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Thread: Question: City of Southfiled dumped S&W M&P pistols?

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    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Question: City of Southfiled dumped S&W M&P pistols?

    Does anyone know why the City of Southfield Police Dept. sent back all their brand new Smith and Wesson M&P's?

    Rumor is they had numerous failures.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

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    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bailenforcer View Post
    Does anyone know why the City of Southfield Police Dept. sent back all their brand new Smith and Wesson M&P's?

    Rumor is they had numerous failures.
    I had not heard of it, but have someone I work with that can check on it (her husband is on the force). It may take a few days...

    I know Royal Oak had a problem with their Glock Pistol's Tactical Lights being too heavy and causing FTF's, causing them to swap out the Tactical Lights for a lighter model.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PDinDetroit View Post
    I had not heard of it, but have someone I work with that can check on it (her husband is on the force). It may take a few days...

    I know Royal Oak had a problem with their Glock Pistol's Tactical Lights being too heavy and causing FTF's, causing them to swap out the Tactical Lights for a lighter model.
    Pontiac had that problem as well

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    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    Because they are not Glocks! LOL

    Just joking. I have a few contacts, I should have an answer tonight for ya, give me a few.
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
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    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
    Luke 22:36
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    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    Look at that, back already

    They had several malfunctions, some (I don't know how many, but obviously enough to be a problem), were jamming every 3-4 rounds.
    Last edited by eastmeyers; 11-03-2010 at 07:55 PM.
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
    Luke 22:36
    God Bless

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    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    Sorry back again.

    BUT GREAT NEWS!!!

    They are using their heads! They decieded to go with GLOCK!
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
    Luke 22:36
    God Bless

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    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eastmeyers View Post
    They are using their heads! They decieded to go with GLOCK!
    But they won't be using their legs.

    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. Thomas Paine

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    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    No that only goes for people who don't trust themselves to pull a firearm out of a holster without putting their finger on the trigger. Firearm safety 101, don't put your finger on the trigger till your ready to pull.
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
    Luke 22:36
    God Bless

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Strange. Such a relentlessly reliable gun, even when dirty. A few specific guns jamming while others work flawlessly seems like a rather lousy decision. S&W, even if a total idea theif isn't exactly known for refusing to do warranty work.

    No disrespect to Glock, but the M&P's are definitely more comfortable in the hand, and better suited to a wider variety of hand sizes.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

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    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    Strange. Such a relentlessly reliable gun, even when dirty. A few specific guns jamming while others work flawlessly seems like a rather lousy decision. S&W, even if a total idea theif isn't exactly known for refusing to do warranty work.

    No disrespect to Glock, but the M&P's are definitely more comfortable in the hand, and better suited to a wider variety of hand sizes.
    From my understanding (it was strongly implied), it was a very large number of the s&w's were having problems, jamming was just the number one complaint. I didn't see the need to ask for details, as the facts are still the facts, they dropped them because they had problems, big enough problems they felt the need to get rid of them completely.

    As for Glocks not being comfortable enough, I am sure they are doing what most larger departments are doing and offering all officers the choice's between the standard or the compact, which in this case would be the Glock 31 and Glock 32, and as back-ups and undercover work they would use Glock 33's which is the sub-compact. All of these models are .357sig models.
    Last edited by eastmeyers; 11-03-2010 at 09:17 PM.
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
    Luke 22:36
    God Bless

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eastmeyers View Post
    All of these models are .357sig models.
    Another odd choice, since you lose a fair amount of transferable energy when necking down a typical handgun round. But I suppose at least the recoil will be light, and the cute little HP bullets will expand well.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    Another odd choice, since you lose a fair amount of transferable energy when necking down a typical handgun round. But I suppose at least the recoil will be light, and the cute little HP bullets will expand well.
    I thought it was weird too, I was hoping they were going to go with 10mm, that way ammo would be cheaper in the area (edventually), but they don't offer Glock 10mm in all three sizes. Oh well, not like me as a random citizen has a vote in it anyways. LOL.

    (I assume they got a discount to go with .357sig, instead of .40, the standard for SE Michigan LE, just to make it more popular)
    Last edited by eastmeyers; 11-03-2010 at 09:30 PM.
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
    Luke 22:36
    God Bless

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    Beware! It's only a matter of time before Tvance shows up and tells everyone this thread is off topic. It is his favorite thing to do these days.

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    Hahaha. Off topic or not, this is important. Some of us carry these guns. I was thinking about buying one myself.

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    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    I know departments Carry (and to keep it on topic Open Carry)

    Glock
    Sig
    S&W
    Beretta (less often)
    Kimber (rarely)

    Does anyone know of a department that (open) carries or has (open) carried Springfield XD?

    Or any other brands, and if you know the department if you can list it.
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
    Luke 22:36
    God Bless

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    I really don't see this topic being OT anyhow, considering that many of us OC these weapons.

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    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scot623 View Post
    Beware! It's only a matter of time before Tvance shows up and tells everyone this thread is off topic. It is his favorite thing to do these days.
    We are talking about what Police Officers Open Carry! Cops are Open Carriers also!

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    Regular Member Scooter's Avatar
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    I have an M&P myself and love it, many people have and swear by Glock, hey whatever! I just hope they can hit their target with whatever they're using!

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    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Making some telephone calls today... Detroit has the S&W M&P now and I am being told they are so tight tolerance that they also have had some malfunctions but not as many as implied with Southfield. Of course they use the .40.

    I never trusted a necked cartridge in a handgun concept.

    To add also I am told the M&P is more accurate than the Glocks but less dependable.


    Quote Originally Posted by eastmeyers View Post
    I thought it was weird too, I was hoping they were going to go with 10mm, that way ammo would be cheaper in the area (edventually), but they don't offer Glock 10mm in all three sizes. Oh well, not like me as a random citizen has a vote in it anyways. LOL.

    (I assume they got a discount to go with .357sig, instead of .40, the standard for SE Michigan LE, just to make it more popular)
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

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    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Yes I really want to see the 10 MM make a come back.

    Quote Originally Posted by eastmeyers View Post
    I thought it was weird too, I was hoping they were going to go with 10mm, that way ammo would be cheaper in the area (edventually), but they don't offer Glock 10mm in all three sizes. Oh well, not like me as a random citizen has a vote in it anyways. LOL.

    (I assume they got a discount to go with .357sig, instead of .40, the standard for SE Michigan LE, just to make it more popular)
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bailenforcer View Post
    I never trusted a necked cartridge in a handgun concept. .

    Other than when it fell on the ground and shot me, my CZ52 was as reliable as anything I've ever used, including when I accidentally got sand in the action. So bottle necks can at least cycle well with commie grade reliability.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bailenforcer View Post
    Yes I really want to see the 10 MM make a come back.
    I'm helping to keep the 10mm alive.
    I have 3 - 10mm Handguns.
    Life is tough, its tougher when your stupid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    Another odd choice, since you lose a fair amount of transferable energy when necking down a typical handgun round. But I suppose at least the recoil will be light, and the cute little HP bullets will expand well.
    The 357 sig is not a light recoil round and is also rather high velocity. If I remember right it is a 40 cal case necked down to accept a 9mm bullet and the shape of the case gives it the "shaped charge" effect when it goes off. I had one in a 239 sig frame and the recoil was quite snappy. Much much more than the 9mm in the same version and more than a 40 cal if going just off the feel

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    All I can say is from being in the manufacturing field for a long time I have seen on many occassions when a customer switches to a new brand where all of these "problems" arise. I cannot say that is what happened here but some people are resistant to change ect. I have a little trouble buying there was widespread trouble just off of my own experience. I own 2 M&Ps and with all of the people I have referred to get one and all of the range time we have at our facility with a double digit number of them I can say I have never seen a problem with any of them. In tens of thousands of combined rounds I have never seen one of them have any failure that I recall and just find it difficult to buy that they had widespread issues.

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    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scooter View Post
    I just hope they can hit their target with whatever they're using!
    They will...as long as their target is their own leg

    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. Thomas Paine

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