farkles
Regular Member
To qualify this and make it "on topic" if I get screwed on this I will always HAVE to OC and will not be "allowed" to go into restaurants serving alcohol etc... : ' )
I went to renew my CHP in Guilford County this morning. I have become more interested with civil disobedience while following laws and statutes, but not "rules, feelings or opinions" of LEOs etc....
They had a million forms for me to fill out for the renewal and all of them but one listed a NC Statute that required me to fill them out in order to get my CHP processed.
One of them mentioned "Name; Social Security Number; Employer name and number; Spouse name, address and number; Nearest relative's name, address, and phone number."
This was a manually computer drawn up form, with NO statute listed that required this. To tell you up front, I DID RECORD THE FOLLOWING CONVERSATIONS (although I think audio quality was not great). I did not fill out employer name and number, spouse name address and number or nearest relatives name address or phone number. The lady told me I had to fill it out blah blah blah. She said I would raise a "flag" in the system if I didn't fill them out. I asked if they were legally required, she said yes. I told her to my knowledge nowhere in the statutes was this info required, she disagreed.
I spoke to her supervisor who said the same things and said that as long as I don't have anything to hide (same as police trying to breach your 4A by searching your car etc) I should just provide the info. I told them I did not feel comfortable giving out other people's information without their permission. She then told me she would process it but it might take longer than 90 days. I then told her it can't by law and they need to process it like any other application. She took my $75 and I walked out the door.
She ran after me and said her Captain just got in and I could speak to him. He came out with a very intimidating attitude toward me. He was very pissed off for being the beginning of his shift. He said that although that page is not required by statutes, the Sheriff requires that info and he will not issue the permit without that info.
I mentioned that NC is a Shall Issue state and he does not have the authority to do that. He must issue the permit within the required time period if I meet STATUTORY requirements. He said the Sheriff has the right to require any additional info or forms he sees fit (I CALL B.S.!). He said that they would not issue my permit if I don't give them the info.
READ:
http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/enactedlegislation/statutes/html/bychapter/chapter_14.html § 14‑415.12. Criteria to qualify for the issuance of a permit through § 14‑415.16. Renewal of permit
I was running late for work so I asked "if I walk out of here and don't give you this information, WHO will be the responsible person for delaying or denying my permit; are you going to throw it away?"... HE SAID YES!!
Then he later denied he said he would throw it away (I have it on TAPE), but did say it would delay and would take longer than 90 days and they still would likely deny my app. I got County attorney's name and number to call later. While I was typing this the Captain called me and said he spoke to the County attorney and I AM REQUIRED to provide that info along with my SSN (even though on the sheet it says I am not required to provide it). Captain Bruce read out the statute stating that the Sheriff can require all this info I left out to conduct a background investigation on me. Since he claimed he read it from the statutes, and said it is required by law, I provided it to him> Now that I am looking back, it appears to me he BS'ed me and I don't see that listed anywhere in statutes.
Captain Bruce said that he had my Forsyth County application from 5 years ago and was just going to take all my person info off of that application, including my SSN. Something is WRONG here!
So pissed right now and trying to figure out what to do. Can you guys please help me dig further for any personal experiences or case law like this? I want to know what to do when calling County attorney.
THANKS guys and gals for any help you can give me!
I went to renew my CHP in Guilford County this morning. I have become more interested with civil disobedience while following laws and statutes, but not "rules, feelings or opinions" of LEOs etc....
They had a million forms for me to fill out for the renewal and all of them but one listed a NC Statute that required me to fill them out in order to get my CHP processed.
One of them mentioned "Name; Social Security Number; Employer name and number; Spouse name, address and number; Nearest relative's name, address, and phone number."
This was a manually computer drawn up form, with NO statute listed that required this. To tell you up front, I DID RECORD THE FOLLOWING CONVERSATIONS (although I think audio quality was not great). I did not fill out employer name and number, spouse name address and number or nearest relatives name address or phone number. The lady told me I had to fill it out blah blah blah. She said I would raise a "flag" in the system if I didn't fill them out. I asked if they were legally required, she said yes. I told her to my knowledge nowhere in the statutes was this info required, she disagreed.
I spoke to her supervisor who said the same things and said that as long as I don't have anything to hide (same as police trying to breach your 4A by searching your car etc) I should just provide the info. I told them I did not feel comfortable giving out other people's information without their permission. She then told me she would process it but it might take longer than 90 days. I then told her it can't by law and they need to process it like any other application. She took my $75 and I walked out the door.
She ran after me and said her Captain just got in and I could speak to him. He came out with a very intimidating attitude toward me. He was very pissed off for being the beginning of his shift. He said that although that page is not required by statutes, the Sheriff requires that info and he will not issue the permit without that info.
I mentioned that NC is a Shall Issue state and he does not have the authority to do that. He must issue the permit within the required time period if I meet STATUTORY requirements. He said the Sheriff has the right to require any additional info or forms he sees fit (I CALL B.S.!). He said that they would not issue my permit if I don't give them the info.
READ:
http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/enactedlegislation/statutes/html/bychapter/chapter_14.html § 14‑415.12. Criteria to qualify for the issuance of a permit through § 14‑415.16. Renewal of permit
I was running late for work so I asked "if I walk out of here and don't give you this information, WHO will be the responsible person for delaying or denying my permit; are you going to throw it away?"... HE SAID YES!!
Then he later denied he said he would throw it away (I have it on TAPE), but did say it would delay and would take longer than 90 days and they still would likely deny my app. I got County attorney's name and number to call later. While I was typing this the Captain called me and said he spoke to the County attorney and I AM REQUIRED to provide that info along with my SSN (even though on the sheet it says I am not required to provide it). Captain Bruce read out the statute stating that the Sheriff can require all this info I left out to conduct a background investigation on me. Since he claimed he read it from the statutes, and said it is required by law, I provided it to him> Now that I am looking back, it appears to me he BS'ed me and I don't see that listed anywhere in statutes.
Captain Bruce said that he had my Forsyth County application from 5 years ago and was just going to take all my person info off of that application, including my SSN. Something is WRONG here!
So pissed right now and trying to figure out what to do. Can you guys please help me dig further for any personal experiences or case law like this? I want to know what to do when calling County attorney.
THANKS guys and gals for any help you can give me!