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Thread: Out of State FFL Transfers?

  1. #1
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    Out of State FFL Transfers?

    I have a line on a "like-new" Ruger P-89 which will be my new carry pistol, but I have a problem. I have never dealt with Out of state transfers of firearms. It's coming out of TX and the seller has never done one either. How hard is it? What does he need to do? What do I need to do? Can he ship it UPS or FEDEX?

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    Regular Member sraacke's Avatar
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    Find a local FFL dealer (gun or pawn shop) who will accept it for a fee ( ~$20 ). Have the FFL dealer be the middle man and you should be ok.
    Congrats on the P-89. I have 2 of them and love them. One, the P-89 decocker, is my EDC gun.
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    Quote Originally Posted by yale View Post
    Find a local FFL dealer (gun or pawn shop) who will accept it for a fee ( ~$20 ). Have the FFL dealer be the middle man and you should be ok.
    Congrats on the P-89. I have 2 of them and love them. One, the P-89 decocker, is my EDC gun.
    Or... buy a like new P-95 from me

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    Quote Originally Posted by yale View Post
    Find a local FFL dealer (gun or pawn shop) who will accept it for a fee ( ~$20 ). Have the FFL dealer be the middle man and you should be ok.
    Congrats on the P-89. I have 2 of them and love them. One, the P-89 decocker, is my EDC gun.
    This would be the best CYA approach. However private transfers are legal in both La. and Tx. so you shouldn't have any problems. However be cautious when purchasing a firearm from a stranger for obvious reasons. FYI, I had a Taurus replaced twice, and both times they direct shipped me my repacement, when I asked them about this they responded that since Fla. and La. allow private transfers with no paperwork, it was legal bc it was not a retail sale, but legally a private transfer ( discretionary replacement) Even if you don't go through an ffl, I would definetely get a bill of sale, notorized and signed if possible.
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    18 USC 922(a)

    Quote Originally Posted by yale View Post
    Find a local FFL dealer (gun or pawn shop) who will accept it for a fee ( ~$20 ). Have the FFL dealer be the middle man and you should be ok.
    Congrats on the P-89. I have 2 of them and love them. One, the P-89 decocker, is my EDC gun.
    Yale makes his suggestion because interstate transfers are regulated by federal law.


    READ
    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18...2----000-.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by NRAMARINE View Post
    This would be the best CYA approach. However private transfers are legal in both La. and Tx. so you shouldn't have any problems.
    It is the best CYA approach and also the only approach that happens to not be a Federal felony. Private transfers are legal in both LA and TX, BUT ONLY BETWEEN SAME STATE RESIDENTS! In other words, between two residents of LA or between two residents of TX!

    FYI, I had a Taurus replaced twice, and both times they direct shipped me my repacement, when I asked them about this they responded that since Fla. and La. allow private transfers with no paperwork, it was legal bc it was not a retail sale, but legally a private transfer ( discretionary replacement)
    They fed you a line of crap about your case being a private transfer. You were receiving a replacement firearm from a LICENSED MANUFACTURER! How could it be a private transfer when one party was LICENSED?!?

    Even if you don't go through an ffl, I would definetely get a bill of sale, notorized and signed if possible.
    Written evidence of a Felony... notarized even! That would be a tough rap to beat in court.

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    rmansu2,

    The legal procedure is:

    1. You find an FFL in your state of residence who will receive the firearm and transfer it to you. Ask the FFL if they are willing to receive shipments from private parties, some FFLs won't.

    2. If the receiving FFL agrees, the seller ships the handgun to the receiving FFL via UPS or FEDEX, with a copy of their ID (driver's license) and a note as to whom the gun is intended for.

    OR

    3. The seller can deliver the handgun to a local FFL on their end, who will mail the handgun to an FFL on your end with a note as to whom the gun is intended for. This might be cheaper.

    4. When the gun arrives, the FFL calls you, you go to the FFL, fill out the 4473, pass the required background checks, pay the FFL their transfer fee, and take your gun.

    (oh, somewhere after step 1 above, you need to pay the seller for the gun.)
    Last edited by NavyLCDR; 11-02-2010 at 04:16 PM.

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    They fed you a line of crap about your case being a private transfer. You were receiving a replacement firearm from a LICENSED MANUFACTURER! How could it be a private transfer when one party was LICENSED

    That's odd, I had a derringer replaced by Cobra industries, and had to go through an ffl for that one. They told me it was legal for them to direct ship it to me, but it was company policy to ALWAYS go through an ffl. So two firearm companies are wrong? The guy I talked to at Taurus the second time I had to have this particular firearm serviced was the VP of marketing for Taurus intl. I doubt they would do anything illegal, TWICE, to save paperwork.
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    Direct from the ATF website ( cut and paste)....Navy LT is correct. I have not yet found the regulation regarding transfers from a manufacturer to a private citizen with no ffl involved but I'll keep looking.

    When a transaction takes place between private (unlicensed) persons who reside in the same State, the Gun Control Act (GCA) does not require any record keeping. A private person may sell a firearm to another private individual in his or her State of residence and, similarly, a private individual may buy a firearm from another private person who resides in the same State. It is not necessary under Federal law for a Federal firearms licensee (FFL) to assist in the sale or transfer when the buyer and seller are “same-State” residents. Of course, the transferor/seller may not knowingly transfer a firearm to someone who falls within any of the categories of prohibited persons contained in the GCA. See 18 U.S.C. 922(g) and (n). However, as stated above, there are no GCA-required records to be completed by either party to the transfer.

    There may be State or local laws or regulations that govern this type of transaction. Contact State Police units or the office of your State Attorney General for information on any such requirements.

    Please note that if a private person wants to obtain a firearm from a private person who resides in another State, the firearm will have to be shipped to an FFL in the buyer’s State. The FFL will be responsible for record keeping. See also Question B3.


    http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/unli...-state-firearm
    Last edited by NRAMARINE; 11-02-2010 at 04:44 PM.
    This site has been hijacked by leftists who attack opposition to further their own ends. Those who have never served this country and attack those who do are no longer worthy of my time or attention.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NRAMARINE View Post
    Direct from the ATF website ( cut and paste)....Navy LT is correct. I have not yet found the regulation regarding transfers from a manufacturer to a private citizen with no ffl involved but I'll keep looking.
    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18...2----000-.html

    (a) It shall be unlawful—
    (2) for any importer, manufacturer, dealer, or collector licensed under the provisions of this chapter to ship or transport in interstate or foreign commerce any firearm to any person other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector, except that—
    (A) this paragraph and subsection (b)(3) shall not be held to preclude a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector from returning a firearm or replacement firearm of the same kind and type to a person from whom it was received; and this paragraph shall not be held to preclude an individual from mailing a firearm owned in compliance with Federal, State, and local law to a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector;
    If Taurus was returning your gun to you as a private transfer, it would violate 18 USC 922 (a)(3) and (a)(5):

    (a) It shall be unlawful—
    (3) for any person, other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to transport into or receive in the State where he resides (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, the State where it maintains a place of business) any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State

    (5) for any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) to transfer, sell, trade, give, transport, or deliver any firearm to any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, does not maintain a place of business in) the State in which the transferor resides
    What I was saying was a line of crap was that Taurus was claiming the transfer was a PRIVATE transfer! It's not. It is a transfer of a repaired or replaced firearm by a LICENSED (licensed means NOT PRIVATE!) manufacturer to its original owner.
    Last edited by NavyLCDR; 11-02-2010 at 06:42 PM.

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    License = NOT private??

    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post

    What I was saying was a line of crap was that Taurus was claiming the transfer was a PRIVATE transfer! It's not. It is a transfer of a repaired or replaced firearm by a LICENSED (licensed means NOT PRIVATE!) manufacturer to its original owner.
    You are correct that license SHOULD mean "NOT private". Unfortunately, that is not the case in our times. Otherwise, a LEO would ONLY ask for your driver's license after first clarifying whether you were "driving" a commercial vehicle or using a private car.

    As it stands now, the feds are "allowing" us "private" sales intrastate only.
    Last edited by georg jetson; 11-02-2010 at 09:59 PM.

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    I believe the proper procedure would require the seller to take the gun to a licensed dealer in the sellers state and have the gun shipped to a dealer in your state. I just purchased a Czech VZ-58 from out of state and had it shipped to a dealer in La. I filled out the paper work at the dealers shop here and walked out with my rifle...no problem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by estcrh View Post
    I believe the proper procedure would require the seller to take the gun to a licensed dealer in the sellers state
    Optional, but not required by law. The seller can ship the firearm directly to the receiving FFL, if the receiving FFL will accept shipments from private parties.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    rmansu2,

    The legal procedure is:

    1. You find an FFL in your state of residence who will receive the firearm and transfer it to you. Ask the FFL if they are willing to receive shipments from private parties, some FFLs won't.

    2. If the receiving FFL agrees, the seller ships the handgun to the receiving FFL via UPS or FEDEX, with a copy of their ID (driver's license) and a note as to whom the gun is intended for.
    This is what my FFL suggested. The shipper's FFL wanted to charge him $35 plus the $50 shipping charge. Decided to get him to ship it UPS himself.

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    Now you just have to holster that baby and bring it to a meeting.
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    Last edited by oldbanger; 11-05-2010 at 01:36 PM. Reason: redundant

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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    Optional, but not required by law. The seller can ship the firearm directly to the receiving FFL, if the receiving FFL will accept shipments from private parties.
    Your correct..I was just going by this statement "It's coming out of TX and the seller has never done one either." Many private sellers are reluctant to ship a firearm themselves.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    It is the best CYA approach and also the only approach that happens to not be a Federal felony. Private transfers are legal in both LA and TX, BUT ONLY BETWEEN SAME STATE RESIDENTS! In other words, between two residents of LA or between two residents of TX!



    They fed you a line of crap about your case being a private transfer. You were receiving a replacement firearm from a LICENSED MANUFACTURER! How could it be a private transfer when one party was LICENSED?!?



    Written evidence of a Felony... notarized even! That would be a tough rap to beat in court.
    Absolutely! Interstate transfers MUST be via a FFL unless going to a manufacturer for repair, i.e, I send my pistol back to SIG in NH and they return directly to me. No such thing as face to face transfers anywhere in the US excepting both being residents of the same state, as NavyLT states. DO NOT mess around with this law. It is way too easy to be found out and you will be prosecuted by the BATF Nazis.

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