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Thread: 2 officers wounded in Omaha hospital shooting: and I can't carry CCW in a hospital?

  1. #1
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    2 officers wounded in Omaha hospital shooting: and I can't carry CCW in a hospital?

    I am a law abiding citizen with not even a traffic ticket on my record. Yet I can't carry in a hospital for my personal defense. Yet the police can't even protect us from nut jobs in the story below.



    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100929/...tal_shooting_3


    By TIMBERLY ROSS, Associated Press Writer Timberly Ross, Associated Press Writer – 30 mins ago

    OMAHA, Neb. – Two officers were hit and a suspect was critically injured in a shooting at Creighton University Medical Center on Wednesday morning, Omaha police said.
    Police spokesman Jacob Bettin said the officers suffered minor wounds.
    The shooting occurred inside the hospital, Bettin said, but he would not say where. He did say investigators were interviewing several witnesses.
    Omaha television station KETV reported that witnesses said the shooting occurred in or near the cafeteria.
    The first call came in to police at 9:19 a.m., Bettin said.
    Investigators were checking to see whether the suspect was connected to an incident Tuesday night in suburban Ralston, Bettin said. Officers had searched in vain for a man who had reportedly made terrorist threats.
    MORE at link above. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100929/...tal_shooting_3
    Last edited by Bailenforcer; 09-29-2010 at 01:11 PM.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  2. #2
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
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    yes you can!!

    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

  3. #3
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Okay I have never tried to carry OC in a hospital. Now what do you think the security and hospital staff will do if I try? Around here there would be a dozen police cars in the parking lot is my guess. Petoskey is as liberal anti gun as you can't imagine despite the hunting culture.


    Quote Originally Posted by 1245A Defender View Post
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  4. #4
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
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    i AM shocked!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bailenforcer View Post
    Okay I have never tried to carry OC in a hospital. Now what do you think the security and hospital staff will do if I try? Around here there would be a dozen police cars in the parking lot is my guess. Petoskey is as liberal anti gun as you can't imagine despite the hunting culture.
    as you know im in washington state, i study your state because your laws are so convoluted.
    im surprised your guys have not been talking about this with you, i gave them time
    from your post to chime in, but nobody came. what up with that?
    you need to read and then figgure out how to understand the interaction
    between 234d and 425o, they are way! confusing.
    there have been threads about OC with a CPL in hospitals, and stainless1911
    just wrote about his hospital visit yesterday, OC with CPL.
    their are gonna be problems with folks that dont understand the law, no matter where you go.
    your town, and your LEOs are gonna have to learn and get used to lawfully armed citizens.
    it is exposure by OCers like you that get the word out.
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

  5. #5
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    most hospitals have anti firearm policies that can lawfully be enforced if oc with cpl because they are private property.

    However, Hurley Medical Center in flint is a city run institution. I would bet they would not let you past the metal detector oc, even with cpl. This is not a battle i would choose, but if so inclined, you could fight that rule and win at this particular hospital.
    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? (who will watch the watchmen?)

    I am not a lawyer. Nothing in any of posts should be construed as legal advice.

  6. #6
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    We need to fight the pistol free insanity zones. When I had a General (Pre 2004) there never was a problem. Today I need to hire an attorney to travel with me. It has become sheer stupidity.


    Quote Originally Posted by lapeer20m View Post
    most hospitals have anti firearm policies that can lawfully be enforced if oc with cpl because they are private property.

    However, Hurley Medical Center in flint is a city run institution. I would bet they would not let you past the metal detector oc, even with cpl. This is not a battle i would choose, but if so inclined, you could fight that rule and win at this particular hospital.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

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    That's one reason that when I get the chance to carry in a PFZ when I legitimately need to be there, I go there. These things need to be done, to be brought up, and discussed. If it can be done quietly, then great, just OC, keep a low profile, and when you leave, people that did contact with you, have to admit that nothing bad happened, Like the dayceare, that I'm currently working on, the hospital, the SOS, the MSP, and so on. I've been asked to leave 2 Krogers, but I can go to 3 others nearby, and there isn't blood in the streets. All of us should just keep to our manners, and OC whenever, and wherever we can. We will never win this by only preaching to the choir.

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    Most importantly, we do this to save lives.

    Maybe I'll get a medical cross put on my gun to help drive that point home.

    Last edited by stainless1911; 09-29-2010 at 11:08 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Maybe I'll get a medical cross put on my gun to help drive that point home.
    Now that is an idea!

  10. #10
    Regular Member Slave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lapeer20m View Post
    most hospitals have anti firearm policies that can lawfully be enforced if oc with cpl because they are private property.

    However, Hurley Medical Center in flint is a city run institution. I would bet they would not let you past the metal detector oc, even with cpl. This is not a battle i would choose, but if so inclined, you could fight that rule and win at this particular hospital.
    You couldn't be more incorrect.

    Hurley Medical Center is a private not for profit facility. Hurley has not received a dime from Flint, Genesee County or the State of Michigan since 1974. The only governing body to donate to Hurley is tax milages and the Feds.

    All the non insured are treated at Hurley, for free. It often operates in the red.

    Being as it may, Hurley has a very strict no firearms law, and they will most certainly stop you.

  11. #11
    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    If private and not for profit then it would not be supported by TAX millage's. Also hospitals cannot make laws only rules.

    Where do you think the FEDS get the money they pump into hurley? Oh yeah from TAXES!

    State money is the same... TAXES... Yours and my money.

    When you and I pay for it via TAXES ... no longer is it a private hospital but rather a publicly funded hospital.
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

  12. #12
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    a community hospital owned by the City of Flint, Hurley Medical Center is a teaching hospital serving Genesee, Lapeer, and Shiawassee counties in eastern Michigan. The 440-bed acute care facility is affiliated with the medical schools of Michigan State University and The University of Michigan. It provides care in areas such as cancer, mental health, rehabilitation, surgery, and women's health, and it is a regional center for pediatrics. Hurley Medical Center also offers advanced specialty care, such as trauma care, neonatal intensive care, kidney transplantation, burn medicine, and bariatric (weight loss) surgery.*To read the full description,*subscribe now.
    http://www.hoovers.com/company/Hurle...rrtfssi-1.html
    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? (who will watch the watchmen?)

    I am not a lawyer. Nothing in any of posts should be construed as legal advice.

  13. #13
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Thanks for the link, now I wonder how many Michigan Hospitals are owned by the Taxpayers like Hurley. And how many are owned by the taxpayers under pseudo corporations to hide the ownership. People may be surprised how many golf courses and country clubs that Government agencies own.


    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  14. #14
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    From hurley's own website:
    Hurley Medical Center is a publicly owned, nonprofit teaching hospital that is governed by a volunteer community board of managers. The Mayor of the City of Flint appoints members to the Hurley Board of Managers subject to the approval of the Flint City council
    http://www.hurleymc.com/?id=45&sid=1




    *


    [/quote]
    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? (who will watch the watchmen?)

    I am not a lawyer. Nothing in any of posts should be construed as legal advice.

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    Regular Member NHCGRPR45's Avatar
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    i have OC on 3 diffrent occaisions in saint john macomb hospital in warren, one time to visit my grandma, one time to take a friend to the ER and once to visit a friend who had childin for a surgery done that day that went wrong.

    the only time i was asked to disarm was when i took my friend to the ER. this is how that went.

    i took my friend in because he was in etreme pain due to an injury, while i helped him in a security police officer a P.A. 350 officer saw my gun while he was on the way out to get into the security vehicle.

    i got my friend into a wheel chair and took him in at the desk the security officer was getting my friend checked in and took a phone call. he quickly glanced at me and said "yes i see him" then hung up.

    at that time he came around the desk as the officer who went out came back in. the officer asked if i was law enforcement i said no, and he said i can't let you take your gun into the treatment are, but could secure it for me. he had me come around the desk and he opened a locked door and i saw several small lockers.

    there were 8 of them maybe 6 inches to a side and 10 inches deep. he had me place my loaded firearm in one and gave me the key to my locker. he said i was the only one with a key and don't loose it. he said i could get my firearm on the way out.

    they were very matter of fact about everything and acted like this wasn't a big deal at all for them. my friend was treated very quickly and the er visit was quite short. on my way out there was a diffrent officer and before i even asked he said

    " you guys on the way out?" i said yes sir he said then you'll need yor gun, and i went over and retrieved it, he said nice gun that a nighthawk, i said yep it is. he said well hope your friend feels better and that was it.

    it was a pretty great encounter as far as they go, and the security there does have police powers on that facillity. i would have preferred to keep my firearms but theyway they handled it was really quite acceptable.

  16. #16
    Regular Member sultan62's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NHCGRPR45 View Post
    i have OC on 3 diffrent occaisions in saint john macomb hospital in warren, one time to visit my grandma, one time to take a friend to the ER and once to visit a friend who had childin for a surgery done that day that went wrong.

    the only time i was asked to disarm was when i took my friend to the ER. this is how that went.

    i took my friend in because he was in etreme pain due to an injury, while i helped him in a security police officer a P.A. 350 officer saw my gun while he was on the way out to get into the security vehicle.

    i got my friend into a wheel chair and took him in at the desk the security officer was getting my friend checked in and took a phone call. he quickly glanced at me and said "yes i see him" then hung up.

    at that time he came around the desk as the officer who went out came back in. the officer asked if i was law enforcement i said no, and he said i can't let you take your gun into the treatment are, but could secure it for me. he had me come around the desk and he opened a locked door and i saw several small lockers.

    there were 8 of them maybe 6 inches to a side and 10 inches deep. he had me place my loaded firearm in one and gave me the key to my locker. he said i was the only one with a key and don't loose it. he said i could get my firearm on the way out.

    they were very matter of fact about everything and acted like this wasn't a big deal at all for them. my friend was treated very quickly and the er visit was quite short. on my way out there was a diffrent officer and before i even asked he said

    " you guys on the way out?" i said yes sir he said then you'll need yor gun, and i went over and retrieved it, he said nice gun that a nighthawk, i said yep it is. he said well hope your friend feels better and that was it.

    it was a pretty great encounter as far as they go, and the security there does have police powers on that facillity. i would have preferred to keep my firearms but theyway they handled it was really quite acceptable.
    It sounds like they provide decent security in the ER, and I could understand the ER itself (not the entire hospital) being treated as somewhat of a "secure zone".

  17. #17
    Regular Member NHCGRPR45's Avatar
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    well just got up to run thoght i'd check the posts!

    yes, i can see how maybe they would want an ER gun free, and the security officers are armed glock 22's but i would still prefer to keep my firearm on me. and the staff at the hospital most certainly noticed me carring there so i have no questions about whether or not i was noticed. a nurse said i couldn't have a gun in the hospital and said she was calling security, they came checked my id and left.

    i don't like the idea that someone else is responseable for my protection, its just seems irresposeable and morally wrong. how can i as a man in good condition physically, with military expierance in the infantry say, that someone else must risk there own life to protect me??

    how can anyone expect someone else to risk there life for them?

    yes we have police, and firemen and ems personell, and military. they all have jobs to do, and they do those jobs very well for the most part, but when it comes right down to it each individual must be absolutely responseable for themselves.

    know how to take care of yourself, your family, anymore than that is wishful thinking at best.

    well i went of on another tangent,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

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