered gun. Anything else I can help you with?
    GB: (silence)
    9: Ma'am, anything else I can help you with?
    GB: (more stunned silence)
    9: Ma'am, are you still there?
    GB: (sound of frustration) *click*

    9: Adam-12
    Adam-12: This is Adam-12.
    9: We have a report of an armed grocery shopping over at the PW on The Bypass.
    A12: Oh, the humanity! On our way. Lights and sirens? I like lights and sirens.
    9: Funny, McCoy. Just drop what you're doing and get over there. Expect a where-the-beefer to jump your butt and demand a shootout.
    A12: Can I shoot HER?
    9: McCoy, this is an open line.
    A12: You mean I can't shoot her?
    9: No, I mean if you are going to shoot her, don't admit it on an open mike!
    A12: Roger! Forget I said it. On my way.
    For the win!!! That's a thing of brilliance right there. I don't care who you are, that's funny right there!

  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    North Carolina, USA
    Posts
    229
    Funny this comes up. I watched a couple vids last night. Watch these.... first is the 911 call, then the aftermath. The one guy with an AR15 is just plain alarming!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (3rd vid)

    Granted, this is in California, but I can see it happening other places as well.


    1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWOTxvJibhM

    2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHvk0vY6fwk

    3 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJVpCMyMKWU

  13. #13
    Regular Member Motofixxer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Somewhere over the Rainbow
    Posts
    974
    I have previously seen the second 2 videos. But I had not seen the first one. I have to commend the 911 operator in the first video. She did an excellent job of trying to educate the caller and avoid an unnecessary call. But the caller was way out of line. Asking for Police because he is a "funny looking guy" and "he looks funny" so she can "feel better."
    Click Here for New to WI Open Carry Legal References and Informational Videos--- FAQ's http://Tinyurl.com/OpenCarry-WI

    The Armed Badger A WI site dedicated to Concealed Carry in WI

    "To disarm the people... was the best and most effectual way to enslave them." -- George Mason, Speech of June 14, 1788

    http://Tinyurl.com/New-To-Guns to DL useful Info

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •