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Thread: Jury Summons - King County Superior Court RJC

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    Regular Member krazichinaman's Avatar
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    Jury Summons - King County Superior Court RJC

    Team,
    I received a Jury Summons to King County Superior Court at Kent Regional Justice Center. I believe that this is a state court therefore, they must provide a lock-box for my firearm.

    I've never had to go to Jury Summons before nor have I had to check in my firearm. If you have experience with either the Jury process or checking in a firearm at Kent RJC, could you please let me know the process?

    Regards,
    Brian
    Last edited by krazichinaman; 10-03-2010 at 04:22 PM.

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    Follow the interesting/appropriate links from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury#United_States The details vary by jurisdiction.

    As a member of a jury pool of 100, I was lectured at length by the judge on the definition of felony and felon. When he asked the members of the pool that might be felons to speak privately to him, fully 80% by count of the pool of a hundred lined up. That was very educational!

    I was empaneled, even though I was an active gun rights and law and order advocate, and sat on a repeat DUI/DWI by a stereotypical used-car salesman.
    Last edited by Doug Huffman; 10-03-2010 at 04:41 PM.

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    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Huffman View Post
    Follow the interesting/appropriate links from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury#United_States The details vary by jurisdiction.

    As a member of a jury pool of 100, I was lectured at length by the judge on the definition of felony and felon. When he asked the members of the pool that might be felons to speak privately to him, fully 80% by count of the pool of a hundred lined up. That was very educational!

    I was empaneled, even though I was an active gun rights and law and order advocate, and sat on a repeat DUI/DWI by a stereotypical used-car salesman.
    Did you vote for the Death Penalty for this guy???
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

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    Regular Member krazichinaman's Avatar
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    Out of everyone here, has no one been to a Jury Duty summons?

    I am going to assume they have a security check point much like the airport. Do I approach the check point and inform them that I have a firearm that needs to be checked in?

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    Regular Member xxx.jakk.xxx's Avatar
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    I've been to a Kitsap County jury summons and it is in the courthouse, so you'd enter at the entrance with lock boxes and check in your firearm like any other courthouse trip.
    "though I walk through the valley in the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for I know that you are by my side" Psalms 23:4

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    Regular Member DEROS72's Avatar
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    Get with GoGodawgs .I believe he as been dealing with that issue although in another area I believe but has has a lot of insight on that.
    Last edited by DEROS72; 10-05-2010 at 09:00 PM.

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    I've always written in my excuse, and they let me off.
    However, in my current position, they will pay me my regular pay to go on jury duty, less the $10 per diem of the court.
    I will say I went in the Skagit County Superior courthouse the other day on other business. Since I did not see lockboxes, I asked the security person.
    Their reply was that they did not have lockboxes, had no place to put said boxes, and no plans to put any in.
    All of which is outside the law as I read it. But such is county gov't.

    Quote Originally Posted by krazichinaman View Post
    Out of everyone here, has no one been to a Jury Duty summons?

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    Regular Member 911Grunt's Avatar
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    I’ve I had several jury summons over the years and this is some of the stuff I’ve brought with me. Bring a good supply of reading material, some portable entertainment (radio, mp3 player, video games etc.), spare batteries and a headset. Don’t count on having an available wall connection till you can check out the area. Take some food and water since you’re going to be sequestered to a limited area before and after lunch (plan on the vending machines being empty, over priced or not working all together). Wear good walking shoes, I’ve never been to the RJC for jury duty, but there are lots of local restaurants about a 10 minute walk and your near the Kent Station shopping complex.
    For carrying to the RJC, all I can relate to is what I did at the County-City building in Tacoma, I had my CWP in hand and just told the Deputy that I needed to declare. I would suggest you bring your own gun box and lock since Pierce County just put my stuff in a paper bag (and gave it back to me with everything unloaded and still in the paper bag). I hope this helps, even thought it was lots of waiting with little court room time, I still enjoyed it and look forward to doing my civic duty.

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    Regular Member maclean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by krazichinaman View Post
    Out of everyone here, has no one been to a Jury Duty summons?

    I am going to assume they have a security check point much like the airport. Do I approach the check point and inform them that I have a firearm that needs to be checked in?
    I have, and even as an LEO I had to do the same thing you will.

    I announced to the screener that I needed to lock up a firearm, and they had a Deputy Sheriff walk with me to a lockbox. He looked over my ID first, and watched as I put my firearm in the box.

    I have no idea what he is going to want to see for ID, I had creds.

    I was at the downtown courthouse rather than the RJC, but they are both King County Superior courthouses. The RJC is a nicer facility, but the downtown courthouse had black metal lockboxes. The downside that bothered me was more than one gun was in any given box, which I thought would result in theft.

    I ended up being the jury foreman on a civil case, and it was a very rewarding experience.
    Last edited by maclean; 10-05-2010 at 11:46 PM.

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    Regular Member krazichinaman's Avatar
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    Thank You everyone for the information. People aren't lying when they say bring LOTS of reading material. For future reference, there are several electrical outlets that you can plug cell chargers and laptops into. Moreover, they also provide free Wifi (I was testing speeds around 7-8 mbit download and about 2 mbit up on my cell).

    When I got to Kent RJC, I informed the lady at the front of the check point that I had a firearm that I needed to lock up. She proceeded to ask a deputy to come over and escort me to the room. The room has a lock box (from what I remember about 6 units X 5 units) in a locked room. The Deputy asked to see my license so he could copy the information down onto his paperwork. He then told me to put my firearm (XD service .45 ACP) into the box and to NOT unload the weapon. I then proceeded to put in my serpa holster into the box (Must have been at least a foot deep). He left the key and paper work at the front desk inside the checkpoint.

    When I left for the day, I informed the deputies that I needed to pick up my checked firearm in box 1. They gave me a surprised look and a deputy escorted me to the room. As we were walking to the room, I asked the deputy if I needed to show ID and he said no. When we got to the room, he asked me how to spell my last name and opened the box for me. He told me to put my holster back on and to re-holster my firearm. I had to re-sign the paper work saying I received my property back.

    Throughout the whole check in/out process they were very professional and did not touch my firearm (minus the surprised look, guessing they didn't believe I was of age to have a firearm). I am a bit concerned that they did not check any ID upon getting my firearm back but asking how to spell my last name might be "their check." Glad to see Kent RJC is following the rules!

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    Quote Originally Posted by maclean View Post
    I have, and even as an LEO I had to do the same thing you will.

    I announced to the screener that I needed to lock up a firearm, and they had a Deputy Sheriff walk with me to a lockbox. He looked over my ID first, and watched as I put my firearm in the box.

    I have no idea what he is going to want to see for ID, I had creds.

    I was at the downtown courthouse rather than the RJC, but they are both King County Superior courthouses. The RJC is a nicer facility, but the downtown courthouse had black metal lockboxes. The downside that bothered me was more than one gun was in any given box, which I thought would result in theft.

    I ended up being the jury foreman on a civil case, and it was a very rewarding experience.
    Pretty sure commissioned law enforcement do not have to check a firearm to go to court, unless they are the defendant in a case.

    RCW 9.41.300

    (1) It is unlawful for any person to enter the following places when he or she knowingly possesses or knowingly has under his or her control a weapon:

    (b) Those areas in any building which are used in connection with court proceedings, including courtrooms, jury rooms, judge's chambers, offices and areas used to conduct court business, waiting areas, and corridors adjacent to areas used in connection with court proceedings. The restricted areas do not include common areas of ingress and egress to the building that is used in connection with court proceedings, when it is possible to protect court areas without restricting ingress and egress to the building. The restricted areas shall be the minimum necessary to fulfill the objective of this subsection (1)(b).

    (6) Subsection (1) of this section does not apply to:

    (a) A person engaged in military activities sponsored by the federal or state governments, while engaged in official duties;

    (b) Law enforcement personnel, except that subsection (1)(b) of this section does apply to a law enforcement officer who is present at a courthouse building as a party to an action under chapter 10.14, 10.99, or 26.50 RCW, or an action under Title 26 RCW where any party has alleged the existence of domestic violence as defined in RCW 26.50.010; or

    (c) Security personnel while engaged in official duties.

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    Regular Member trevorthebusdriver's Avatar
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    I jokingly refer to the Regional Justice Center (RJC) as the Renton Junior Collage.

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    Regular Member maclean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron1124 View Post
    Pretty sure commissioned law enforcement do not have to check a firearm to go to court, unless they are the defendant in a case.
    If I am not there on business, I have to check it.

    Procedure or policy maybe, but it is what it is. When I am on business, I have not had to do so.

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    Each and every time I went to a court house and ID myself as LE, I was asked if I was on personal or official business. Personal business had to secure the firearm in their custody. Official business not so.
    Last edited by Trigger Dr; 10-06-2010 at 11:32 PM. Reason: spellin g

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    I didn't think the RCW specifically stated whether or not the officer had to be on duty or not.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron1124 View Post
    I didn't think the RCW specifically stated whether or not the officer had to be on duty or not.
    How would you feel if you were involved in a civil action with a neighbor who just happened to be a hot head cop, and he came into court armed, knowing he would find you there?

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    Regular Member maclean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron1124 View Post
    I didn't think the RCW specifically stated whether or not the officer had to be on duty or not.
    It doesn't specify.

    The Superior Court Presiding judge made the rule, and so we follow it.

    If we are on business, the gun stays on us - in or out of uniform.

    If we are there for jury duty or as a non-LEO party to a case, it gets locked up.

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    Regular Member maclean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trigger Dr View Post
    How would you feel if you were involved in a civil action with a neighbor who just happened to be a hot head cop, and he came into court armed, knowing he would find you there?
    The presiding judge at the time expressed the concern based on "family court" issues like divorce.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron1124 View Post
    I didn't think the RCW specifically stated whether or not the officer had to be on duty or not.
    Quote Originally Posted by maclean View Post
    It doesn't specify.

    The Superior Court Presiding judge made the rule, and so we follow it.

    If we are on business, the gun stays on us - in or out of uniform.

    If we are there for jury duty or as a non-LEO party to a case, it gets locked up.
    9.41.300(1) It is unlawful for any person to enter the following places when he or she knowingly possesses or knowingly has under his or her control a weapon:
    . . .
    (b) Those areas in any building which are used in connection with court proceedings, including courtrooms, jury rooms, judge's chambers, offices and areas used to conduct court business, waiting areas, and corridors adjacent to areas used in connection with court proceedings. The restricted areas do not include common areas of ingress and egress to the building that is used in connection with court proceedings, when it is possible to protect court areas without restricting ingress and egress to the building. The restricted areas shall be the minimum necessary to fulfill the objective of this subsection (1)(b).
    . . .
    (6) Subsection (1) of this section does not apply to:
    . . .
    (b) Law enforcement personnel, except that subsection (1)(b) of this section does apply to a law enforcement officer who is present at a courthouse building as a party to an action under chapter 10.14, 10.99, or 26.50 RCW, or an action under Title 26 RCW where any party has alleged the existence of domestic violence as defined in RCW 26.50.010;
    No tyranny is so irksome as petty tyranny: The officious demands of policemen, government clerks, and electromechanical gadgets. -- Edward Abbey

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    Regular Member maclean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomas View Post
    9.41.300(1) It is unlawful for any person to enter the following places when he or she knowingly possesses or knowingly has under his or her control a weapon:
    . . .
    (b) Those areas in any building which are used in connection with court proceedings, including courtrooms, jury rooms, judge's chambers, offices and areas used to conduct court business, waiting areas, and corridors adjacent to areas used in connection with court proceedings. The restricted areas do not include common areas of ingress and egress to the building that is used in connection with court proceedings, when it is possible to protect court areas without restricting ingress and egress to the building. The restricted areas shall be the minimum necessary to fulfill the objective of this subsection (1)(b).
    . . .
    (6) Subsection (1) of this section does not apply to:
    . . .
    (b) Law enforcement personnel, except that subsection (1)(b) of this section does apply to a law enforcement officer who is present at a courthouse building as a party to an action under chapter 10.14, 10.99, or 26.50 RCW, or an action under Title 26 RCW where any party has alleged the existence of domestic violence as defined in RCW 26.50.010;
    Yup, he posted that.

    Still, if we are not party to such an action and not present on business we have to lock up - and that is the standing rule of the presiding Superior Court judge.

    The RCW is silent about duty status.
    Last edited by maclean; 10-07-2010 at 01:01 AM.

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    Last edited by Aaron1124; 10-07-2010 at 03:41 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by maclean View Post
    It doesn't specify.

    The Superior Court Presiding judge made the rule, and so we follow it.

    If we are on business, the gun stays on us - in or out of uniform.

    If we are there for jury duty or as a non-LEO party to a case, it gets locked up.
    Just out of curiosity, but does the actual judge make the rule? Or does the city/county council have a specific ordinance on it?

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    Regular Member maclean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron1124 View Post
    Just out of curiosity, but does the actual judge make the rule? Or does the city/county council have a specific ordinance on it?
    When the rule was made, it was by determination of the presiding judge in King County. I know this personally because a relative was involved in the process.

    Some judges (erroneously in my personal opinion) have held that the following part of the RCW grants them wider latitude than the RCW specifies:

    "The local judicial authority shall designate and clearly mark those areas where weapons are prohibited, and shall post notices at each entrance to the building of the prohibition against weapons in the restricted areas;"

    In any event, LEO's who want to stay employed obey the rule.
    Last edited by maclean; 10-07-2010 at 12:51 PM.

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    This is good news...this is how it should be done!

    Glad to see the RJC get it right. This is how the spirit of the law should be carried out!

    Quote Originally Posted by krazichinaman View Post
    Thank You everyone for the information. People aren't lying when they say bring LOTS of reading material. For future reference, there are several electrical outlets that you can plug cell chargers and laptops into. Moreover, they also provide free Wifi (I was testing speeds around 7-8 mbit download and about 2 mbit up on my cell).

    When I got to Kent RJC, I informed the lady at the front of the check point that I had a firearm that I needed to lock up. She proceeded to ask a deputy to come over and escort me to the room. The room has a lock box (from what I remember about 6 units X 5 units) in a locked room. The Deputy asked to see my license so he could copy the information down onto his paperwork. He then told me to put my firearm (XD service .45 ACP) into the box and to NOT unload the weapon. I then proceeded to put in my serpa holster into the box (Must have been at least a foot deep). He left the key and paper work at the front desk inside the checkpoint.

    When I left for the day, I informed the deputies that I needed to pick up my checked firearm in box 1. They gave me a surprised look and a deputy escorted me to the room. As we were walking to the room, I asked the deputy if I needed to show ID and he said no. When we got to the room, he asked me how to spell my last name and opened the box for me. He told me to put my holster back on and to re-holster my firearm. I had to re-sign the paper work saying I received my property back.

    Throughout the whole check in/out process they were very professional and did not touch my firearm (minus the surprised look, guessing they didn't believe I was of age to have a firearm). I am a bit concerned that they did not check any ID upon getting my firearm back but asking how to spell my last name might be "their check." Glad to see Kent RJC is following the rules!
    Live Free or Die!

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    Quote Originally Posted by maclean View Post
    When the rule was made, it was by determination of the presiding judge in King County. I know this personally because a relative was involved in the process.

    Some judges (erroneously in my personal opinion) have held that the following part of the RCW grants them wider latitude than the RCW specifies:

    "The local judicial authority shall designate and clearly mark those areas where weapons are prohibited, and shall post notices at each entrance to the building of the prohibition against weapons in the restricted areas;"

    In any event, LEO's who want to stay employed obey the rule.
    Can a judge, however, make a rule not allowing a private citizen to carry O.C. spray in the court room? I ask, because O.C. Spray is preempted on a state level.

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