Gene German Makes Sense on WI v. Schultz... (long post)

In his Examiner column

http://www.examiner.com/wisconsin-gun-rights-in-milwaukee/wis-stat-941-23-unconstitutional

A decent writeup!

So CCW is legal now ?????????

ckmorley said:

So CCW is legal now ?????????

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In Clark County at least. Read the other thread for Nik's take on it. http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/s...m-WIBA-news-team-quot-Also-just-a-heads-up-Pa

I had really hoped that I would not see all those misspelled words and other grammatical errors in Germans piece, It makes us as a class of people look undereducated, ignorant and of generally low intelligence when the self-proclaimed leader of carry rights in WI (who happens to be a MN resident) has such difficulty spelling common words.

genie is spelled as Jennie, Etc Etc Etc.

Gene needs to STAY in MN

What the heck is is with these guys like Gene German. Can you believe he was on Vicki McKenna today trying to take credit for this?

It ain't his arse in the sling here, rather 5 WCI members. Then we get the NRA still wanting mandated training JUST LIKE German.

I say we send ALL these "out-of-state" lobbyists back home.

Somebody go tell German "this ain't MN, we actually HAVE 'right-to-carry' already!"

Then go tell the NRA the same thing. The boat has tipped over and the ccw ban is sinking fast. These "out-of-state" groups are rushing in to make a quick buck at our expense. I say kick them out!

Wisconsin for Wisconsin, NRA and German be damned!

BTW: German's resolution idea fell FLAT ON IT'S FACE. It wasn't the NRA, or German that brought this about, it was ordinary WISCONSIN residents.

Veto The Tax said:

What the heck is is with these guys like Gene German. Can you believe he was on Vicki McKenna today trying to take credit for this?

It ain't his arse in the sling here, rather 5 WCI members. Then we get the NRA still wanting mandated training JUST LIKE German.

I say we send ALL these "out-of-state" lobbyists back home.

Somebody go tell German "this ain't MN, we actually HAVE 'right-to-carry' already!"

Then go tell the NRA the same thing. The boat has tipped over and the ccw ban is sinking fast. These "out-of-state" groups are rushing in to make a quick buck at our expense. I say kick them out!

Wisconsin for Wisconsin, NRA and German be damned!

BTW: German's resolution idea fell FLAT ON IT'S FACE. It wasn't the NRA, or German that brought this about, it was ordinary WISCONSIN residents.

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Well said, Either join our fight to repeal 941.23 or get the hell out of the way cause the freight trains a rolling.

Any "open carry movement" that started in a hotel meeting room in March 2007 must have been stillborn. The open carry movement that actually made a difference and has something to show for it-- was born with an Apgar score of 10 in a house near Burlington in April 2009.

paul@paul-fisher.com said:

In Clark County at least. Read the other thread for Nik's take on it. http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/s...m-WIBA-news-team-quot-Also-just-a-heads-up-Pa

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Not so fast, the court document reads:
STATE OF WISCONSIN
CIRCUIT COURT
CLARK COUNTY
STATE OF WISCONSIN
Plaintiff/Petitioner

That means the State of Wisconsin, it was only tried in the Clark county state court. I think this court decision could be binding throughout the state. IANAL, but I think I could be correct here. It is a state court. Granted it would be even better if it is appealed and won again. But it still has precedence.

Nutczak said:

I had really hoped that I would not see all those misspelled words and other grammatical errors in Germans piece, It makes us as a class of people look undereducated, ignorant and of generally low intelligence when the self-proclaimed leader of carry rights in WI (who happens to be a MN resident) has such difficulty spelling common words.

genie is spelled as Jennie, Etc Etc Etc.

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That is just another reason he should leave Wisconsin business to Wisconsin people.

Shotgun said:

Any "open carry movement" that started in a hotel meeting room in March 2007 must have been stillborn. The open carry movement that actually made a difference and has something to show for it-- was born with an Apgar score of 10 in a house near Burlington in April 2009.

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I was thinking the very same!

J.Gleason said:

Not so fast, the court document reads:
STATE OF WISCONSIN
CIRCUIT COURT
CLARK COUNTY
STATE OF WISCONSIN
Plaintiff/Petitioner

That means the State of Wisconsin, it was only tried in the Clark county state court. I think this court decision could be binding throughout the state. IANAL, but I think I could be correct here. It is a state court. Granted it would be even better if it is appealed and won again. But it still has precedence.

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I agree, that is why I said to look at the other thread. Nik talked to a WCI lawyer and has more details.

Nobody campaigned harder for passage of the ill fated Personal Protection Act than Gene German. He and I as well as Dick Baker and I exchanged a number of emails on the subjects of open vs concealed carry, training requirements, cost of training as well as other issues. Now he wants to disavow his participation by passing the ball to Dick Baker. Gene was just as intent in getting SB-214(2003) and SB-403 (2005) passed as anyone involved. Dick Baker as lead of WCCA was very involved and dedicated to conceal carry. As a result of all the emails I exchanged with him I got to respect his honesty and opinions even though I disagreed with his ideas. He, German, Rep Gunderson, Sen Zien, NRA and Mike Bruhn all poo-pooed my idea that Hamdan gave us the right to open carry and that the Personal Protection Act was not needed. Now Gene wants to take credit for the open carry movement? We all know that the credit belongs to nik, Hubert, Jesus, Brad, As well as many other proactive members of OCDO, those that said and say "This is my constitutional right. Get out of my face". As ccwinstructor German has been posting as a profound supporter of open carry and I applaud him for that but my recollection of things gone by don't co-incide with his words of today. If he wants to join the "movement" as an active supporter of WCI and give credit where credit is due, welcome aboard. If he wants to take the credit for the open carry movement then "get off the wagon". I still have those emails.

I don't read it as Gene taking credit. He mentions the common man as being the ones that are making this happen.

And then lets not forget that ANYONE, regardless of their level of participation helped get us to the point we are today. If the previous bills had not been put forward, supported but been vetoed and Doyle had not made his comments on OC I doubt WCI would have even been created.

WCI is the tip of the arrow but the efforts of many went into creating the shaft.

paul@paul-fisher.com said:

I agree, that is why I said to look at the other thread. WCI's lawyers believe it does apply statewide but not to get too excited until an appeal decision is made.

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I would be careful with your word choice.

If upheld on appeal one of our attorneys believes it is a broad strikedown of the CCW statute that would be applicable statewide.

RIGHT NOW, I don't think anyone anywhere else in the state should be hanging their hat on this decision and CC'ing.

Fortunately for Clark County, they have only 1 circuit court judge, so this judge is teh ONLY judge that will hear a CCW case in Clark County and it seems logical you can expect the same ruling if you carry concealed in clark county and get charged.

Wisconsin Carry said:

I would be careful with your word choice.

If upheld on appeal one of our attorneys believes it is a broad strikedown of the CCW statute that would be applicable statewide.

RIGHT NOW, I don't think anyone anywhere else in the state should be hanging their hat on this decision and CC'ing.

Fortunately for Clark County, they have only 1 circuit court judge, so this judge is teh ONLY judge that will hear a CCW case in Clark County and it seems logical you can expect the same ruling if you carry concealed in clark county and get charged.

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I will edit my post. What I had said in some other posts was that they should go read your response in the other thread.

paul@paul-fisher.com said:

I will edit my post. What I had said in some other posts was that they should go read your response in the other thread.

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Nope I still believe that this case has precedence state wide. It is a state court and the judges decision can influence other cases in other counties as well.

J.Gleason said:

Nope I still believe that this case has precedence state wide. It is a state court and the judges decision can influence other cases in other counties as well.

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So you know more than the WCI attorney I guess?

I'm not exactly sure but I believe that the different districts within Wisconsin are kind of like the different districts in the federal courts.

J is right that another court in wisconsin could look at this decision but they also could come up with a completely different opinion. At that point, with conflicting opinions at the district level, it would be up to the Wisconsin supreme court to resolve the conflict.

As an example, remember that for a while in California and the rest of the states in that district, via Nordyke v. King, the second amendment was applied. This was before McDonald and before the case was to be reheard en blanc. If this wouldn't have happened it would have created a conflict between the federal districts, causing the supreme court to need to take care of the mess.

comp45acp said:

So you know more than the WCI attorney I guess?

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hmmmm, never know

By the way, does a law degree mean that you are always right?