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Thread: Consequences of Carrying at Work

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    Regular Member cbpeck's Avatar
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    Consequences of Carrying at Work

    I've read many of the threads on here about people who carry to/from work and the consensus seems to be that most people leave their gun locked in their car, but I have a different question.

    If I were to knowingly violate an employer's "No Weapons" policy by CCing in the workplace and the boss found out about it, what is likely to happen? Would I simply be fired for breaking company policy or could I face legal charges?

    My suspicion is that the strongest legal charge I could face would be criminal trespass. Is this correct? I do not work in any of the locations where carrying is prohibited by the RCWs (not too far removed, though).

    Also, it goes without saying that if you're CCing correctly then nobody will ever know. I do CC correctly each & every time I choose to carry, but I'd still like an answer to the "what if?"

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    Regular Member xxx.jakk.xxx's Avatar
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    They wouldn't have any charges to file and the worst thing would just be firing without any chance of getting unemployment since you were fired for violating company policy. At least that's what it would be at my work. You just have to weigh the options. CC and risk being fired or don't carry and risk having to wait on the police for any incident. I know that if I had a more concealable gun I'd be CCing to work.

    Oh well, I've already asked for an ASP for christmas since people seem hellbent on buying me stuff, so that should work for work unless they have a problem with it, too.
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    If...

    The very ground will start to shake and then split apart. Belial will rise from the ground and swallow you whole dragging you down into his inferno like underworld of constant torment.

    Or you will prolly just get either a counseling or fired. I HIGHLY doubt you would be brought up on any charges. Even criminal trespass, ESPECIALLY if you need a badge to work there (or have one anyways). I think it would be pretty hard for them to prove you were trespassing if you had their permission slip attached to your shirt.... Or the fact that you can PROVE that they are PAYING you to be there...Kinda negates the whole trespassing thing I would imagine....

    Just my $.02 though
    Last edited by devildoc5; 10-21-2010 at 01:20 PM.
    "And shepherds we shall be, for Thee, my Lord, for Thee.
    Power hath descended forth from Thy hand, that our feet may swiftly carry out Thy command.
    So we shall flow a river forth to Thee and teeming with souls shall it ever be.
    E nomine Patri, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti."


    "If the rest of the world says: 'War,' I can only say: 'Very well. I do not want war, but no one, however peaceable, can live in peace if his neighbor intends to force a quarrel.'" - Adolf Hitler...

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    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by devildoc5 View Post
    The very ground will start to shake and then split apart. Belial will rise from the ground and swallow you whole dragging you down into his inferno like underworld of constant torment.

    Or you will prolly just get either a counseling or fired. I HIGHLY doubt you would be brought up on any charges. Even criminal trespass, ESPECIALLY if you need a badge to work there (or have one anyways). I think it would be pretty hard for them to prove you were trespassing if you had their permission slip attached to your shirt.... Or the fact that you can PROVE that they are PAYING you to be there...Kinda negates the whole trespassing thing I would imagine....

    Just my $.02 though
    +1

    To fit the legal definition of "trespassing," doesn't one have to be previously asked to leave, and then refuse or return after being warned?

    And yes, back to the OP... no you wouldn't face charges, you'd just get fired.

    Now someone with deep enough pockets in such a situation would be a great test case for "self defense as a civil right."
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

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    Regular Member xxx.jakk.xxx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalhead47 View Post
    +1

    To fit the legal definition of "trespassing," doesn't one have to be previously asked to leave, and then refuse or return after being warned?

    And yes, back to the OP... no you wouldn't face charges, you'd just get fired.

    Now someone with deep enough pockets in such a situation would be a great test case for "self defense as a civil right."
    I'd like to know how an Employer reacts when an employee flat out tells them that they WILL be CCing because they've had their life threatened, have a stalker, been assaulted or the like. I wonder if they'd fire you because you're protecting yourself from a very real danger or if they'd allow you to because of the circumstances.
    Last edited by xxx.jakk.xxx; 10-21-2010 at 01:30 PM.
    "though I walk through the valley in the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for I know that you are by my side" Psalms 23:4

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    Quote Originally Posted by xxx.jakk.xxx View Post
    I'd like to know how an Employer reacts when an employee flat out tells them that they WILL be CCing because they've had their life threatened, have a stalker, been assaulted or the like. I wonder if they'd fire you because you're protecting yourself from a very real danger or if they'd allow you to because of the circumstances.

    I think it would be dependant on the employeer and what kind of person/company they are.
    "And shepherds we shall be, for Thee, my Lord, for Thee.
    Power hath descended forth from Thy hand, that our feet may swiftly carry out Thy command.
    So we shall flow a river forth to Thee and teeming with souls shall it ever be.
    E nomine Patri, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti."


    "If the rest of the world says: 'War,' I can only say: 'Very well. I do not want war, but no one, however peaceable, can live in peace if his neighbor intends to force a quarrel.'" - Adolf Hitler...

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    Regular Member cbpeck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalhead47 View Post
    Now someone with deep enough pockets in such a situation would be a great test case for "self defense as a civil right."
    Too bad my pockets aren't that deep.

    I'm probably safer than most while at work because there are locked doors between the front entrance and my office that require a staff member to let a guest or client in, but we don't search our visitors, so you just never know. And that's precisely why we all like to carry.

    Thanks for your responses.

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    Regular Member cbpeck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xxx.jakk.xxx View Post
    I'd like to know how an Employer reacts when an employee flat out tells them that they WILL be CCing because they've had their life threatened, have a stalker, been assaulted or the like. I wonder if they'd fire you because you're protecting yourself from a very real danger or if they'd allow you to because of the circumstances.
    This is very close to my current situation, and is part of what compelled me to ask the question. I've only worked for my employer for a few months, however, so I think their response would be to greet me with security/LEO at the door on the following business day.

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    Regular Member xxx.jakk.xxx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbpeck View Post
    This is very close to my current situation, and is part of what compelled me to ask the question. I've only worked for my employer for a few months, however, so I think their response would be to greet me with security/LEO at the door on the following business day.
    Yeah, probably better off just CCing without them knowing then.
    "though I walk through the valley in the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for I know that you are by my side" Psalms 23:4

    "Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power." Benjamin Franklin

    “It’s always open season on criminals in Mason County, and there’s no bag limit.” Sen. Tim Sheldon (D)

    Molōn labe!

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    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by devildoc5 View Post
    I think it would be dependant on the employeer and what kind of person/company they are.
    Hmm, interesting line of thought, that... would an employer at that point (or at ANY point for that matter) then have legal grounds to search your person, or terminate you for refusing a "voluntary" search.... or might they, at that point, assume legal responsibility for your safety? Say if you provided copies of the police report & restraining order against said stalker, other evidence, etc... Probably enough to make their legal department vurp.

    Quote Originally Posted by cbpeck View Post
    Too bad my pockets aren't that deep.

    I'm probably safer than most while at work because there are locked doors between the front entrance and my office that require a staff member to let a guest or client in, but we don't search our visitors, so you just never know. And that's precisely why we all like to carry.

    Thanks for your responses.
    ... a whole friggin' military base filled with the best soldiers in the world still couldn't stop that fruit at Ft Hood....
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalhead47 View Post
    Hmm, interesting line of thought, that... would an employer at that point (or at ANY point for that matter) then have legal grounds to search your person, or terminate you for refusing a "voluntary" search.... or might they, at that point, assume legal responsibility for your safety? Say if you provided copies of the police report & restraining order against said stalker, other evidence, etc... Probably enough to make their legal department vurp.



    ... a whole friggin' military base filled with the best soldiers in the world still couldn't stop that fruit at Ft Hood....

    Hey Hey Hey...The couldn't have been the best in the world...the were...ARMY after all....

    I'll give you second best but....Devil Dogs are "First to fight, last to leave"
    "And shepherds we shall be, for Thee, my Lord, for Thee.
    Power hath descended forth from Thy hand, that our feet may swiftly carry out Thy command.
    So we shall flow a river forth to Thee and teeming with souls shall it ever be.
    E nomine Patri, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti."


    "If the rest of the world says: 'War,' I can only say: 'Very well. I do not want war, but no one, however peaceable, can live in peace if his neighbor intends to force a quarrel.'" - Adolf Hitler...

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    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by devildoc5 View Post
    Hey Hey Hey...The couldn't have been the best in the world...the were...ARMY after all....

    I'll give you second best but....Devil Dogs are "First to fight, last to leave"
    there are soldiers... and then there are Marines. Name:  icon_mrgreen.gif
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    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

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    very good point. Guessed I missed the soldier comment in the first one. Damn lack of sleep!
    "And shepherds we shall be, for Thee, my Lord, for Thee.
    Power hath descended forth from Thy hand, that our feet may swiftly carry out Thy command.
    So we shall flow a river forth to Thee and teeming with souls shall it ever be.
    E nomine Patri, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti."


    "If the rest of the world says: 'War,' I can only say: 'Very well. I do not want war, but no one, however peaceable, can live in peace if his neighbor intends to force a quarrel.'" - Adolf Hitler...

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    Quote Originally Posted by xxx.jakk.xxx View Post
    I'd like to know how an Employer reacts when an employee flat out tells them that they WILL be CCing because they've had their life threatened, have a stalker, been assaulted or the like. I wonder if they'd fire you because you're protecting yourself from a very real danger or if they'd allow you to because of the circumstances.
    I would guess many employers would fire the employee, not only because of the employees refusal to abide by the rules set by the employer, but also because of the added danger that comes from employing someone with a stalker. I seriously doubt that many would say, "Oh, you're violating my policy, but that's okay because there is someone out there who is specifically targeting you, and might come attack you at work."

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    Regular Member cbpeck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by olypendrew View Post
    I would guess many employers would fire the employee, not only because of the employees refusal to abide by the rules set by the employer, but also because of the added danger that comes from employing someone with a stalker. I seriously doubt that many would say, "Oh, you're violating my policy, but that's okay because there is someone out there who is specifically targeting you, and might come attack you at work."
    My situation doesn't involve a stalker. I work in the mental health field with clients who have state medical coupons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cbpeck View Post
    ...but I'd still like an answer to the "what if?"
    I think this is going to be the closest "answer" you're going to get short of someone on this site getting the boot.

    I won't disclose the place of employment, but we have a no weapons policy that someone had violated sometime last year I believe. An avid hunter had left his rifle(s) in their car and I guess someone found out about it even though they were secured in their cases and in the trunk out of view. A short time after he had arrived he was greeted by his manager and two armed security guards (yes, we have armed guards where I work). Even though he was parked outside of the secure fenced area, the usual employee parking lots are still considered company property and he was fired on the spot and escorted from the premises. No, my employer does not fall under federal jurisdiction or any other prohibited locations where one couldn't otherwise legally carry, and no this was not me but rather a business associate with whom I had ties with. Last I heard, there was no other legal recourse, just a loss of his job.

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    Quote Originally Posted by devildoc5 View Post
    Hey Hey Hey...The couldn't have been the best in the world...the were...ARMY after all....

    I'll give you second best but....Devil Dogs are "First to fight, last to leave"
    I love that most Marine MCWP's come from Army FM's.

    This comment reminds me of Fallujah.

    1 SF operative is worth 50 marines?

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    Personal responsibility is a facade created by religious people in particular...
    On "Personal Responsibility just after the previous, in the same exact thread.
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    Regular Member cbpeck's Avatar
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    So we can be vigilant about carrying everywhere we go other than our place of employment. Unfortunately for many of us, our place of employment is where we spend the majority of our waking hours. Frustrating.

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    What if you work at a school :P

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    Regular Member xxx.jakk.xxx's Avatar
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    I am not looking forward to the Spring/ Summer time when I finally get the Credit/ Money to buy a motorcycle. I'll be carrying while on it and I can't exactly secure it within the vehicle, so it'll have to stay on me. I may have to contact my local HR person and see about enacting rules allowing me to store it on the property if it's secure. Or just keep it locked in my bag and not allow any searches...



    Quote Originally Posted by antispam540 View Post
    What if you work at a school :P
    I guess there's a law concerning that one. =p
    "though I walk through the valley in the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for I know that you are by my side" Psalms 23:4

    "Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power." Benjamin Franklin

    “It’s always open season on criminals in Mason County, and there’s no bag limit.” Sen. Tim Sheldon (D)

    Molōn labe!

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    Regular Member cbpeck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by antispam540 View Post
    What if you work at a school :P
    Its funny you say that... I just re-read the WA Gun Rights pamphlet twice and can't find the section pertaining to carrying a gun on school campuses. Did the law change, or did it get edited out of the pamphlet? What happened?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cbpeck View Post
    Its funny you say that... I just re-read the WA Gun Rights pamphlet twice and can't find the section pertaining to carrying a gun on school campuses.
    Seems to be well covered over in this thread:

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...1.280-3%28e%29

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    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xxx.jakk.xxx View Post
    I am not looking forward to the Spring/ Summer time when I finally get the Credit/ Money to buy a motorcycle. I'll be carrying while on it and I can't exactly secure it within the vehicle, so it'll have to stay on me.
    Bring it to me. I will install a lockbox in such a way that only the Good Lord Himself will get it off without a key (and even He'll have to work at it Name:  icon_mrgreen.gif
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbpeck View Post
    So we can be vigilant about carrying everywhere we go other than our place of employment. Unfortunately for many of us, our place of employment is where we spend the majority of our waking hours. Frustrating.
    You said it brother.


    I think next year, someone on here is going to try to get legislation introduced similar to what passed in OK a little while back, that prevents employers from prohibiting employees from storing weapons in their personal vehicles on company property, and also releases the employer from any liability.
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

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    Regular Member xxx.jakk.xxx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalhead47 View Post
    Bring it to me. I will install a lockbox in such a way that only the Good Lord Himself will get it off without a key (and even He'll have to work at it Name:  icon_mrgreen.gif
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    I may take you up on that. it will have to not compromise the look of the bike, though. You don't get a Sport Bike without considering the looks and a big box on it would definitely take away from that.
    "though I walk through the valley in the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for I know that you are by my side" Psalms 23:4

    "Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power." Benjamin Franklin

    “It’s always open season on criminals in Mason County, and there’s no bag limit.” Sen. Tim Sheldon (D)

    Molōn labe!

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    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xxx.jakk.xxx View Post
    I may take you up on that. it will have to not compromise the look of the bike, though. You don't get a Sport Bike without considering the looks and a big box on it would definitely take away from that.
    OK let me rephrase... bring me a bike that has enough room for a box in the first place Trouble with a sport bike is, any large man can just pick the whole thing up & put it in the back of a truck.
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

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