Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 86

Thread: Anyone (else) been charged with Carrying a Concealed Weapon while OCing?

  1. #1
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Cameron NC, , USA
    Posts
    113

    Anyone (else) been charged with Carrying a Concealed Weapon while OCing?

    After getting charged with carrying a concealed weapon this weekend while OCing, I was wondering if anyone else had had this problem. The arresting officer said the only way to OC was to have your gun/holster strapped to the top of your head so that it would be visible from 360 degrees. Yep, seriously.

  2. #2
    Centurion
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Pleasant Grove, Utah, USA
    Posts
    3,828
    Quote Originally Posted by calynn View Post
    After getting charged with carrying a concealed weapon this weekend while OCing, I was wondering if anyone else had had this problem. The arresting officer said the only way to OC was to have your gun/holster strapped to the top of your head so that it would be visible from 360 degrees. Yep, seriously.
    IF the is truly the law, then it seriously NEEDS TO BE CHANGED!

  3. #3
    Regular Member sultan62's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Clayton, NC
    Posts
    1,319
    Quote Originally Posted by JoeSparky View Post
    IF the is truly the law, then it seriously NEEDS TO BE CHANGED!
    This NOT the law here, and this is not a typical LEO response in NC. There are multiple laws that need to be amended/removed, but OC as a whole typically goes over pretty well.

    calynn, I know we have talked a little via pm, please keep us updated here on the forum.

    Also, I will be sending you another pm momentarily.

  4. #4
    Regular Member J_Oliver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Haw River, North Carolina
    Posts
    151
    Officer Barney Fife there's gonna try and push his weight around, The charge won't stick and I'd sue the pants and badge off him. In order for a firearm to be considered concealed, it doesn't have to be visible from 360 degrees it just has to be visible when looking at the area where the gun is and has to be identifiable as a firearm. It won't stick.
    "I'd rather be judged by twelve than carried by six..."

    [ Kyd: "I think I'm gonna have "13 1/2" tattooed on my shoulder..."

    Me: "Why the hell would you do that?"

    Kyd: "Thats one judge, 12 jurors, and a half a chance I'm gonna get off..." ]

  5. #5
    Regular Member sultan62's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Clayton, NC
    Posts
    1,319
    Quote Originally Posted by J_Oliver View Post
    Officer Barney Fife there's gonna try and push his weight around, The charge won't stick and I'd sue the pants and badge off him. In order for a firearm to be considered concealed, it doesn't have to be visible from 360 degrees it just has to be visible when looking at the area where the gun is and has to be identifiable as a firearm. It won't stick.
    You're right, it won't. That doesn't change the fact that it's going to cost calynn a ridiculous amount of money.

    As you said, "sue the pants and badge off him." He should know better, and probably does.

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Hickory, NC, ,
    Posts
    1,025
    I would try to get a meeting with a magistrate or DA. The show them stuff like this and ask why they insist on going against the NCSC.

    State v Huntley

    But although a gun is an "unusual weapon," it is to be remembered that the carrying of a gun, per se, constitutes no (p.423)offence. For any lawful purpose--either of business or amusement--the citizen is at perfect liberty to carry his gun. It is the wicked purpose, and the mischievous result, which essentially constitute the crime. He shall not carry about this or any other weapon of death to terrify and alarm, and in such manner as naturally will terrify and alarm a peaceful people.

    http://www.google.com/url?url=http:/...lZjESiTOavrc0w



    State v Kerner

    This constitutional guaranty was construed in State v. Speller, 86 N.C. 697, in which it was held that the distinction was between the "right to keep and bear arms" and the "practice of carrying concealed weapons." The former is a sacred right based upon the experience of the ages in order that the people may be accustomed to bear arms and ready to use them for the protection of their liberties or their country when occasion serves. The provision against carrying them concealed was to prevent assassinations or advantages taken by the lawless; i.e., against the abuse of the privilege.

    http://www.google.com/url?url=http:/...37dRNPN36wQBtQ


    The cop is wrong. Get it tossed then sue.

  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Cameron, North Carolina, USA
    Posts
    110
    Caylnn this happen in Cameron? I live near Cameron and oc a lot never had a problem. Keep us posted
    Last edited by bwhunter65; 11-04-2010 at 08:47 AM.

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Cameron NC, , USA
    Posts
    113
    Quote Originally Posted by chiefjason View Post
    I would try to get a meeting with a magistrate or DA.
    The magistrate says that the reason the didn't try to bring me to the jail for falsification of records (they seriously didn't believe I got a permit from the SD) was because he wouldn't have signed off on anything of the sort.

    Yeah guys, I'm glad to hear the support. I knew I was right, but sometimes that doesn't matter.

    It wouldn't have been that big of a deal, if he would've admitted he was wrong (the arresting officer). Even the Senior Investigator of the PD told them not to charge me with it and that he would be happy to be subpoenaed on my behalf. Either way, they seized my gun (pissed) until my court date at the earliest, which is late December.

    I'm not the lawsuit type at all, but this place was so out of hand, I'm really considering it.

    Aberdeen PD was the agency, occurred at Thomas Tire.

    I've written it up, waiting to be cleared by my attorney to release details.
    Last edited by calynn; 11-04-2010 at 09:01 AM.

  9. #9
    Moderator / Administrator
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Fairfax County, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    8,711
    Quote Originally Posted by calynn View Post
    After getting charged with carrying a concealed weapon this weekend while OCing, I was wondering if anyone else had had this problem. The arresting officer said the only way to OC was to have your gun/holster strapped to the top of your head so that it would be visible from 360 degrees. Yep, seriously.
    Gind a good attorney who can get these charges quashed and then sue for violation of the 4th amendment ( I assume you were arrested, cuffed, etc.). The law here is "clearly established," see State v Kerner (state cannot require permit for open carry) so you should not have a qualified immunity problem.

  10. #10
    Regular Member Northerner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Clayton, NC
    Posts
    320

    Aberdeen police department - law enforcement code of ethics

    Posted on their website....

    AS A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER, my fundamental duty is to serve mankind; to safeguard lives and property; to protect the innocent against deception, the weak against oppression or intimidation, and the peaceful against violence or disorder; and to respect the Constitutional rights of all men to liberty, equality and justice.

    I WILL keep my private life unsullied as an example to all; maintain courageous calm in the face of danger, scorn or ridicule; develop self-restraint; and be constantly mindful of the welfare of others. Honest in thought and deed in both my personal and official life, I will be exemplary in observing the laws of the land and the regulations of my department. Whatever I see or hear of a confidential nature or that is confided to me in my official capacity will be kept ever secret unless revelation is necessary in the performance of my duty.

    I WILL never act officiously or permit personal feelings, prejudices, animosities or friendships to influence my decisions. With no compromise for crime and with relentless prosecution of criminals, I will enforce the law courteously and appropriately without force or violence and never accepting gratuities.

    I RECOGNIZE the badge of my office as a symbol of public faith, and I accept it as a public trust to be held so long as I am true to the ethics of the police service. I will constantly strive to achieve these objectives and ideals, dedicating myself before God to my chosen profession...Law Enforcement.

  11. #11
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    462
    Someone local should email the head of the PD and ask them their opinion on open carrying.

  12. #12
    Regular Member sultan62's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Clayton, NC
    Posts
    1,319
    Quote Originally Posted by Northerner View Post
    Posted on their website....

    AS A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER, my fundamental duty is to serve mankind; to safeguard lives and property; to protect the innocent against deception, the weak against oppression or intimidation, and the peaceful against violence or disorder; and to respect the Constitutional rights of all men to liberty, equality and justice.

    I WILL keep my private life unsullied as an example to all; maintain courageous calm in the face of danger, scorn or ridicule; develop self-restraint; and be constantly mindful of the welfare of others. Honest in thought and deed in both my personal and official life, I will be exemplary in observing the laws of the land and the regulations of my department. Whatever I see or hear of a confidential nature or that is confided to me in my official capacity will be kept ever secret unless revelation is necessary in the performance of my duty.

    I WILL never act officiously or permit personal feelings, prejudices, animosities or friendships to influence my decisions. With no compromise for crime and with relentless prosecution of criminals, I will enforce the law courteously and appropriately without force or violence and never accepting gratuities.

    I RECOGNIZE the badge of my office as a symbol of public faith, and I accept it as a public trust to be held so long as I am true to the ethics of the police service. I will constantly strive to achieve these objectives and ideals, dedicating myself before God to my chosen profession...Law Enforcement.
    You think that's funny? Try reading their "Core Values" section of the website. (http://www.townofaberdeen.net/core_values.htm)

    It makes no mention whatsoever of enforcing the law.

  13. #13
    Regular Member Northerner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Clayton, NC
    Posts
    320
    Quote Originally Posted by mekender View Post
    Someone local should email the head of the PD and ask them their opinion on open carrying.
    Michael Connor
    Chief of Police

    If you have any questions or concerns, please contact me at (910) 944-9721 or mikeconnor@aberdeenpolice.com.

  14. #14
    Regular Member Walt_Kowalski's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Ashburn, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    355
    good luck to the OP. Sounds like you have a pretty open and shut case. Sucks that you will have to go through this mess, but it should result in at least one power hungry cop learning (a hopefully expensive) lesson.
    "The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good"
    -- George Washington

  15. #15
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    211

    I never have liked Aberdeen

    Aberdeen huh?
    Interesting.
    I'll be OCing there next week.

    Good luck with the charge (though I'm sure everything will work out).
    Last edited by hotrod8812; 11-04-2010 at 02:16 PM.

  16. #16
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    211

    ....

    Quote Originally Posted by calynn View Post
    The magistrate says that the reason the didn't try to bring me to the jail for falsification of records (they seriously didn't believe I got a permit from the SD) was because he wouldn't have signed off on anything of the sort.

    I have looked at my Mom's permit and my permit (Both issued by Carter at different times) And the Signature looks about the same. So I have an idea he was the one too sign mine So the Magistrate could be wrong.
    If its the same magistrate that was there in 08 He has been known too be wrong...

  17. #17
    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Grennsboro NC
    Posts
    5,358
    Quote Originally Posted by sultan62 View Post
    You think that's funny? Try reading their "Core Values" section of the website. (http://www.townofaberdeen.net/core_values.htm)

    And I quote, from said page:

    PROTECTION OF LIVES AND PROPERTY
    The protection of lives and property is our primary responsibility and it is for that purpose that we exist.(1) We must protect all persons against those elements in society, which seek to harm and/or deprive our citizens of their rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. We will apply all our resources to the prevention of crime and the apprehension of criminals. We have an obligation to provide the perception of a safe environment and secure neighborhoods, streets, parks, schools, businesses and homes.(2)



    (1) Apparently the people who write the copy for the APD have never heard of "Warren v. DC". Not only is protection of individual citizens NOT their "primary responsibility", they have, by definition of the SCOTUS, "no duty or legal obligation" to do so.

    Local PDs are essentially a private security force, under the employ of the corporation that is their employer--the municipality. They exist to keep order among the public, to protect the property of the municipality, and to guard the safety of public officials. They are tasked with INVESTIGATING crimes--AFTER they happen, and with apprehending suspects as determined by the DA or prosecutors office. That is their ONLY legal obligation or duty. Period.

    (2) Notice that phrase in red... "PERCEPTION of safety". They are not tasked with actyally providing REAL safety. They are functionally incapable of doing so, and legally under no obligation to do so. But they are admitting right here, that they are essentially there just to make people FEEL safe... Sad, truely sad...

    And it seems like they think the way to ensure their population "feels safe" is to intimidate people who exercise their 2A rights, and threaten them with false arrest, filing false charges, and raping and pillaging their Constitutional Rights...

    Get a good lawyer. Right now. Even if they never return your firearm, you should get enough of a judgement (DO NOT take a settlement)--AFTER you WIN the case--to buy several new replacements...

    Get a good lawyer.

    And one more thing. I know this should have nothing to do with an incident like this but what do you look like? Young, middle-aged, old? Black, white, hispanic, native American? Long hair or short hair?

    I'd be willing to be that you don't look ANYTHING like me (middle-aged, slim, clean-cut white guy) which unfortunately may explain the attitude you experienced...
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

  18. #18
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Cameron NC, , USA
    Posts
    113
    Quote Originally Posted by mekender View Post
    Someone local should email the head of the PD and ask them their opinion on open carrying.
    If you can, just leave them be... I wanna blindside them. If not, please don't refer to this situation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamer View Post
    Get a good lawyer. Right now. Even if they never return your firearm, you should get enough of a judgement (DO NOT take a settlement)--AFTER you WIN the case--to buy several new replacements...

    Get a good lawyer.

    And one more thing. I know this should have nothing to do with an incident like this but what do you look like? Young, middle-aged, old? Black, white, hispanic, native American? Long hair or short hair?

    I'd be willing to be that you don't look ANYTHING like me (middle-aged, slim, clean-cut white guy) which unfortunately may explain the attitude you experienced...
    In the process of finding a good one now. I'll post up a pic later, but I'm 20 about 5'8", short hair, clean shaven... I was wearing my NC STATE hoodie though, with jeans and boots. I really don't think it would've mattered though what I was wearing.

    To clear up any confusion, I was not driving and I was carrying a Smith & Wesson 4006 in a Blackhawk SERPA holster -- it doesn't get more visible than that!

  19. #19
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    211
    Quote Originally Posted by calynn View Post
    If you can, just leave them be... I wanna blindside them. If not, please don't refer to this situation.



    In the process of finding a good one now. I'll post up a pic later, but I'm 20 about 5'8", short hair, clean shaven... I was wearing my NC STATE hoodie though, with jeans and boots. I really don't think it would've mattered though what I was wearing.

    To clear up any confusion, I was not driving and I was carrying a Smith & Wesson 4006 in a Blackhawk SERPA holster -- it doesn't get more visible than that!

    Here is 3lawyers in that area that is good.

    http://www.superpages.com/bp/Souther...PinfoContainer

    I was told Costanza is the go to man in moore county now.


    http://www.vancamp-law.com/CM/Custom/Attorneys.asp

    I know people Personally who use Eddie Meacham He is a good criminal Defense lawyer.


    I know a guy personally who was charged with murder in moore county his Attorney was James Van camp The out come was better than expected Mr van camp is another good one.
    http://www.vancamp-law.com/CM/Attorn...mesVanCamp.asp

    Just some of the lawyers off the top of my head in that area I know too be good.
    Not sure what their price range is.
    Last edited by hotrod8812; 11-04-2010 at 10:26 PM.

  20. #20
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Cameron NC, , USA
    Posts
    113
    Van-camp and Meechum work together. Know the work of both of them, looking for a specific 2nd amendment strong attorney at the time... and might've found one! Thanks for the advice though!

  21. #21
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    211
    Quote Originally Posted by calynn View Post
    Van-camp and Meechum work together. Know the work of both of them, looking for a specific 2nd amendment strong attorney at the time... and might've found one! Thanks for the advice though!
    No Problem, Good luck.

  22. #22
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Hickory, NC, ,
    Posts
    1,025
    Quote Originally Posted by calynn View Post
    The magistrate says that the reason the didn't try to bring me to the jail for falsification of records (they seriously didn't believe I got a permit from the SD) was because he wouldn't have signed off on anything of the sort.
    Purchase permit? Are the lunatics running the asylum? What if you were from out of state, or out of county? That's really stretching it to try and find something. After that, I'm surprised they did not pursue GATTTOTP. I also have reservations about most law suits. But once I have been illegally detained, charged, and my private property seized I think I would loose those reservations. Your call though. Good luck.

  23. #23
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Cameron NC, , USA
    Posts
    113
    Yeah, after they realized that I COULD (and did) buy the gun legally, they were trying to say that the only reason the sheriff issued the permit was because I was buying from my step-dad, but I was buying from him after he and my mother split... they said I'd falsified records since I'd said on my application that I was buying from my step-dad? Haha, right. They were just fishing. The Sheriff said not to worry, I was legit and won't be hearing anything from the SD, and that he'd tell the arresting PD the same thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by chiefjason View Post
    But once I have been illegally detained, charged, and my private property seized I think I would loose those reservations.
    They are lost. I tried to help them out, but since I didn't have a badge, I don't know the laws?! Wouldn't be as pissed if they hadn't seized my gun.

  24. #24
    Regular Member J_Oliver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Haw River, North Carolina
    Posts
    151

    Cool

    The more officers that lose jobs, get suspended and are made into examples for not knowing or deliberately making up/changing laws, the less they'll try and arrest us for exercising our rights. Make an example out of him and keep us posted. You have ALL our support.
    "I'd rather be judged by twelve than carried by six..."

    [ Kyd: "I think I'm gonna have "13 1/2" tattooed on my shoulder..."

    Me: "Why the hell would you do that?"

    Kyd: "Thats one judge, 12 jurors, and a half a chance I'm gonna get off..." ]

  25. #25
    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Grennsboro NC
    Posts
    5,358
    Several city police departments in WV have tried this bit of silliness--charging people with CC when they were OCing, and justifying it by saying that the gun couldn't be seen from the specific angle they were first viewing the person. In every case, they were thrown out by the judge, because when questioned about how the officer knew the accused was "carrying concealed", they responded that they saw it in a holster on their hip in plain view. To which the judge would respond, more or less, "Case Dismissed"...

    When it goes to court (and your case SHOULD go to court), all you need to do is ask the officer four questions, and the judge, one question:

    1) What is the plaintiff charged with? (he will say, CC without a permit)

    2) How did you know his was carrying a firearm? (he will say "well, I saw it...)

    3) How was it being carried? (he will have to say, in a holster, on his hip)

    4) Was it covered by a garment, coat, foreign object, or other means that prevented you from identifying it as a firearm? (he will say no)

    5) Your honor, I ask that this case be dismissed, because this charge is invalid under NC statute and case law.

    End of discussion. End of case. Case dismissed...

    Then, the VERY next thing you need to do is have your lawyer file a Federal 1983 civil rights violation suit against the INDIVIDUAL officer as an individual. He WILL NOT have "qualified immunity" because his actions were knowingly outside the law, and he filed false charges, violated your civil rights, and lied about the nature of several NC statutes in his police report. Filing fee for a Federal 1983 suit is only $300...

    You should be able to buy a VERY nice new handgun with the judgment you get from him.

    And hopefully he will be gracing the unemployment office with his un-badged presence very soon...

    And after you get HIM as an individual, you should petition the NC main office of the FBI to charge this Department for going along with his fraudulent, illegal activities under RICO statutes in Federal Courts, because the fact that this charge hasn't been summarily tossed by his shift supervisor or the DA is clear evidence of an "organized criminal conspiracy"...
    Last edited by Dreamer; 11-05-2010 at 10:18 PM.
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •