Detroit homeowner shoots at suspected power thieves and gets arrested himself

Ignorance is curable with education and or training.

Stupidity is terminal.

hamaneggs said:

You cannot by any way of training prevent stupidity!

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everything that has been said is all that needs to be said. close this thread.

NHCGRPR45 said:

everything that has been said is all that needs to be said. close this thread.

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Not true.

I didn't get the last word.

You may now close the thread. :dude:

If you start your own site you can close threads.... Otherwise you are not unlike the rest of us powerless...

NHCGRPR45 said:

everything that has been said is all that needs to be said. close this thread.

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Bailenforcer said:

If you start your own site you can close threads.... Otherwise you are not unlike the rest of us powerless...

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so the home owner who shot at the power ranger needs some remedial training on marksmanship, at that range its tragic he missed so badly, (a leg wound? really?) and a refresher course on who and what you can legally shoot at in MI. me personally, well i agree with another member here about maybe getting some pop corn and a good lawn chair and watched the show, and have my rifle next to me so when the power ranger decided to morph back into my yard. at that point i could have held him for police. no shots fired.

now can we close this thread?? pretty please with sugar on top????

budlight said:

Neighbors who heard the shots say it's a dangerous neighborhood, but you can't take the law into your own hands. Police say they expect charges against the suspect and the 48-year-old man who shot him.

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Hunting Mama said:

I am sorry, but if you notice that someone is up on the pole stealing power, quietly call the cops and watch and wait.

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NHCGRPR45 said:

at that point i could have held him for police. no shots fired.

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Did we all miss the part about this being in Detroit? When are the police coming? Not when you call them! Thats for sure. I can almost guarantee that the paramedics, came, picked up the suspect, left, and SEVERAL hours went by, before a police officer knocked on the door of the "victim". And instead of STFU, he told the cop what happened and was arrested. Welcome to DETROIT boys and girls. The residents know it is absolutely pointless to call the police for an EMERGENCY, the only reason you call 911 in the city is, 1 - You need an Ambulance, 2 - A Fire Truck, 3 - A Police Report filled out a few hours (sometimes days, yes I am serious) later, 4 - You already have someone in cuffs, and don't mind spending some quality time with them until an officer comes and picks them up.

•(8) KEEP IT ON-TOPIC: All gun rights discussions not directly related to open carry should take place in the "General Discussions" forum and topics that are not related to gun rights at all should take place in "The Lounge". Please police your own posts before posting them and help keep OCDO strong and focused.

I'm pretty sure that holding someone for police will get you into trouble. We don't have powers of arrest. They will prolly llook the other way if you catch a molester or rapist, but not a power ranger.

T Vance said:

•(8) KEEP IT ON-TOPIC: All gun rights discussions not directly related to open carry should take place in the "General Discussions" forum and topics that are not related to gun rights at all should take place in "The Lounge". Please police your own posts before posting them and help keep OCDO strong and focused.

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Get a little trigger-happy on that one tonight?

sst0185 said:

+1 To that, would have got an adult beverage and watched the potential fireworks.

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Gotta drink 'em quick. The power guys won't be by until in the morning if you're lucky.

stainless1911 said:

I'm pretty sure that holding someone for police will get you into trouble. We don't have powers of arrest. They will prolly llook the other way if you catch a molester or rapist, but not a power ranger.

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Depends on how and why you are holding them. As a citizen you have the right to effect a 'citizens arrest' and you can in fact hold a person until police can be brought to the scene. IANAL but I'm pretty sure you are also allowed to transport a person to the police station for them to take custody.

The reason this power is not often used is because the citizen can be charged with wrongful arrest, kidnapping, etc and get their pants sued off later. Holding a person for police is not uncommon, however. I have seen people grab a mugger and hold him down until police were able to respond (took about 20 mins) and in rural country where cops sometimes cannot respond for upwards of an hour it is not uncommon (so I'm told) for people to transport themselves to the hospital (as an ambulance would take way too long), and once in a blue moon drive up to the police station with a housebreaker tied up in the flatbed of their truck.

I've heard tale, but never personally seen that last one. If anyone can coroborate or not I'd appriciate it.

stainless1911 said:

I'm pretty sure that holding someone for police will get you into trouble. We don't have powers of arrest. They will prolly llook the other way if you catch a molester or rapist, but not a power ranger.

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i think i could pull it off,

lets look at the supposed facts...

there is/are a guy/guys up a power pole they are not power workers and i am fairly certain they have a plan of nefarious deeds afoot!! the only way for infiltratration/exfiltration is my fenced backyard, then i would.......:idea:

1. arm myself, if i am already not armed:uhoh:
2. call 911 while i have direct observation of said nefarious evil doers
3. get a NON-ALCOHOLIC carbonated beverage, or a nice ice tea (remember your armed!):exclaim:
4. grab a seat whilst staying appraised of said perpertrators location and actions
5. when they come down and set foot in my yard, ask them nicely to lay down and not move, advise them that police are on the way to escort them to a nice well secured hotel with plenty of security and 3 meals a day, free health care and lovely friends of like mind:banana:. i would also assure them they will be well protected until the police show up.:idea:

remember they are not "on" my property until they set foot on my property, they are on the power companies property. :exclaim:


the fact you can't actually detain someone is something to think about but look at it like this. if you tell someone to not leave and they stay on there own accord, and assume they aren't free to go, when in fact they could just walk away, well then IMO there assumptions are not my problem.. hmm some group of people already do this,,,wonder who they might be???

kinda like if someone sees me OC'ing and assumes i am a cop, i am not responseable for anothers assumptions or fears...hmmmm

you still couldn't shoot him/them unless they actually attacked you. just thought i'd drop that in there.....

Lol. I do try to stick to the above mentioned assumption method of detainment.

So. Two men trespass into your backyard. Vandalize your property(the report said the power was flickering, which means surges which can and will damage/destroy every electronic hooked up to the power in your home). Threaten your property with fire(shorts at the pole and in the house caused by the bad behavior can cause an electrical fire). And you lot will just sit back, grab a beer and watch it all happen?

Seriously. What these guys were doing wasn't so harmless as to just be stealing power from the power company. They were in the guy's backyard, vandalizing his property and threatening his house. Have you guys ever seen a transformer explode? I have, I've seen it many times. When they explode they can cause fires or worse. When I lived in Austin, we had a horrible transformer that would blow every other week(only slight exaggeration). And everytime it would fire some sort of grenade like projectile that would explode on impact. Fortunately it was never anything more than a great show. No one was injured, no property was damaged and no fires were started. Now think about would could possibly happen if these idiots had overloaded the transformer it fired that thing into his house or hit someone.

Yes, the thieves were morons and would have probably gotten themselves killed. But they weren't just putting themselves in danger, they were endangering everyone around them.

Now I'm not saying that he was right to shoot on sight, I'm saying you shouldn't be so quick to judge. If you saw someone fiddling with a bomb in your backyard, would you grab a beer and watch the fireworks or would you grab a gun and defend your property? Same thing here, just that the bomb happened to be electrical.

stainless1911 said:

I'm pretty sure that holding someone for police will get you into trouble. We don't have powers of arrest. They will prolly llook the other way if you catch a molester or rapist, but not a power ranger.

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Actually you do have powers to arrest.

(I am not sure if stealing power is a felony in Michigan)

M.C.L. 764.16 Arrest by private person; situations.
Sec. 16.
A private person may make an arrest—in the following situations:
(a) For a felony committed in the private person's presence.
(b) If the person to be arrested has committed a felony although not in the private person's presence.
(c) If the private person is summoned by a peace officer to assist the officer in making an arrest.
(d) If the private person is a merchant, an agent of a merchant, an employee of a merchant, or an independent contractor providing security for a merchant of a store and has reasonable cause to believe that the person to be arrested has violated section 356c or 356d of the Michigan penal code, Act No. 328 of the Public Acts of 1931, being sections 750.356c and 750.356d of the Michigan Compiled Laws, in that store, regardless of whether the violation was committed in the presence of the private person.


764.20 Arrest; private persons, duty.
Sec. 20.
A private person, before making an arrest, shall inform the person to be arrested of the intention to arrest him and the cause of the arrest, except when he is then engaged in the commission of a criminal offense, or if he flees or forcibly resists arrest before the person making the arrest has opportunity so to inform him.




764.14 Arrest by private person; disposition of arrested person; complaint.
Sec. 14.
A private person who has made an arrest shall without unnecessary delay deliver the person arrested to a peace officer, who shall without unnecessary delay take that person before a magistrate of the judicial district in which the offense is charged to have been committed. The peace officer or private person shall present to the magistrate a complaint stating the charge against the person arrested.






http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(ct...leg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-764-16

cmdr_iceman71 said:

While I understand the man in this scenario used a rifle; it goes to show that this is one of those huge distinctions between those who possess a handgun license and those who possess a CPL. Anyone who has a CPL license would’ve known you cannot use lethal force to protect property. The only way this would’ve been even a remotely clean shooting is if he’d caught the men inside his home and not merely on his property.

He makes all of us lawful gun owner's look like trigger-happy yahoos.

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speak for your own locality.

He is.

Jack House said:

So. Two men trespass into your backyard. Vandalize your property(the report said the power was flickering, which means surges which can and will damage/destroy every electronic hooked up to the power in your home). Threaten your property with fire(shorts at the pole and in the house caused by the bad behavior can cause an electrical fire). And you lot will just sit back, grab a beer and watch it all happen?

Seriously. What these guys were doing wasn't so harmless as to just be stealing power from the power company. They were in the guy's backyard, vandalizing his property and threatening his house. Have you guys ever seen a transformer explode? I have, I've seen it many times. When they explode they can cause fires or worse. When I lived in Austin, we had a horrible transformer that would blow every other week(only slight exaggeration). And everytime it would fire some sort of grenade like projectile that would explode on impact. Fortunately it was never anything more than a great show. No one was injured, no property was damaged and no fires were started. Now think about would could possibly happen if these idiots had overloaded the transformer it fired that thing into his house or hit someone.

Yes, the thieves were morons and would have probably gotten themselves killed. But they weren't just putting themselves in danger, they were endangering everyone around them.

Now I'm not saying that he was right to shoot on sight, I'm saying you shouldn't be so quick to judge. If you saw someone fiddling with a bomb in your backyard, would you grab a beer and watch the fireworks or would you grab a gun and defend your property? Same thing here, just that the bomb happened to be electrical.

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yup, pretty much on target. unless the guy in my back yard threw the bomb at me i couldn't shoot him. mi law says we can't defend property with lethal force. :cuss:

sucks yes, but thats what we got!

i however agree that a person should be able to defend self and home!

cmdr_iceman71 said:

While I understand the man in this scenario used a rifle; it goes to show that this is one of those huge distinctions between those who possess a handgun license and those who possess a CPL. Anyone who has a CPL license would’ve known you cannot use lethal force to protect property. The only way this would’ve been even a remotely clean shooting is if he’d caught the men inside his home and not merely on his property.

He makes all of us lawful gun owner's look like trigger-happy yahoos.

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I flatly reject that. He was well within his rights, at least by the standards we have in Texas. Perhaps if Michigan law wasn't so favorable to criminals, there would be a lot less of them.

PrayingForWar said:

I flatly reject that. He was well within his rights, at least by the standards we have in Texas. Perhaps if Michigan law wasn't so favorable to criminals, there would be a lot less of them.

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+1 you'll get no argument from me there.