Doug Huffman Has Been Banned

jimd_21 said:

I am fairly new to the forums and i do alot of browsing and reading to help educate myself and offer an opinion here and their. With that said i have seen alot of negativity, brash, and down right rude comments. And thru my observations they come from a select few who seem they think they can get away with it because of age, experience, or having a certain number of posts.

I see these forums as a way to learn, ask questions, and share experiences and try to offer my help. When i see alot of the negative comments, it makes me wonder why anyone would want to come back to post at OCDO.

I have to say i agree with the bans and think more should be handed out to help curb the problem.

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I agree with MOST of this, not all but most. And I for one WILL renew my membership at the proper time!

JamesCanby said:

Only John (and Doug and his BCCs) know what was in the PMs.

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Not anymore. I've gotten a hold of a copy of the relevant email but will not post it ,nor PM it, pending the answers to a few PM's. Even then, I may not due to some personal affronts within. I don't want to get into any trouble myself.

Without commenting on the email; I think we can all agree that forum rules were broken no matter the perception of how slightly or greatly. I believe most of us will respect the Administrator's decisions as owner of the forums to do what he wishes with his private property.

I believe the real problem I and others have, and the question, is the fairness of how those rules are applied. Equal protection under the (law) rules; so to speak. It's still the owners decision, but that decision would be cast in a more favorable light if punishment were doled out equally and with an even hand.

Strike one
Strike Two
Strike Three?

Mitigating circumstances; such as usually posting good information?

Something solid so that questions of why one was banned for breaking the rules and not another, disappear.

there is much debate, and discussion here. but my heart is still broken.

mcx said:

there is much debate, and discussion here. But my heart is still broken.

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bring doug back.

I support Administrator on this decision. While Doug was capable of doing excellent work in terms of research, his never ending bashing of every group that has tried to enhance Liberty in this state was a real problem. We finally have an organization in WCI that is doing more than all the other groups put together to move the carry effort forward but Doug just couldn't resist knocking it. This forum will be healthier without him.

I've stayed out of the internal WI squabbles, because I don't live there and am unlikely to even visit. I follow the news because I support all Americans' right to carry. I support the forum owners in their right to control their private property in whatever way they see fit; if I find their control unacceptable, I know where the door is.

That said... WTF?!?

Speaking solely about their relative contributions to this forum, Doug Huffman is a gold mine, and Spartacus is a flaming sack of wet cow pies.

This is yet another head-scratcher. Sometimes I wonder if John and Mike really read the forum.

Speaking solely about their relative contributions to this forum, Doug Huffman is a gold mine, and Spartacus is a flaming sack of wet cow pies.

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Speaking solely about their contributions OFF the forum, Spartacus is a gold mine and Doug Huffman is a flaming sack of wet cow pies.

I believe perhaps what the forum moderators are hoping to accomplish is recognize that the real work happens OFF the forum and the best use of the forum is for people that actually DO make things happen "in the real world" to collaborate online as a tool to help REAL WORLD activities.

Bickering online serves NO ONE and perhaps a temporary ban for someone that participated in the bickering but makes HUGE real world contributions was an attempt to give a valuable real-world resource the opportunity to continue to use the forum for real-world good.

Meanwhile someone who made NO real-world contributions yet sniped INCESSANTLY at people and GROUPS (WCI) that have was NOT worth keeping around when he undertakes a conspiracy to hijack the forum.

Perhaps the administrators also want to END THE DRAMA, but its clear from this thread that there are some who just can't let the drama go.

Wisconsin Carry said:

Speaking solely about their contributions OFF the forum, Spartacus is a gold mine and Doug Huffman is a flaming sack of wet cow pies.

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Cool! Then we agree. Keep Spartacus off the forum and let Doug back on. :monkey

you guys are getting mean in your old age(s). Listen to your heart, listen to The Beatles!

added on edit; lets all write Walker, get a pardon for Doug, and Sparticus!................and a cheeseburger for me, i want a cheese burger!

Well it's a bit of a shock. I don't know anything other than what I've read on here, but I know John's a reasonable and patient man and I will assume he made a reasonable decision. I do not believe John would make an accusation that he was unable to corroborate. I'm sorry this happened, but I think in addition to the valuable contribution he made, unfortunately Doug may have been his own worse enemy too. One part of me has to admire his subversive tendencies, but I know the Administrators certainly did not have to admire nor tolerate disruption of a forum that they provide as a free service to the public. I tried to avoid the whole Spartacus issue because I basically stopped reading the threads that got degraded with the back and forth attacks. Those kinds of attacks don't interest me because they're irrelevant. But trying to be objective about it, it appears to me that Spartacus was temporarily suspended to save the feelings of people on here. Disruption of the forum was a side effect of that whole matter. Apparently from what John has stated, he acted because disruption of the forum was the goal, and not just a side effect of whatever Doug planned to do. But whatever, the matter is not in my hands and I'm happy that it is not.

Doug and I butted heads a few times, but I learned to tolerate his approach. Yes, he often contributed useful information among much junk mail. His style made it sometimes difficult to sort the useful from the junk, but that's our problem, not his. Nobody was forced to read or digest Doug's contributions.

The sooner everyone makes an effort to stick to a discussion of issues, and leave the personal jabs out, the better this forum will be. I know as well as anyone that it is difficult to not have an emotional reaction to certain things that are said, but I urge us all to avoid immediately voicing that emotional reaction as one's stance. To do so makes us too similar to anti-gun groups and individuals who always lead off with some sort of emotionally-charged statement, and nothing beyond that because they do not think past the emotions.

As for promises to not renew WCI memberships, to me that's not unlike kicking the dog when you get home from a bad day. Why take it out on WCI which has nothing to do with running the forum? As Nik pointed out, WCI exists well beyond postings on OCDO. Your membership, or lack of membership, ought to reflect whether your agree or disagree with WCI's approach and goals. WCI has no approach or goals or involvement with the decisions of OCDO administrators. I can't speak on behalf of OCDO administrators, but I doubt they care whether a person withdraws their participation from the forum. I suspect their goal is to provide a forum that is conducive for a good dissemination of information and to allow like-minded people to communicate with one another. There goal is not to make any particular person happy.

If you believe that it is appropriate to end membership based on the actions of a third party (in this instance OCDO) then I will suggest that you haven't thought it out very well and perhaps you'll reconsider when you've cooled a bit.

I would also suggest that the same goes for a decision to withdraw participation in the OCDO forum as some sort of protest. If you believe you have nothing of value to contribute, then fine. Don't post. If you believe your contributions are valuable, post-- but don't deceive yourself into thinking the forum will fall to pieces if you no longer post your valuable contributions. It won't. It will chug along as it always has.

the gun that is shot hath spoken, and i am in full agreement. looks like we need a 'neutral zone' treaty here!

Although I don't live in Wisconsin, I'm interested in what goes on there. I wish them all the best.

In the "olden days" (just a few years ago), I used to participate in another "packing" forum. The information on there was a big help to me, as someone who had never carried before, either openly or concealed. But it finally had to go away because a few people couldn't resist bashing. Some of the best information seemed to be targeted the most, and there seemed to be no way to get the bashers to quit. True trolls for sure. I've been afraid lately that OCDO was headed the same way. Thank heavens for good administrators.

If certain people had been banned from the old packing site, that forum would still be going strong, I think. Kudos on the administrators of this forum to demand civility.

paul@paul-fisher.com said:

Cool! Then we agree. Keep Spartacus off the forum and let Doug back on. :monkey

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Paul, do not twist what I wrote.

read it in its entirety. If we want to forum to be something that is efficacious in the real world, we should give the benefit of the doubt and opportunity for those who behave poorly ON the forum but make huge contributions OFF the forum to adjust their online behavior to be part of the forum. Their real world behavior needs no adjustment.

Really, what is the goal of the forum? Cyber sniping, or to translate to real world action?

If someone does things in the real world, its a reason to offer them a 2nd chance to utilize the resource of the forum.

Doug HAS been warned before. I've seen it posted. Doug even once registered the username "Wisconsin Carry, Inc. President" used an avatar matching our logo and began to post comments as if he were a WCI officer.

So save me the Doug pity party.

He's done some VERY devious crap on here and it sounds like more was to come.

I recognize that its amazing how a "common enemy" unites people, and in Spartacus, many of you found a common enemy, but Doug has been doing devious $hit LONG before Spartacus hit ANY of your radar.

Doug has second, third, and forth chances. I presume if when Spartacus comes back. IF he comes back, if he still can't stop engaging those who engage him, his next ban may be permanent. Regardless, whether he participates here or not, I'm confident the huge contributions he makes offline will go on.

For that, he will continue to be my friend in freedom.

I have to admit I am stupefied. Not so much as to Dougs abrupt dismissal but... there does seem to be an inequity here...

I am not quiting or leaving etc. but I am still baffled as to why Doug in the first place and the apparent coddling of an offender so brash and utterly disruptive, gets a slap on the wrist...

A mystery to be sure. Watching for now...

Wisconsin Carry said:

IF he comes back, if he still can't stop engaging those who engage him, his next ban may be permanent.

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You are making him sound like he is only defending himself. He starts the attacks on newbies because they mis speak or say something he doesn't agree with then people rise to the newbys defense and he then starts attacking them.

Then he brags that he gets rid of people that need to be gone. A good example for us all

and just when you thought it couldn't get any worse, the aliens showed up, but it's cool, they eat terrorists, and pee gasoline..........doug and sparticus went out to negotiate with them, but they aint come back yet, and i'm getting a little worried............

I am going to stop talking about this. It just gets my blood pressure up. I appreciate the difficult job that the administrators have. I can only assume others have more information than I do.

comp45acp said:

I support Administrator on this decision. While Doug was capable of doing excellent work in terms of research, his never ending bashing of every group that has tried to enhance Liberty in this state was a real problem. We finally have an organization in WCI that is doing more than all the other groups put together to move the carry effort forward but Doug just couldn't resist knocking it. This forum will be healthier without him.

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Does WCI have it's own forum or website? If so ban him from that, if not then they should get one. Don't ban a person because he disagrees with the Wisconsin gun orgs. Doug has made great comments on many different state forum and to lose his sarcasm, wit, and perspective is a real shame.

this is what it's down to, this is how bad it has gotten; i cant divulge confidential stuff, but one of the brothers got some heat applied to him recently in the milwaukee vicinity, and is afraid to post about it for the body slam he might get. is this going to be our legacy?! beyond that i aint sayin poop.