Victory for OC in Manhattan Beach

Is the part about "not talking to children about guns" even legal ?

Is there any law in CA penal code that prohibits an adult, or even a minor, from talking to a minor about lawful subjects ?

Ca Patriot said:

Is the part about "not talking to children about guns" even legal ?

Is there any law in CA penal code that prohibits an adult, or even a minor, from talking to a minor about lawful subjects ?

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Has any of the statements the chief made had any basis in LAW? No.

Since when did police departments "feel" things? They are supposed to be unbiased enforcers of the law, whatever the law is, not interpreters or creators of law.

copy paste from the Daily Breeze.....

"We plan on still going to the fair," Green said. "That right is given to us by the Constitution."

I hope that is a misquote.

Gundude said:

copy paste from the examiner.....

"We plan on still going to the fair," Green said. "That right is given to us by the Constitution."

I hope that is a misquote.

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Two completely different sentences from different paragraphs pasted together by reporters.

Welcome to the mainstream media folks.

hgreen said:

So now if any liberal cook brings up another AB1934 you're going to try and point fingers at SBOC and the MB Fair now?

This is just great.

Don't stand up and fight for your rights kids, it might make the oppressors angry and try to take more of your rights away, just sit tight and let them put that screw in your ass a little deeper.

Sorry, I'm not going to let these crooks slide every time they want to violate someones civil rights. By taking the actions SBOC has been in the LA area we have grown an enormous support base of people who previously had never heard of OC or AB1934 and are now freedom fighters ready to take on these types of battles.

If you want to stay at home polishing your gun and not risk "future ab1934s", fine. We are going to go out and fight TODAY to preserve our freedoms.

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I could not agree more. You ARE the man. Instead of bashing on someone elses tactics like some here do. They should continue to use their own approach.

I WILL be there.

If a bill comes about because of this I hope you would be VERY proud. You are doing a great job. I only hope the bill is named after you. The bill will NOT hold water and would prove how determined the antis are to strip our rights.

WHEN nothing bad happens will the media cover this? NO! Will you get an apology? NO! Have you done the RIGHT thing HELL YES.

See ya there!

Right-on Bro!

ryanburbridge said:

I could not agree more. You ARE the man. Instead of bashing on someone elses tactics like some here do. They should continue to use their own approach.

I WILL be there.

If a bill comes about because of this I hope you would be VERY proud. You are doing a great job. I only hope the bill is named after you. The bill will NOT hold water and would prove how determined the antis are to strip our rights.

WHEN nothing bad happens will the media cover this? NO! Will you get an apology? NO! Have you done the RIGHT thing HELL YES.

See ya there!

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Hey Ryanburbridge,

Your opinion is right-on!

Great job hgreen. The grassroots gets it done while the intelectuals who act like RINOs get hammered.

Playing nice and capitulating with people who want to take your creator granted rights is what RINOs do. hgreen is no RINO.

markm

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hgreen said:

So now if any liberal cook brings up another AB1934 you're going to try and point fingers at SBOC and the MB Fair now?

This is just great.

Don't stand up and fight for your rights kids, it might make the oppressors angry and try to take more of your rights away, just sit tight and let them put that screw in your ass a little deeper.

Sorry, I'm not going to let these crooks slide every time they want to violate someones civil rights. By taking the actions SBOC has been in the LA area we have grown an enormous support base of people who previously had never heard of OC or AB1934 and are now freedom fighters ready to take on these types of battles.

If you want to stay at home polishing your gun and not risk "future ab1934s", fine. We are going to go out and fight TODAY to preserve our freedoms.

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Apparently you have either misidentified me or mistaken the context of what I wrote.

First- My pistol does not live in a safe and only come out for cleaning (or special pre-arranged events conducted for the express purpose of making an exhibition of my rights). I am an active OC proponent- carrying as frequently as I am able and to the furthest extent I can... including loaded open carry.

Second, there is some empirical merit to when I say that pushing OC hard into people's faces can and will result in retaliatory legislation. this we saw with the mass events in San Diego and Lori Saldana's vindictive little bill. It is a miracle that we wont be commiting a misdemeanor come January 1, 2011- our fate was decided by the incapacitation of two legislators and the deft play of certain friends in the state house on the evening of the final legislative session. This was in no way a win--- in fact, it wasnt even a narrow victory, but a defeat averted.

The next legislative session wont include invalids like the last one... and there is no chance that California will flip Conservative/Republican in November. So the odds a AB1934 like bill being advanced are pretty strong. Giving the antis a target, a reason why they need to pass such a bill is not in our best interests.

That doesnt mean that OC cant be conducted in a responsible and effective way- both to provide the protection that we deserve and to prosyletize those who do not know the truth about guns in California. It is possible to tell the crooks 'no' and not do it in a fashion that upsets the general public... I dont think using the politics of threats is any way to win average people over.

So if we are still running scared of more unconstitutional anti-gun laws then what was McDonald v. Chicago all about? I may be wrong but it is my understanding that any gun law they propose/pass will be taken before a judge and stayed before implementation until a judge can rule on the constitutionality of it.

To suggest not OC'ing is mystifying to me. The anti's are out there and they will always be out there. They will keep trying to pass legislation till they have covered every possible restriction and then they will go back and start at the beginning of their list. If we wait till every state is like AZ, maybe our grandkids will enjoy that freedom.
Notice that the Brady bunch has quit picketing our events. Now they are grasping at straws playing the God card. Next they will unite the Dos 2.8 users. Their group is getting smaller, but it is still out there.

chewy352 said:

So if we are still running scared of more unconstitutional anti-gun laws then what was McDonald v. Chicago all about? I may be wrong but it is my understanding that any gun law they propose/pass will be taken before a judge and stayed before implementation until a judge can rule on the constitutionality of it.

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Think of the fight for RKBA as siege warfare. One must prepare that battlefield by battering down walls to soften up the target, weakening the enemies defences prior to commiting troops.

Charge to soon, even with good intentions, and needless casualties and set backs can result.

Creating UOC cultural conflict before having supporting case law is like committing to open conventional warfare with a guerrilla force.

Heller and McDonald were just the seige artillary's opening salvo. Steady boys steady, H hour is comming.

Gundude said:

To suggest not OC'ing is mystifying to me.

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Gundude, I dont mean to call you out, but can you please point to the post in this thread where someone suggested that OC shouldnt be attempted? Or are you refering to something posted in another forum?

ConditionThree said:

Gundude, I dont mean to call you out, but can you please point to the post in this thread where someone suggested that OC shouldnt be attempted? Or are you refering to something posted in another forum?

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That was mostly for the calguners who are lurking here, and maybe a little venting. I UOC everytime I leave my house, and I have no intentions of standing down.

CATO, I have been waiting 50 years...

cato said:

Think of the fight for RKBA as siege warfare. One must prepare that battlefield by battering down walls to soften up the target, weakening the enemies defences prior to commiting troops.

Charge to soon, even with good intentions, and needless casualties and set backs can result.

Creating UOC cultural conflict before having supporting case law is like committing to open conventional warfare with a guerrilla force.

Heller and McDonald were just the seige artillary's opening salvo. Steady boys steady, H hour is comming.

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Hello Cato,

I have been waiting for 50 years to read a SCOTUS ruling that confirms my right to keep and bear arms. McDonald and Heller only allow me to have a handgun in my house for defensive purposes. Yea, there is a throw-away line about RKBA in Heller, but that is it.

I have been reading for years that we need to prepare the "right" ground for our battlefield before we start our artillery barage. Blah, Blah, Blah! We fight on the best ground that we can find RIGHT NOW! Perfection and utopia don't exist.

The Tea Parties are a grass roots uprising that is changing the face of the Republican Party (eg: Murkoski, Castle, et allia).

The grass roots needs to continue to our 4A, 2A, and 1A gorilla offensive. After all, how do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time!

Also, I waited 50 years for McDonald and Heller, how long before you produce the next positive step; if I am lucky, we will have another "brick-in-the-wall" jsut before I die.

markm

MarkBofRAdvocate said:

I waited 50 years for McDonald and Heller, how long before you produce the next positive step; if I am lucky, we will have another "brick-in-the-wall" jsut before I die.

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Well, in every building you have to set cornerstones to square up the construction. On one end you have Heller, on the other you have McDonald. There are other cases being advanced one after another, the next dependent upon the preceeding case. They all arent the same size, but collectively they will become an impenetrable barrier to protect your rights. When I see new litigation like we saw with CGF and Sam Wolanyk, I can easily imagine it being set in place in preparation for the next brick to be laid. While this process is geological in scale and in timing, we are not only witnesses to seeing this historic landmark to the second amendment built, but also participants in its building.

Don't give me a civics lesson!

ConditionThree said:

Well, in every building you have to set cornerstones to square up the construction. On one end you have Heller, on the other you have McDonald. There are other cases being advanced one after another, the next dependent upon the preceeding case. They all arent the same size, but collectively they will become an impenetrable barrier to protect your rights. When I see new litigation like we saw with CGF and Sam Wolanyk, I can easily imagine it being set in place in preparation for the next brick to be laid. While this process is geological in scale and in timing, we are not only witnesses to seeing this historic landmark to the second amendment built, but also participants in its building.

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Hey Condition Three,

Finally, things are happening regarding 2A in my 50 year life. Things are happening because of many "grass roots" people who started OCing years ago. The grass roots is why we are talking about these issues and court cases today.

The lawyers who are "playing" some of you, are trying to claim responsibility for something that they did not start. The Founding members of this site are some of the original grass roots organizers for OC and this movement accross the country.

While St. John v. McColley was a tenth circuit case, it is supplying moral ammo for our movement. The people who are advocating for a "perfect" legal battlefield would have told Matthew St. John to keep his gun at home...let the big boys fix things...just be patient! Down boy, down boy, after all I graduated from Bolt Hall, or Haavard, or Yale.

Yea, so did Barry, George, Roamer, Bernanke, and Axelrod; and how is our economy doing?

The San Diego settlement would not have happened if all had "stood-down" while the big boys fixed things.

No, the grass roots leaders got us to this point with LOTS of little steps and big wins. Not every action gives good results; however, we have the law and case law on our side.

Your battle plan is not Pattonesque, it is very reminiscient of what Bradley would have created. Patton had it right, surround the enemy with artillery, then give-em hell from all sides!

markm

cato said:

Think of the fight for RKBA as siege warfare. One must prepare that battlefield by battering down walls to soften up the target, weakening the enemies defences prior to commiting troops.

Charge to soon, even with good intentions, and needless casualties and set backs can result.

Creating UOC cultural conflict before having supporting case law is like committing to open conventional warfare with a guerrilla force.

Heller and McDonald were just the seige artillary's opening salvo. Steady boys steady, H hour is comming.

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Well then consider me one man throwing a pebble at the wall but if we have many people throwing many pebbles at the wall we will bury it. Besides where do the big shots like Gura get their cases? Could it be by sorting through many little cases?

Great Job on your works!

hgreen said:

OC RESTORED at MB Hometown Fair.

And in other news, the MB PD's finest show their true colors with this press release which no one but gun supporters and a couple journalists who are writing pro-OC stories received...

http://www.southbayopencarry.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/Hometown-Fair-2010-Press-Release.doc

Related summary story: http://www.examiner.com/la-in-los-angeles/fair-backs-down-police-relegate-open-carry-to-back-of-bus

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I saw you on CBS' 11PM News and there is no link at this time.

A right unexercized is a right lost. Seems to me I read that somewhere. Even if a handgun open carry ban were enacted, that just means folks would open carry other firearms, right?

Wc said:

I saw you on CBS' 11PM News and there is no link at this time.

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Someone recorded it for us:
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1528783391381&ref=mf