Carrying with safety on, and no round in the chamber

BigDave said:

Have him unload his gun, cock it and put on the safety and tell him go ahead and try his dammist to have that hammer hit with out taking off the safety.

If he cannot intentionally get the hammer to fall then whats the problem?

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His carry sidearm is a hammerless Taurus. But I'm sure he'd still get the concept

I will add my $.02 here. When I first started Ocing, I carried without a round in the chamber and with the safety on. It came with TIME and confidence in my firearm. I needed to put more rounds through my Beretta, and just learn even better how she worked. Even in the military, I didn't have her daily. After I learned that and that my daughter wouldn't be randomly shot with the safety on, I carried one in the pipe ever since. It's a time thing. Lastly, my SERPA helped a lot and Kydex over my nylon shoulder rig really helped.

+1 more for get a good holster.

Taurus

I have a Taurus PT 24/7 PRO DS. It has a feature I really like, after you chamber a round it is in SA. However if you push a little more on the manual safety it decocks and goes to DA until your first shot. This makes me feel more comfortable with one in the chamber.

Aaron1124 said:

I have a friend who recently started open carrying. He said he does not feel comfortable carrying with a round in the chamber, so he carries it with the loaded magazine and the safety on.


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What are your thoughts on this?

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What your friend needs to do is first learn as much as he can about the firearm he is carrying. Is the ONLY safety device on his pistol the Safety "switch" or are there layers of safety. Others have mentioned firing pin blocks/locks. Does his pistol have one? What about a half-cock position from which the hammer can't be released unless it is first pulled to a full-cock position? The key is regardless of which combination of safety's there are, he should know and understand them as well as other functions of his firearm. When he becomes more knowledgeable he will feel more "safe" without essentially carrying an unloaded gun.

Let's face it, he'd have a tough time with some firearms. He'd pull all the hairs out of his head trying to find the safety on a Sig P-229.

Thoughts on not fully loaded carry

My weapon of choice should be obvious to many people here: I carry a full size Springfield XD .45. The weapon is practical in the sense that there is no fumbling of a mechanical safety to make it ready to fire and your hand must have a solid grip on the weapon for it to do ANYthing. The following statement is a matter of personal preference when it comes to my style of carry: I always carry without a round in the chamber. Why? There are/were some considerations when it comes to carrying this way:

1) It was easy to load/unload the gun when carrying without a CPL. I didn't need to unholster and clear the weapon in public and cause an otherwise uneducated person to freak out -- which was common in the area I was living in (South Everett).

2) This may put me more at risk if the need to draw and fire arises, but I am not one who likes fighting and would rather give the BG every possible opportunity to reconsider his chosen lifestyle. I have practiced enough to where i can draw and cock the gun in one smooth motion. But that "click click" gives the BG pause and alerts possible witnesses. It may or may not have its intended effect and I might lose that extra split second, but it might also give me a strategic advantage over the situation, or it may cause the guy to lose his lunch and/or run away -- which may be done by the presence of the firearm itself, but regardless of if you are around guns or not, that "click click" means that I mean business.

Regardless of the tactics being used, there is never a guarantee of the intended result. What I intend above all else is to de-escalate if possible without shots being fired while still bringing any required force to bear as quickly as possible.

I carry a XDm40, 16+1. I was nervous about it at first since it has no manual safety but after carrying for so long and firing it a bunch I am comfortable enough that I don't worry about it.

My friend just bought himself a S&W M&P .45acp and he just carries 10 rounds. He leaves the chamber empty and I believe he does carry with the safety on as well. He is confident in his ability to draw and chamber a round that he doesn't worry about any problems that may arise from not running "cocked and locked".

It is all about personal preference in my opinion. You should carry how you feel comfortable.

I carry one of two Springfield XD 40S&W Subcompact or Service Model and always carry one in the pipe.
The XD has two safeties one on the trigger and one on the backbone of the grip, both must be depressed at the same time for the weapon to fire. It is designed to be carried that way.
Use a quality holster with the trigger guard being covered be in IWB or OWB considered a level 2 retention holster.

Unsure? try unloading your weapon and cock the weapon and try to fire the weapon with out having both depressed, it will not happen.

While it is a persons choice to carry a round chambered or not, my thoughts are why would you want to add another step to the process? for something else to go wrong. The object of this is to gain the advantage, not give it away.

The comment about giving the BG a second chance to reconsidered his choice, I say he made his last choice placing me in a position of having to use my firearm.

BigDave said:

Try, unloading your weapon and cock the weapon and try to fire the weapon with out having both depressed, it will not happen.

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When I first got my gun, I did that exact thing. I was very happy that nothing happened when either of the safeties was not depressed.

I am perfectly comfortable carrying either my Glock 21 (.45) or Glock 30 (.45) with a round in the chamber. Neither has any external safety and both have about a 4-5 pound trigger pull.

Most pistols are specifically designed to be defensive tools, and have a certain manual-of-arms that go with their particular operating system. With a quality holster that covers the trigger guard, and an operator's hands that know to keep their booger-hooker off of the bang-switch unless they are meaning to shoot, then any modern autopistol is safe to carry chambered.

Glocks, Kahrs, wife's Keltec (all DAO with no external/manual safety) are always carried chambered. Long, deliberate trigger pull prevents discharge unless it is forced.

Sigs, 3rd Generation S&W auto, Beretta, etc (DA/SA some with safety, some w/out) carried hammer down on a loaded chamber. Safety on- if preferred, but I don't. 12lbs of trigger pull x 3/4" of pull means the gun doesn't go off until I tell it to.

1911/Browning Hi-Power, etc.. (SA auto w/manual safety) carried hammer cocked, safety engaged on a chambered round. So long as you don't screw around with it, and know how to operate your gun, this can be one of the safest methods (especially for OCers concerned about a gun-grab potential) to carry. Most "thugs" will fumble with a cocked-and-locked auto for at least a few seconds, should one be able to get it from you. This time can be used to access and employ a back-up weapon.

-G20

SpyderTattoo said:

I am perfectly comfortable carrying either my Glock 21 (.45) or Glock 30 (.45) with a round in the chamber. Neither has any external safety and both have about a 4-5 pound trigger pull.

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Not intending to nitpick, but all Glocks do have an external trigger safety (see cite below). In practice however, I agree that for all intents and purposes the Glock is without traditional external safeties.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glock_pistol#Safety

SpyderTattoo said:

I am perfectly comfortable carrying either my Glock 21 (.45) or Glock 30 (.45) with a round in the chamber. Neither has any external safety and both have about a 4-5 pound trigger pull.

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"I am da only one in dis room, that I know of, pro-fesh-noe enuf to carry a GLOCK fody." ----testament to those who don't know how to handle a weapon.

For the rest of us, however, that do just fine with a chambered GLOCK with no safety, the GLOCK system serves us very well. Cheers.

Aaron1124 said:

I have a friend who recently started open carrying. He said he does not feel comfortable carrying with a round in the chamber, so he carries it with the loaded magazine and the safety on. I told him that in an emergency situation, he may not have time to chamber a round and de activate the safety switch before damage was done.

He said he doesn't feel comfortable, because he's worried that if his firearm drops out of his holster, or if he's in a car accident, that the gun will discharge.

What are your thoughts on this?

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I was the SAME exact way. It was a comfort thing. It took me about a day to realize how dumb it was, and I wouldn't have time to rack the slide if things went south. I then carried loaded/safed. After a few months I ditched the 92 for a Glock, with no safeties, and I always carried it loaded and ready to go, one in the chamber. Although the first few days were kinda iffy, still being somewhat new to guns.

As others have suggested, get him trained.

With anything.. Practice, practice, practice... It took a long time at the range to realize that I'd actually have to pull the trigger for it to go off.. When I first got my gun I even went so far as removing the barrel when dry firing it.. so scared that 'I have to make sure it's empty'... After awhile, you realize what's possible and what's probable, and as long as you follow the cardinal rules, you'll be OK.

In holster unless being shot or cleaned. Either way, it's being unloaded....

amzbrady said:

I have a Taurus PT 111 Millineum Pro and the best fit holster I have been able to find for it is a Bladetech for a glock 26. The holster flips the safety off when I holster the pistol. I dont feel comfortable carrying with a round chambered and the safety off. I called Taurus to find out about that, and I was told the PT 111 has a nine pound trigger pull and should not worry about a discharge, and that the safety was more there because of US laws than for actual safety. I couldnt believe that a taursus costomer service agent would advise carrying chambered with the safety off. It didnt give me enough of a warm fuzzy feeling to take his advice.

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I guess you don't like Glocks?

TechnoWeenie said:

I guess you don't like Glocks?

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Or Kahr's, or Springfield XD's, or REVOLVERS!

acmariner99 said:

I have practiced enough to where i can draw and cock the gun in one smooth motion.

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But have you practiced this "One Handed"? Have you ever considered that you might find yourself in a situation where you have only one hand available to draw and fire? Never happen you say? What if the so called Bad Guy shot you first? What if one of your hands/arms is immobilized for any reason? Sorry, but being only half prepared is really unprepared. A firearm that can't be drawn and fired with one hand may be a handicap in some instances and since we can't pick and choose I would rather have a fully loaded firearm on my hip.

amlevin said:

But have you practiced this "One Handed"? Have you ever considered that you might find yourself in a situation where you have only one hand available to draw and fire? Never happen you say? What if the so called Bad Guy shot you first? What if one of your hands/arms is immobilized for any reason? Sorry, but being only half prepared is really unprepared. A firearm that can't be drawn and fired with one hand may be a handicap in some instances and since we can't pick and choose I would rather have a fully loaded firearm on my hip.

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I'm always worried that someone will try something when I'm shopping or walking in my apartment from my car. I always have at least 1 arm full in either of these situations and it makes me a little paranoid.

- Wife, girlfriend, significant other, guy you met in the men's room grabs onto your arm in terror when BG accosts you ...

- Young son or daughter in a parking lot with cars going by whose drivers are too busy texting each other to look ....

- Grocery bag, Iphone, bottle of 1995 Krug "Clos Ambonnay" Brut Champagne, or a carefully balanced plate of hors d'oeuvres in your hand ...

- Stranger who passed just a little too close and grabbed your arm ...

- The dog that's latched onto the sleeve of your jacket with its sharp, teeth filled jaws ...

- The immobilizing pain in your arm brought about by the first clue you were being assaulted; a gunshot...



... all those make two-handed manipulation of your weapon either difficult or impossible. IF you had it scheduled on your day-planner that you were gonna Need your pistol in the next 3 minutes you'd be making it ready NOW, right? An emergency, by it's very nature can't be scheduled; but it can be anticipated and planned for.






... do you really want to handicap your ability to live?

amlevin said:

But have you practiced this "One Handed"? Have you ever considered that you might find yourself in a situation where you have only one hand available to draw and fire? Never happen you say? What if the so called Bad Guy shot you first? What if one of your hands/arms is immobilized for any reason? Sorry, but being only half prepared is really unprepared. A firearm that can't be drawn and fired with one hand may be a handicap in some instances and since we can't pick and choose I would rather have a fully loaded firearm on my hip.

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+ a LOT

I was actually asked this question about 2 months ago from M1 and my Dad. It's honestly something VERY handy to train on.

There's a reason its called a handgun, and not a HANDSgun.

-G20