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Thread: A Penny for your thoughts

  1. #1
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    A Penny for your thoughts

    Just a little light, comical reading for my fellow LEO's.

    Police Forum Thread on the Culver's 5


    For the record, I've tried to explain to them on their own forum that their actions are nothing more than antagonistic and extremely counterproductive to anything they "think" they are trying to accomplish. If they would simply carry, which they are well within their rights doing, and go about their daily business...dealing with the occassional LE run in due to a call from a "concerned" citizen (who isn't versed on carry laws)....they would be doing themselves and everyone else justice.

    Instead they run around with handguns, AR-15's (Ponderosa incident), voice and video recorders just looking to cause a scene and have a run in with LE....just so they cry wolf about their civil liberties and constitutional rights being violated.

    They don't seem to grasp the idea, nor do they care, that...to the general public (their biggest audience) ...their actions only lend to make them look like maniacle, raving lunatics. Quite opposite from the contributing, law abiding, citizens that they think they are.

    Personally, I would prefer if most of them just stayed in their mofhers basement where they crawled out of. But that's just me.

    Keep up the good work guys. Every time they refuse to show ID...hit them with DC. Eventually they'll get the idea.


    CO
    Tn

    this is from a rookie leo [eb31] who stated he visted or web page often

  2. #2
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    what about the comment? its self contradictory and hard to follow as a result.

  3. #3
    Regular Member cowboyridn's Avatar
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    Going about our business

    From Police Forum Thread on the Culver's 5


    (If they would simply carry, which they are well within their rights doing, and go about their daily business)


    My thoughts:

    I thought we were carrying and going about our business, we are not looking to get arrested or harrased, and we carry recorders to tape evidence of the conversation with LEOís so the encounter don't get twisted in a police report.

    We just simply wish to open carry without any hassle from LEO, and have a constitutional right to do so.

    If the Law Enforcement departments throughout Wisconsin would train their dispatcher, to educate the public when receiving a MWG call, when a citizen is open carrying, and doesnít appear to be committing a crime or about to, there wouldn't be a MWG calls being acted on by any LEO.

    Perhaps, we should compile a list of all the Law Enforcement departments in Wisconsin and put together a pamphlet describing the correct procedure in answering a MWG call to prevent LEO from responding and send a copy to all of them through wisconsincarry.org as an organization.

    Doing so, would put Law Enforcement agencies on notice to train their dispatchers to prevent another incident like the Madison one, and would allow Wisconsincarry.org to further hold the Law Enforcement Agencies legally responsible for not only a constitutional violation, but also a failure to train their dispatchers. (I donít know if failure to train is valid under these circumstances, I do know under an employment civil right violation, a federal lawsuit which has a failure to train added is an acceptable cause of action)

    The pamphlet would outline exactly what questions to ask, to determine if the citizen is open carrying and to distinguish whether he or she is committing a crime or in the process of committing a crime, which can be done rather quickly.

    Once the dispatcher gets enough information to determine if the citizen who is open carrying, isnít committing a crime or about to, the dispatcher would have an outline that instructs her to advise the caller about the legalities of open carry in Wisconsin, and that its legal, and that the caller shouldnít be concerned since no crime is being committed.

    Instead, the dispatcher for the Madison Police Department, as was recorded on audio in the recent incident in Madison, while in listening to the 911 call, the dispatcher was actually, coaching the caller to get her to say what was needed to allow her to dispatch police, and allow the police to issue DC citations.

    The dispatcher questions for the caller are instigative in nature and is direct evidence of the Madison Police departmentís policy, or mind set, that they intentionally intended to violate the 2nd amendment rights towards the five citizens who where open carrying at culvers, and or any other citizen in the future open carrying.

    The lawsuit against the Madison Police Department should include a request for injection relief requests the Judge to order the Madison Police Department to change their policy, and procedures so they donít violate any citizens constitutional rights while open carrying.

    In addition, include an order that the dispatcherís for the Madison Police Department be trained in the proper procedures in handling 911 calls when it involves a citizens open carrying and further order the department to cease and desist the intentional violation of the citizens of Madison constitutional rights while open carrying.

    Don
    Last edited by cowboyridn; 09-28-2010 at 05:18 PM. Reason: wording

  4. #4
    Regular Member anmut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cowboyridn View Post
    From Police Forum Thread on the Culver's 5


    (If they would simply carry, which they are well within their rights doing, and go about their daily business)


    My thoughts:

    I thought we were carrying and going about our business, we are not looking to get arrested or harrased, and we carry recorders to tape evidence of the conversation with LEOís so the encounter don't get twisted in a police report.

    We just simply wish to open carry without any hassle from LEO, and have a constitutional right to do so.

    If the Law Enforcement departments throughout Wisconsin would train their dispatcher, to educate the public when receiving a MWG call, when a citizen is open carrying, and doesnít appear to be committing a crime or about to, there wouldn't be a MWG calls being acted on by any LEO.

    Perhaps, we should compile a list of all the Law Enforcement departments in Wisconsin and put together a pamphlet describing the correct procedure in answering a MWG call to prevent LEO from responding and send a copy to all of them through wisconsincarry.org as an organization.

    Doing so, would put Law Enforcement agencies on notice to train their dispatchers to prevent another incident like the Madison one, and would allow Wisconsincarry.org to further hold the Law Enforcement Agencies legally responsible for not only a constitutional violation, but also a failure to train their dispatchers. (I donít know if failure to train is valid under these circumstances, I do know under an employment civil right violation, a federal lawsuit which has a failure to train added is an acceptable cause of action)

    The pamphlet would outline exactly what questions to ask, to determine if the citizen is open carrying and to distinguish whether he or she is committing a crime or in the process of committing a crime, which can be done rather quickly.

    Once the dispatcher gets enough information to determine if the citizen who is open carrying, isnít committing a crime or about to, the dispatcher would have an outline that instructs her to advise the caller about the legalities of open carry in Wisconsin, and that its legal, and that the caller shouldnít be concerned since no crime is being committed.

    Instead, the dispatcher for the Madison Police Department, as was recorded on audio in the recent incident in Madison, while in listening to the 911 call, the dispatcher was actually, coaching the caller to get her to say what was needed to allow her to dispatch police, and allow the police to issue DC citations.

    The dispatcher questions for the caller are instigative in nature and is direct evidence of the Madison Police departmentís policy, or mind set, that they intentionally intended to violate the 2nd amendment rights towards the five citizens who where open carrying at culvers, and or any other citizen in the future open carrying.

    The lawsuit against the Madison Police Department should include a request for injection relief requests the Judge to order the Madison Police Department to change their policy, and procedures so they donít violate any citizens constitutional rights while open carrying.

    In addition, include an order that the dispatcherís for the Madison Police Department be trained in the proper procedures in handling 911 calls when it involves a citizens open carrying and further order the department to cease and desist the intentional violation of the citizens of Madison constitutional rights while open carrying.

    Don
    The pamphlet is a good idea, but also not our job. We pay good tax money to these institutions and IMHO I expect good decisions coming from them.

    I'll also bet that after the lawsuit and corresponding funds are transfered out of the city treasury to the Madison Five, other departments will come up with their own pamphlets.

  5. #5
    Regular Member paul@paul-fisher.com's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anmut View Post
    The pamphlet is a good idea, but also not our job. We pay good tax money to these institutions and IMHO I expect good decisions coming from them.

    I'll also bet that after the lawsuit and corresponding funds are transfered out of the city treasury to the Madison Five, other departments will come up with their own pamphlets.
    During the stop we actually offered the WCI pamphlet to the officers. They were convinced they were right and didn't care to read it.

  6. #6
    Regular Member johnny amish's Avatar
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    A friend once told me that the line between a cop and a criminal at times is a thin one. A sheriff shared these thoughts with him. When we break the law we have to pay a price even if we don't agree with the law, leo's are no exception, they don't have to like the laws but they, like us, must follow them. The night the Culver's 5 were detained 8 leo's decided to become criminals. I hope the penalty is more than enough to make all of them think twice about which side of the law they are on.

  7. #7
    Regular Member IcrewUH60's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnny amish View Post
    A friend once told me that the line between a cop and a criminal at times is a thin one. A sheriff shared these thoughts with him. When we break the law we have to pay a price even if we don't agree with the law, leo's are no exception, they don't have to like the laws but they, like us, must follow them. The night the Culver's 5 were detained 8 leo's decided to become criminals. I hope the penalty is more than enough to make all of them think twice about which side of the law they are on.
    well said.

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