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Open Carry Voting

USNA69

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2010
Messages
375
Location
Norfolk, Virginia, USA
Legal Possession of Firearms at the Polls

My Norfolk precinct poll is located in the gymnasium of a former elementary school, which, I learned today, is now classified as an “abandoned building”. I was confident that there was no prohibition regarding carrying in a polling place. I had considered OCing to the polls, but decided against it, rather than have a philosophical discussion with a LEO about whether the building is or is not a school.

When I arrived, I saw a long time neighbor and fellow Navy vet, who was again serving as the chief election officer at the poll. I also know that he is pro-2A. We exchanged pleasantries, and I mentioned that I had considered carrying, but chose not to for the reason I mentioned. It was then that he told me that the poll was located in an “abandoned structure.” I replied that I could have OCed, after all. He quickly replied that he had anticipated the possibility of voters carrying, so he had carefully reviewed his written instructions contained in a thick binder.

Here is what he said. If a voter arrived CCing, AND his CHP was clearly visible upon his person, e.g. pinned to his clothing, then there would be no problem. I asked how he would know if a voter were CCing, and he said that, as a pro-2A and carrier himself, he knew where to look and what to look for. He went on to say that OC was expressly prohibited.

I mentioned State preemption and asked who had issued these instructions. He replied that the Electoral Board issued them and he produced the binder, with the applicable page regarding weapons tabbed. It was not clear if these regulations were State of local in origin.

He showed the page to me, and I read it quickly, so I am paraphrasing here, and I hope I have stated it accurately. The policy regarding CC was as described above. It went on to state that OC was prohibited and instructed poll officials to immediately call 9-1-1, if a voter arrived OCing.

Of course, I stated that an Electoral Board was not empowered to issue weapons prohibitions and again referenced State preemption. While he is a knowledgeable gun owner, he did not agree. I expect that he had sworn an oath to uphold the election law and policies contained in the binder.

I have done a quick Internet search for the regulations, but have been unable to find a source or even a mention of carrying firearms while voting. I would expect that the regulations would be a FOIA document and available to the public on request. I will visit the Electoral Board and ask to see the regulations.

Here is the contact information for the Norfolk Electoral Board:

Facility:
ELECTORAL BOARD
Mailing Address:
810 UNION ST

ROOM 808
NORFOLK
VA

23510
Phone:
757-664-4353

Locality Voter Registration Office Contact Information
Facility:
NORFOLK CITY
Registrar:
ELISA J LONG
Mailing Address
CITY HALL ROOM 808

PO BOX 1531
NORFOLK
VA

23501-1531
Physical Address:
810 UNION ST

ROOM 808
NORFOLK
VA

23510
Phone:
757-664-4353
Fax:
757-664-4685
Email:
vote@norfolk.gov
URL:
http://www.norfolk.gov/Elections/
Hours:
Monday thru Friday - 8:30 am - 5:00 pm


If the Electoral Board has overstepped its authority, we have two years to correct this problem.

As has been said elsewhere, there is no reason to surrender one right in order to exercise another
 
Last edited:

wylde007

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 23, 2009
Messages
3,035
Location
Va Beach, Occupied VA
If the Electoral Board has overstepped its authority, we have two years to correct this problem.
Wrong. This is not our problem, it is theirs.

There is nothing I can find in the State Code granting them authority to prohibit lawful carry of any sort.

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+TOC2402000

Tell your "friend" he is full of horse puckey and they'd better get their "rules" in order before they find themselves facing down a civil rights lawsuit - which they will lose.
 

VApatriot

Regular Member
Joined
May 8, 2006
Messages
998
Location
Burke/Blacksburg, Virginia, USA
If the Electoral Board has overstepped its authority, we have two years to correct this problem. ]

Two Years?! I don't know about you, but, between primaries, special election, state house and senate elections, and other local elections, I find myself at the polls at least two or three times every year. If this was in my area, and I wasn't already being denied my rights by having to vote in a school, I would see to it that this got fixed ASAP.
 

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,317
Location
Valhalla
snip.....

He showed the page to me, and I read it quickly, so I am paraphrasing here, and I hope I have stated it accurately. The policy regarding CC was as described above. It went on to state that OC was prohibited and instructed poll officials to immediately call 9-1-1, if a voter arrived OCing.

Of course, I stated that an Electoral Board was not empowered to issue weapons prohibitions and again referenced State preemption. While he is a knowledgeable gun owner, he did not agree. I expect that he had sworn an oath to uphold the election law and policies contained in the binder.

I have done a quick Internet search for the regulations, but have been unable to find a source or even a mention of carrying firearms while voting. I would expect that the regulations would be a FOIA document and available to the public on request. I will visit the Electoral Board and ask to see the regulations.

I would indeed like to see that in writing or a link to such.
 

ProShooter

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2008
Messages
4,663
Location
www.ProactiveShooters.com, Richmond, Va., , USA
My Norfolk precinct poll is located in the gymnasium of a former elementary school, which, I learned today, is now classified as an “abandoned building”. I was confident that there was no prohibition regarding carrying in a polling place. I had considered OCing to the polls, but decided against it, rather than have a philosophical discussion with a LEO about whether the building is or is not a school.

When I arrived, I saw a long time neighbor and fellow Navy vet, who was again serving as the chief election officer at the poll. I also know that he is pro-2A. We exchanged pleasantries, and I mentioned that I had considered carrying, but chose not to for the reason I mentioned. It was then that he told me that the poll was located in an “abandoned structure.” I replied that I could have OCed, after all. He quickly replied that he had anticipated the possibility of voters carrying, so he had carefully reviewed his written instructions contained in a thick binder.

Here is what he said. If a voter arrived CCing, AND his CHP was clearly visible upon his person, e.g. pinned to his clothing, then there would be no problem. I asked how he would know if a voter were CCing, and he said that, as a pro-2A and carrier himself, he knew where to look and what to look for. He went on to say that OC was expressly prohibited.

I mentioned State preemption and asked who had issued these instructions. He replied that the Electoral Board issued them and he produced the binder, with the applicable page regarding weapons tabbed. It was not clear if these regulations were State of local in origin.

He showed the page to me, and I read it quickly, so I am paraphrasing here, and I hope I have stated it accurately. The policy regarding CC was as described above. It went on to state that OC was prohibited and instructed poll officials to immediately call 9-1-1, if a voter arrived OCing.

Of course, I stated that an Electoral Board was not empowered to issue weapons prohibitions and again referenced State preemption. While he is a knowledgeable gun owner, he did not agree. I expect that he had sworn an oath to uphold the election law and policies contained in the binder.

I have done a quick Internet search for the regulations, but have been unable to find a source or even a mention of carrying firearms while voting. I would expect that the regulations would be a FOIA document and available to the public on request. I will visit the Electoral Board and ask to see the regulations.


I think that I may be able to get an answer on this one.......stay tuned.
 

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,317
Location
Valhalla
Ed has confirmed verbally with Elisa Long, Registrar for the city of Norfolk Elections, that she knows of no rule that prohibits the legal carry of firearms to polling places. She did however remind him that it would be a violation to carry in a K-12 school polling place.

Thanks Ed.

Still would like confirmation in writing though.
 
Last edited:

wylde007

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 23, 2009
Messages
3,035
Location
Va Beach, Occupied VA
Ed has confirmed verbally with Elisa Long, Registrar for the city of Norfolk Elections, that she knows of no rule that prohibits the legal carry of firearms to polling places. She did however remind him that it would be a violation to carry in a K-12 school polling place.
Which is pretty much what most of us presume going in.

And all the more reason to get the k-12 rule struck or polling places relocated.

I prefer the former over the latter.
 

ProShooter

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2008
Messages
4,663
Location
www.ProactiveShooters.com, Richmond, Va., , USA
Made a phone call, heard the actual reading of the offending passage, and I should have a copy of it in hand this evening.

Seems that the wording allows for a police officer to carry, and someone with a CHP to carry. The offending wording is basically that anyone else seen with a weapon is to be asked to leave it outside in their vehicle and/or call 911 to let the police handle it.

My contact understands that this page in their manual is in error and we may be able to get it re-written in a more expeditious (and less sabre rattling) way. The old "catching flies with honey" method.....
 

USNA69

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2010
Messages
375
Location
Norfolk, Virginia, USA
Tracking Down the Regs

I have asked my Norfolk poll officlal "friend" to cite for me the title of the document as well as whether it is a City Norfolk or Commonwealth document.

Stand by ...
 

ed

Founder's Club Member - Moderator
Joined
Mar 8, 2008
Messages
4,841
Location
Loudoun County - Dulles Airport, Virginia, USA
Ed has confirmed verbally with Elisa Long, Registrar for the city of Norfolk Elections, that she knows of no rule that prohibits the legal carry of firearms to polling places. She did however remind him that it would be a violation to carry in a K-12 school polling place.

Thanks Ed.

Still would like confirmation in writing though.
Welcome. me too.
 

jermflux

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2008
Messages
62
Location
Norfolk, VA
Fairlawn Recreation Center

This is where I have to go, I still can not figure out if it is indeed a school, or recreation center. The outtside park seems to have city park rules???
 

ProShooter

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2008
Messages
4,663
Location
www.ProactiveShooters.com, Richmond, Va., , USA
This is where I have to go, I still can not figure out if it is indeed a school, or recreation center. The outtside park seems to have city park rules???

My guess (from reading the Norfolk city website) is that the building is a rec center, so you should be fine to carry there. I haven't seen the actual building though, so its just a guess.
 

nova

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2007
Messages
3,149
Location
US
About the church thing, remember that many churches have private schools, meaning the property at such places is under the K-12 ban.
 

jermflux

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2008
Messages
62
Location
Norfolk, VA
I think it's almost safe to say that the only way you can be sure you are not breaking some kinda law on the books is to stay home in your easy chair while picking your nose. Then again, I'm sure if you search hard enough, there is probably a law against that too.
 

Thundar

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2007
Messages
4,946
Location
Newport News, Virginia, USA
More specifically, the Code says:

§ 18.2-283. Carrying dangerous weapon to place of religious worship.
If any person carry any gun, pistol, bowie knife, dagger or other dangerous weapon, without good and sufficient reason, to a place of worship while a meeting for religious purposes is being held at such place he shall be guilty of a Class 4 misdemeanor.

The key conditional phrase is "while a meeting for religious purposes is being held at such place". My civic league meets in a church on Monday evenings. I carry without violating the law. Even so, the church is still private property, and I could be asked to leave by someone in authority.

So, if your polling place is inside a place of worship, and no worship services are in progress, and no church official asks you to leave, you should be good to go.

+1 USNA.

When I lived in Chesapeake my polling place was a church. Open carried there without any issues.
 

ProShooter

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2008
Messages
4,663
Location
www.ProactiveShooters.com, Richmond, Va., , USA
I think it's almost safe to say that the only way you can be sure you are not breaking some kinda law on the books is to stay home in your easy chair while picking your nose. Then again, I'm sure if you search hard enough, there is probably a law against that too.

or, you could just learn what the laws are and follow them, and bring about change for the ones that you do not like.
 
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