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Media insenting a new Law against firearms because of the recent LEo incident

joejoejoe

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http://www.examiner.com/headlines-i...-state-to-keep-guns-locked-and-away-from-kids

September 15, 2010 - Early Wednesday morning the 3-year-old son of a Clark County Sheriff's deputy accidentally shot himself and died, and the issue has been raised that no law exists in Washington State requiring adults to lock up their firearms, even when children reside in or visit their homes.

The Legal Community Against Violence (LCAV) issued a report in 2008 on Child Access Prevention.

According to the report, researchers have found that millions of children in the United States live in homes with easily accessible guns.

The report also indicated that Child Access Prevention (CAP) laws impose criminal liability on adults who negligently leave firearms accessible to children or otherwise allow children access to firearms. Currently 27 states have such laws in place - Washington is not one of them.

What do you think? Should Washington State pass Child Access Prevention laws to protect children by making adults criminally liable if they leave firearms accessible to children? Scroll down to leave your comment.

Clark County Sheriff’s office policy

Clark County Sheriff’s Office Lieutenant Chad Rothenberger told Examiner.com Wednesday, “We do have a policy in place for employees’ service weapons, but the Sheriff has no authority on how employees store their personal weapons. There are no laws about securing personally owned weapons in Washington State.”

According to the Clark County Sheriff’s Office press release issued Wednesday, the Sheriff’s Office firearms storage policy recognizes the Constitutional right of citizens to keep and maintain firearms.

Policy mandates the safe storage of department issued weapons, and encourages employees to use safe storage techniques for any personally owned firearms as well.

The 3-year-old child, whose father is a deputy for the Clark County Sheriff's Department, shot himself with his father's personal gun, not his service weapon.

Lt. Rothenberger agreed that personally, and professionally, it’s a good idea to secure all firearms, especially in a home where children reside or visit. “When my kids were growing up I worried about it. All of my firearms were locked up,” he said.

The press release also stated, “This event also emphasizes the risk inherent with firearms and we encourage anyone who possesses a firearm to ensure that it is safely secured.”

Lt. Rothenberger said that often deputies responding to calls find loaded weapons in homes, even when children reside in the homes.

Hot issue

Laws dictating how individuals should store firearms in their own homes is, and has been, a hot issue.

No amount of research, report-writing, or arguing about this issue is going to change the fact that too many children are dying because adults fail to use common sense and repeatedly leave loaded guns where children and teens can access them.

A 2000 study of firearm storage patterns in U.S. homes found that “[o]f the homes with children and firearms, 55% were reported to have one or more firearms in an unlocked place,” and 43% reported keeping guns without a trigger lock in an unlocked place.

When you think about that, think about a toddler, school-aged child, or teen living in, or visiting a home with a loaded gun lying around where they can easily access it. It happens every day.

Would you want your child or grandchild going to play at someone’s house where they could get a hold of a loaded weapon, potentially shooting and killing themselves or someone else?

Child Access Prevention laws prove effective

Laws that impose criminal liability on adults who negligently leave firearms accessible to children or otherwise allow children access to firearms have proven effective in reducing the number of children and teens who die or kill others with firearms.

The LCAV report stated a study found that more than 75% of the guns used in youth suicide attempts and unintentional injuries were stored in the residence of the victim, a relative, or a friend. At least two studies have found that the risk of suicide increases in homes where guns are kept loaded and/or unlocked.

A 2005 study found that the practice of keeping firearms locked, unloaded, and storing ammunition in a locked location separate from firearms serves as a protective measure to reduce youth suicide and unintentional injury in homes with children and teenagers where guns are stored.

In October 2000 the U.S. Secret Service published a study of 37 school shootings in 26 states. That study found that in more than 65% of the cases, the attacker got the gun from his or her own home or that of a relative.

Children are curious and guns are intriguing. Especially if they’ve never seen one before or if they know they’re not supposed to touch them.

If a teen is experiencing depression, or a life situation that is extremely difficult for them to cope with, finding a gun could be the simple way for them to end it all, without having time to think through their actions. Once they pull the trigger it’s too late.

States with Child Access Prevention Laws:

States with child access prevention laws include California, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, District of Columbia, Florida, Georgia, Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kentucky, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Mississippi, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Jersey, North Carolina, Oklahoma, Rhode Island, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, Virginia, and Wisconsin.
 

amlevin

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How many laws do we already have on the books that could be applied to any negligence in cases such as this?

How many that cover reckless endangerment? Child Abuse?

Rather than run out and pass another law, just use those already on the books that apply.

As for another state law that would require securing firearms, there is already a Federal Law that requires trigger locks to be provided at the time one purchases a handgun. More laws won't make people use them.
 

jt59

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How many laws do we already have on the books that could be applied to any negligence in cases such as this?

How many that cover reckless endangerment? Child Abuse?

Rather than run out and pass another law, just use those already on the books that apply.

As for another state law that would require securing firearms, there is already a Federal Law that requires trigger locks to be provided at the time one purchases a handgun. More laws won't make people use them.

+1
 

Lovenox

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Just a wild guess, but I doubt the 3-yr-old child of the cop was a gang-banger...

It goes without saying. The aim, of course, of my question was in the 'children and gun deaths' arena where they don't even reserach that sector...after all they are all 'children'. Techinally true, but a dishonest portraya.l
 

Dave_pro2a

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How's this for a new law: NO privately owned firearms for LEO. Duty firearms must be checked in before leaving work.

This incident just proved that can't handle that responsibility.

(as long as we're leaping to irrational conclusions) ;)
 
Last edited:

Mech

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I once had a serious discussion with someone about the "dangers" of having firearms at home. The opposing view was, if you want to be safe, then lock up your guns, but then if your guns are locked when you need them in a hurry, then you can't get to them since they're locked away so they're not as useful, so might as well not have any guns at all (weird reasoning, I know).

So I countered: well, if you're so afraid of your children getting their hands on your primary defense tool (usually a pistol), then DONT lock it in your safe, DONT leave it lying around; instead, STRAP it to yourself, either OC'ing or CC'ing; then, no one can get to it easily (besides you yourself), your kids won't "accidentally" pick up your gun and play with it. and it will be there when you DO need it. Problem solved!

They didn't know what to say after that (HA!) so instead they launched into the whole "only bad guys and cops should have guns" BS, in which case I stopped caring XD
 

Lovenox

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I once had a serious discussion with someone about the "dangers" of having firearms at home. The opposing view was, if you want to be safe, then lock up your guns, but then if your guns are locked when you need them in a hurry, then you can't get to them since they're locked away so they're not as useful, so might as well not have any guns at all (weird reasoning, I know).

So I countered: well, if you're so afraid of your children getting their hands on your primary defense tool (usually a pistol), then DONT lock it in your safe, DONT leave it lying around; instead, STRAP it to yourself, either OC'ing or CC'ing; then, no one can get to it easily (besides you yourself), your kids won't "accidentally" pick up your gun and play with it. and it will be there when you DO need it. Problem solved!

They didn't know what to say after that (HA!) so instead they launched into the whole "only bad guys and cops should have guns" BS, in which case I stopped caring XD


oooohhhhh...good one!
 

mtlhdtodd

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Ahh the rush to make the nanny state bigger.

If one law doesn't stop something bad from happening, pass ten more and that will do the trick. ----------------- 'til the next time
 

amlevin

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Huh, this got me looking up the TX law. The site I found was http://www.lcav.org/states/texas.asp#childaccessprevention .

Thought I'd share this snip
IANAL, does this last point seem odd to anyone else? I guess allowing children to work on the farm and have a gun?

Actually it does make sense. I grew up on a farm and there are many times that one "younger than 17" might have to legitimately use a firearm. I shot predators caught in traps set around our chicken house, mostly skunks. I used a .22 to "dispatch" downed or sick animals. Likewise for animals about to be butchered. Shot feral cats that ate our pheasants and dogs that chased our sheep. Then there were rats that liked to hang out in the barn. .22's didn't make too big a hole in the floor but did a good job on the rats. Most of this started happening about the time I turned 9 and it was normal for all the farms in our area.

No, I don't find it unusual for Texas Law to allow for children under 17, involved in an agricultural operation, to be able to have firearms available. Whole different world than in the city.
 

Mike Cooke

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I co-wrote the CCSO policy on firearms storage and specifically wrote the language so that deputies, as private citizens, still had their 2nd amendment rights protected. Speaking only for myself, and certainly not for the agency, I'm not in favor of any laws/policies restricting personal firearm rights. God bless the Owens family who need our thoughts and prayers.
 

gogodawgs

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I co-wrote the CCSO policy on firearms storage and specifically wrote the language so that deputies, as private citizens, still had their 2nd amendment rights protected. Speaking only for myself, and certainly not for the agency, I'm not in favor of any laws/policies restricting personal firearm rights. God bless the Owens family who need our thoughts and prayers.

Mike,

Say my respects to the Owens (I do not know them). I had asked others to do as well (Orr).

Thank you.
 

Dave_pro2a

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Huh, this got me looking up the TX law. The site I found was http://www.lcav.org/states/texas.asp#childaccessprevention .

Thought I'd share this snip
IANAL, does this last point seem odd to anyone else? I guess allowing children to work on the farm and have a gun?



Shhhh, they can also get a 'farm license' I bet. That would let someone under 16 years of age drive a vehicle on the road (Oh noze!).

When I was a kid you could get one in WA too (unsure about now).
 

sudden valley gunner

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Absolutely not!!!!
I wrote an essay about children and firearms that I am fairly proud of, of course no newspapers or magazines would publish it. Children are about a %1000 more likely to die from abuse or neglect at the hands of their own parents. And this is those who die!!!!! Not even counting the ones that survive.

Drowning, car accidents, their parents blah blah cause more deaths to children under 12 than firearms which are actually a drop in the bucket relatively speaking.

And in no way do I want to demean the tragedy of this youngsters death. But more laws are not the answer.
 

Dave_pro2a

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Absolutely not!!!!
I wrote an essay about children and firearms that I am fairly proud of, of course no newspapers or magazines would publish it. Children are about a %1000 more likely to die from abuse or neglect at the hands of their own parents. And this is those who die!!!!! Not even counting the ones that survive.

Drowning, car accidents, their parents blah blah cause more deaths to children under 12 than firearms which are actually a drop in the bucket relatively speaking.

And in no way do I want to demean the tragedy of this youngsters death. But more laws are not the answer.

And that's exactly why, upon reading about this incident, my first thought was the Dad killed his kid intentionally.

I'm not saying that did happen, just that based on abuse and DV stats (which run above average for LEO iirc) I would not be surprised.
 
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