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Thread: Open Carry Manual - Living Document

  1. #1
    kittyhawk63
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    Help us to create an Open Carry Manual

    State Open Carry Manual
    I haven't seen one yet, but is there someone who has taken on the awesome task of making a "printable" Microsoft Word, or WordPerfect, or Open Office (OOo) manual with all the relevant state laws that apply to Open Carry in Kowlaforeignya? (California)

    If there is, where can it be found? If not available, read on.

    Living Document
    In the "Title" above, I call it a living document because it will need to be updated as laws change.

    County Open Carry Manuals:
    It would also be of great use if some person (or people) would contribute all the relevant laws (in manual style) that apply to Open Carry from their own county to this project. This person (or people) would hopefully keep the manual up-to-date.

    Local Ordinances:
    We may need added addendums to specific County Manuals for any local ordinances that add to or differ from county and state laws.

    Reasons for These OC Manuals:
    1. someone doesn't know how to go about finding all the laws
    2. someone doesn't have the time to find all the laws
    3. someone is confused about some of the laws and how they apply
    4. someone is needing to know a law for their defense
    5. people need a manual which they can study and stay up on the laws

    Reasons for a Living Document:
    People need a manual that they can have up-to-date laws that affect Open Carry (OP) and/or Carry Concealed Weapon (CCW).

    Availability:
    Make these manuals available for downloading and printing.

    Videos:
    It would also be good to have a list of links at the back of the manual to really good and relevant videos on the Internet depicting OCing and the situations that may arise when approached by a law enforcement officer or officers (LEO).

    Edit: Yes, I know there are many places that one can find different laws discussed or listed and many videos on the Internet. I am talking about having a compilation of "all" laws that are currently on the books for OCers in CA in a "manual." I am trying to find out if someone has made such a manual. Same goes with the videos. Has someone made a list of really good videos that can be found on the Internet?

    I can't carry the Internet around with me and then try to find all the sites. That's highly impractical. However, I can carry a manual.

    I am trying to find out if there is a manual that we can all study so we can know the laws without all the time and labor of trying to find them. I will check out the link given. Nope, been there. That is not a manual. It is nothing but links. The information could be used to make a manual, but I doubt that the information would be complete.

    Edit: Changed some wording in OP.

    If there is not such a thing, it may be in someone's interest to make a manual for CCW with "all" applicable laws.




    Last edited by kittyhawk63; 11-14-2010 at 03:55 PM. Reason: Changing Title

  2. #2
    Regular Member Gundude's Avatar
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    A citizen may not be required to offer a ―good and substantial reason-- why he should be permitted to exercise his rights. The right‘s existence is all the reason he needs.

  3. #3
    Regular Member Coded-Dude's Avatar
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    Videos would be a great idea. I have a nice Sony High Def handycam and would gladly take and edit some videos of a meetup in my area, if I am able to attend. The must read(or read first) thread under the california section answered most of my questions, but I still have a few unanswered. The pamphlets and flyers are great, but I agree that a document(with completes laws/coded/ordinances) and a laymans description would be very valuable.

  4. #4
    Regular Member Gundude's Avatar
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    On youtube, there are tons of vids about open carry. You could spend two days or more watching all of them. I think I put two there. One for an event at the Midway, and one at the Oceanside pier.
    A citizen may not be required to offer a ―good and substantial reason-- why he should be permitted to exercise his rights. The right‘s existence is all the reason he needs.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gundude View Post
    What I did was to print the pertinent documents I need - copies of statutes, portions of SCOTUS decisions, DA Memo of where I live, etc - put them inside those plastic document protectors and place them in a three ring binder. You can also have names and contact info of lawyers there (prefereably first page).

    If the need arises - LEO not knowing the law (surprised?), friends who insist their theories, whatever, I just pull them out. It is permanently situated in the back seat of my car.

    Also, it is easy to pull out an old doc and replace it with an updated one.

    Hope this helps.

  6. #6
    kittyhawk63
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    Quote Originally Posted by CA_fr_KS View Post
    What I did was to print the pertinent documents I need - copies of statutes, portions of SCOTUS decisions, DA Memo of where I live, etc - put them inside those plastic document protectors and place them in a three ring binder. You can also have names and contact info of lawyers there (prefereably first page).

    If the need arises - LEO not knowing the law (surprised?), friends who insist their theories, whatever, I just pull them out. It is permanently situated in the back seat of my car.

    Also, it is easy to pull out an old doc and replace it with an updated one.

    Hope this helps.
    You may be the one I am looking for. Do you have it down-loadable and ready for printing? Can you share it with some of the veterans to look over and see if they can add to this manual until it is complete and up-to-date?

    Maybe it is something I will start for the forum if no one has one or no one wants to share one they have. I will have to think on it.
    Last edited by kittyhawk63; 10-21-2010 at 05:29 PM.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by kittyhawk63 View Post
    You may be the one I am looking for. Do you have it down-loadable and ready for printing? Can you share it with some of the veterans to look over and see if they can add to this manual until it is complete and up-to-date?

    Maybe it is something I will start for the forum if no one has one or no one wants to share one they have. I will have to think on it.
    Everything I needed were downloaded from this. Others were courtesy of Google - like the McDonalds, Heller, etc. Also, what I have is specific to PRK only.

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ry-Information

  8. #8
    Regular Member Coded-Dude's Avatar
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    This comes from the LCAV(Legal Community Against Violence) but has a lot of good information: California Gun Laws
    If guns cause crime.....mine must be defective.

  9. #9
    kittyhawk63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coded-Dude View Post
    This comes from the LCAV(Legal Community Against Violence) but has a lot of good information: California Gun Laws
    Thanks.

    I always get a laugh from reading your signature.

  10. #10
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    I'm going to start on making this tonight. I am only going to do state level though as each county and city is different. When I am done I'll Post it as a PDF.

    If anyone has any other suggestions/links throw them out.

  11. #11
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    Ok here is my preliminary list of laws that affect us. The list was gathered from all the LEA bulletins. So if I missed something blame them.

    CA Penal Codes

    • 148
    • 171.5
    • 171b
    • 374c
    • 417
    • 537e
    • 626.9
    • 626.95
    • 833.5
    • 12001
    • 12021
    • 12022
    • 12023
    • 12024
    • 12025
    • 12026
    • 12031
    • 12035
    • 12040
    • 12090
    • 12101

    CA Health & Safety Codes

    • 11370.1

    CA Fish & Game Code

    • 2006

    CA Welfare & Institutions Code

    • 5150
    • 8103
    • 8100

    CA Code of Regulations

    • CCR Title 14, Div. 3, Chap. 1, Sec.4313(A)



    CA Government Code

    • 8571.5

    U.S. Code

    Title 18, Part I, Chapter 44, S922


    Code of Federal Regulations

    • 39 CFR 232.1(L)
    • 36 CFR 2.4(A)

    Case Law

    • People V. Clark (1996)
    • DC V. Heller (2008)
    • Arizona V. Hicks (1987)
    • Hiibel V. Sixth Judicial District (2004)
    • People V. Wharton (1992)
    • People V. Fuentes (1976)
    • People V. Marroquin (1989)
    • People V. Dunn (1976)
    • People V. Jurado (1972)
    • People V. Rubalcava (2000)
    • People V. Hodges (1999)
    • People V. Davis (1958)
    • People V. Padilla (2002)
    • People V. Dillard (1984)
    • People V. Taylor (1984)
    • Terry V. Ohio (1968)
    • People V. McGaughran (1979)
    • People V. Delong (1970)
    • Florida V. J.L. (2000) 529 U.S. 266
    • In re Gregory S. (1980) 112 Cal.App.3d 764
    • McDonald V. Chicago (2010)

  12. #12
    kittyhawk63
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    Quote Originally Posted by chewy352 View Post
    Ok here is my preliminary list of laws that affect us. The list was gathered from all the LEA bulletins. So if I missed something blame them.

    CA Penal Codes

    • 148
    • 171.5
    • 171b
    • 374c
    • 417
    • 537e
    • 626.9
    • 626.95
    • 833.5
    • 12001
    • 12021
    • 12022
    • 12023
    • 12024
    • 12025
    • 12026
    • 12031
    • 12035
    • 12040
    • 12090
    • 12101

    CA Health & Safety Codes

    • 11370.1

    CA Fish & Game Code

    • 2006

    CA Welfare & Institutions Code

    • 5150
    • 8103
    • 8100

    CA Code of Regulations

    • CCR Title 14, Div. 3, Chap. 1, Sec.4313(A)



    CA Government Code

    • 8571.5

    U.S. Code

    Title 18, Part I, Chapter 44, S922


    Code of Federal Regulations

    • 39 CFR 232.1(L)
    • 36 CFR 2.4(A)

    Case Law

    • People V. Clark (1996)
    • DC V. Heller (2008)
    • Arizona V. Hicks (1987)
    • Hiibel V. Sixth Judicial District (2004)
    • People V. Wharton (1992)
    • People V. Fuentes (1976)
    • People V. Marroquin (1989)
    • People V. Dunn (1976)
    • People V. Jurado (1972)
    • People V. Rubalcava (2000)
    • People V. Hodges (1999)
    • People V. Davis (1958)
    • People V. Padilla (2002)
    • People V. Dillard (1984)
    • People V. Taylor (1984)
    • Terry V. Ohio (1968)
    • People V. McGaughran (1979)
    • People V. Delong (1970)
    • Florida V. J.L. (2000) 529 U.S. 266
    • In re Gregory S. (1980) 112 Cal.App.3d 764
    • McDonald V. Chicago (2010)
    Way to go Chewy352. Thanks for stepping up and taking this challenge. Remember, this will be a manual with the laws spelled out clearly...not just a list of the laws as you have presented above. I hope that others will help you out getting this manual together. Others will need to add any STATE laws that you may have missed. I look forward to seeing your first draft. I do editing for authors and if you would like me to go over it before it is saved to pdf, let me know.

    Note: Chewy352, if you will, would you keep the work in Microsoft WORD until it is finished? Remember this is a LIVING DOCUMENT, since laws keep changing. I can get it saved to WordPerfect and Open Office (OOo) for those who would like to make their own pdf.

    We will still need OCers to make separate MANUALS for their COUNTIES.

    Thanks again.

    kh63
    Last edited by kittyhawk63; 10-22-2010 at 11:00 AM.

  13. #13
    Regular Member Coded-Dude's Avatar
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    Do we not have a google docs page? I have an account, so we could set up a group that can edit/make changes, and make it available to all.
    If guns cause crime.....mine must be defective.

  14. #14
    kittyhawk63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coded-Dude View Post
    Do we not have a google docs page? I have an account, so we could set up a group that can edit/make changes, and make it available to all.
    Coded-Dude, I am not sure what you are referring to. I have not heard anything about Google Docs. I don't use Google.

    You should PM Chewy352 and see if you two can start the ball rolling in that direction. That would be great for all to participate. I hope the veteran OCers here on the forum will participate. They have been studying the laws a long time...as compared to me. I am just getting started.

    Edit: I just looked at Google Docs and think it is OK if you feel safe enough in using Google. I don't like using them because they keep all your Internet activity through them on their mainframes for two years. These records of your Internet searches can be viewed by the authorities at any time with a court order. We have enough breaches of privacy already in our lives without aiding anyone. Having said that, I see no problem for us posting laws that are already posted; hence, I have no issue with using Google Docs.
    Last edited by kittyhawk63; 10-22-2010 at 12:54 PM.

  15. #15
    Regular Member Coded-Dude's Avatar
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    Google Docs is part of having a google account. You can upload or create documents that are stored on the web. From there you can allow others to edit and/or view said documents.

    Also, I whipped this up this morning. Mostly got the info from lcav, but I plan on changing the formatting some as well.

    https://sites.google.com/site/calopencarry/
    Last edited by Coded-Dude; 10-22-2010 at 05:15 PM.
    If guns cause crime.....mine must be defective.

  16. #16
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by chewy352 View Post
    Ok here is my preliminary list of laws that affect us. The list was gathered from all the LEA bulletins. So if I missed something blame them.

    CA Penal Codes

    • 148
    • 171.5
    • 171b
    • 374c
    • 417
    • 537e
    • 626.9
    • 626.95
    • 833.5
    • 12001
    • 12021
    • 12022
    • 12023
    • 12024
    • 12025
    • 12026
    • 12031
    • 12035
    • 12040
    • 12090
    • 12101

    CA Health & Safety Codes

    • 11370.1

    CA Fish & Game Code

    • 2006

    CA Welfare & Institutions Code

    • 5150
    • 8103
    • 8100

    CA Code of Regulations

    • CCR Title 14, Div. 3, Chap. 1, Sec.4313(A)



    CA Government Code

    • 8571.5

    U.S. Code

    Title 18, Part I, Chapter 44, S922


    Code of Federal Regulations

    • 39 CFR 232.1(L)
    • 36 CFR 2.4(A)

    Case Law

    • People V. Clark (1996)
    • DC V. Heller (2008)
    • Arizona V. Hicks (1987)
    • Hiibel V. Sixth Judicial District (2004)
    • People V. Wharton (1992)
    • People V. Fuentes (1976)
    • People V. Marroquin (1989)
    • People V. Dunn (1976)
    • People V. Jurado (1972)
    • People V. Rubalcava (2000)
    • People V. Hodges (1999)
    • People V. Davis (1958)
    • People V. Padilla (2002)
    • People V. Dillard (1984)
    • People V. Taylor (1984)
    • Terry V. Ohio (1968)
    • People V. McGaughran (1979)
    • People V. Delong (1970)
    • Florida V. J.L. (2000) 529 U.S. 266
    • In re Gregory S. (1980) 112 Cal.App.3d 764
    • McDonald V. Chicago (2010)
    Looks like a great plan.

  17. #17
    kittyhawk63
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    Chewy352,
    Look at this page: https://docs.google.com/Doc?docid=0A...rZ2Q&hl=en

    This is a good format for the manual. It would be helpful if there were short, concise, relevant comments made on any law with difficult/confusing wording or seeming to counter another law. It would also be helpful, if possible, to have a link to a video that would help explain the law.

    I don't expect you to do all the volunteer work to creating this manual. However, since you have offered to start the manual, I would expect that you would be the one to direct its production.

    When it is finished, it needs to be put before the forum members to look over and see if any laws are missing, any errors, any typos, anything from preventing it from being a professionally finished manual. I would also like this manual to be downloadable and printable by all members of opencarry.org. I think that it would be good PR for opencarry.org if we make this available for all OCers and CCWers and any other citizens who need to be acquainted with the state laws of California.

    The multiple county and local ordinance laws in California should follow a similar format with their respective manuals.

    I am sure that this is obvious to you, but I think it should be mentioned, all the laws need to be in numerical order along with their subs.

    I also think if we use something like Google Docs, we need to be careful that no one comes on there and deletes all the work, whether accidentally or on purpose. There needs to be an up-to-date backup available for quick replacement.

    Oh yes, give it some thought what picture should be on the front of the manual. Maybe we can have a contest to see who can offer the best picture. We would need to make sure that it does not break any copyright laws. Members can take pictures of their firearms (revolver or semi-automatic pistol) for entry. Members can offer more than one entry. Maybe some members would like to enter a photo they have of a LEO encounter with an OCer.

    To those who are reading this, I hope that you will see this as an opportunity for you to contribute to OCDO and not sit back and think that somebody else can do this. Do not say, "I'll just wait until I can download my copy." The more who can contribute to these manuals, the quicker they will be finished.

    I would like to see that the credits would go to the OpenCarry.org forum members, ex. Written, designed, and published by members of OpenCarry.org. Chewy352, you should have special mention for your contribution in compiling the manual and getting it ready to print.

    kh63








    Last edited by kittyhawk63; 10-22-2010 at 07:25 PM.

  18. #18
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    PM sent to Coded-Dude

  19. #19
    kittyhawk63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coded-Dude View Post
    Google Docs is part of having a google account. You can upload or create documents that are stored on the web. From there you can allow others to edit and/or view said documents.

    Also, I whipped this up this morning. Mostly got the info from lcav, but I plan on changing the formatting some as well.

    https://sites.google.com/site/calopencarry/
    Fantastic. Looks really nice. You surely don't need my help in telling you how to design this manual.

    You can forget the link I gave above for design. I still would like to have the members present a photo or even drawing for the front cover in a contest. We can show the collection of pictures (photos) and have a tick box under each and have the members to check the ONE that they like the best. Then we can put the top five in a run off, then the top two in a run off, and with these two...vote for the favorite. The winner gets put on the cover. How does this sound to you?
    kh63
    Last edited by kittyhawk63; 10-22-2010 at 07:20 PM.

  20. #20
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    Its a good idea but it doesn't really work too well in practice. See this thread http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...pen+carry+logo

  21. #21
    kittyhawk63
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    Quote Originally Posted by chewy352 View Post
    Its a good idea but it doesn't really work too well in practice. See this thread http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...pen+carry+logo
    Well, you may be right. We could at least try since this is not for a piece of clothing. I like the one at the top but for the fist. It looks too much like something the Black Panthers would have. Since it is a manual on gun laws, I see no problem with having a firearm on the front.

    Edit: Chewy352, I just got to thinking again this evening on the picture for the manual; we could use the image I am referring to as the back cover of the manual rather than the front.

    Edit: Chewy352, Thinking it through again, I think we ought to keep the outside cover as benign as possible. There is no reason that we should create a negative response to the manual because of something that may offend people's sensitivities toward firearms.
    Last edited by kittyhawk63; 10-23-2010 at 01:10 PM.

  22. #22
    kittyhawk63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gundude View Post
    On youtube, there are tons of vids about open carry. You could spend two days or more watching all of them. I think I put two there. One for an event at the Midway, and one at the Oceanside pier.
    Yes, and we need a list of these videos...but only the best. We also need to see that they do not repeat information on the other videos on the list.

    You know what I would like to see is where a group of you guys who live in the same town would get together and make videos for this forum covering the ways to encounter LEOs and how NOT to engage them. I wish CGF would make videos if no group here will do it or is unable to do it.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by kittyhawk63 View Post
    Yes, and we need a list of these videos...but only the best. We also need to see that they do not repeat information on the other videos on the list.

    You know what I would like to see is where a group of you guys who live in the same town would get together and make videos for this forum covering the ways to encounter LEOs and how NOT to engage them. I wish CGF would make videos if no group here will do it or is unable to do it.
    Like this: http://www.youtube.com/view_play_lis...DFD99BEFA7E9CB

  24. #24
    kittyhawk63
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    Quote Originally Posted by chewy352 View Post
    Its a good idea but it doesn't really work too well in practice. See this thread http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...pen+carry+logo
    I capitulate. Do you think it ought to be totally non-offensive to people's sensitivities by keeping any and all photos, drawings, or any Clint Eastwood type language to firearms off the cover?

    Have you come up with anything for the front and back?
    Last edited by kittyhawk63; 10-27-2010 at 07:23 PM.

  25. #25
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    I was just thinking maybe a picture of the constitution in the background and a simple title along the lines of "California Open Carry"

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