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What does, a dog, no knock, WAC, and ATF, have in common?

1245A Defender

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2009
Messages
4,365
Location
north mason county, Washington, USA
i have no cites, very little info, and this isnt even first hand!

a friend of my friend is a WAC member,
early this morning ATF broke down his door,
shot his dog,
almost shot him,
took all his guns,
didnt arrest him.

reason given, that he sells gun "to make a profit"!
 

BigDave

Opt-Out Members
Joined
Nov 22, 2006
Messages
3,456
Location
Yakima, Washington, USA
And I am selling the Golden Gate Bridge Cheap, interested?

GoldenGateBridge.jpg
 

Bo

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 17, 2009
Messages
123
Location
, ,
Strange, I'm not seeing anything about this situation in the local news media ...
 

blackmarine

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2010
Messages
56
Location
Easton, WA
And I am selling the Golden Gate Bridge Cheap, interested?

GoldenGateBridge.jpg

Considering how broke the state of California is, I think a bucket of quarters ought to do it. Then again, you asked for a buck and a quarter... Saying it out loud, it sounds close enough. Bucket of quarters, buck and a quarter... I'll take the latter. Deal? :banana:
 

blackmarine

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2010
Messages
56
Location
Easton, WA
Not to get too far off topic, but I am not against "no knock warrants" in certain situations.

Well, suppose you were at home watching the tube with your wife/girlfriend when suddenly your door gets kicked in and a flashbang goes off... You're disoriented, your wife doesn't know what's going on, suddenly you have a boot in your neck, an MP5 in your face, your retinas are burning, and all you can think is "WTF is going on?!?! What did I do? Who the hell is in my house?" There was no knock, no forewarning, just all of a sudden you go from making time with the lady to face buried in the carpet with no idea of what's going on. Then they say they "think" you may have done something.

Essentially, my point is if you give them an inch, they'll take a mile. What's to stop them from abusing even EXTREMELY limited circumstances for a no knock warrant? They already abuse enough things, why give them another? (Remember the Magna Carta).

You're so quick to condemn the Hitlers of the world, you're so quick to condemn Nazism (aka Fascism, which, for the record, I despise), but then you advocate it in the form of no-knock warrants!

In closing, we simply can not give agents of the state and/or country that much leeway, we can not give them that much power. After all, all power is supposed to be inherent to the people, and if WE relinquish too much power, we will be left powerless.
 

END_THE_FED

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 19, 2010
Messages
925
Location
Seattle, Washington, USA
Well, suppose you were at home watching the tube with your wife/girlfriend when suddenly your door gets kicked in and a flashbang goes off... You're disoriented, your wife doesn't know what's going on, suddenly you have a boot in your neck, an MP5 in your face, your retinas are burning, and all you can think is "WTF is going on?!?! What did I do? Who the hell is in my house?" There was no knock, no forewarning, just all of a sudden you go from making time with the lady to face buried in the carpet with no idea of what's going on. Then they say they "think" you may have done something.

Essentially, my point is if you give them an inch, they'll take a mile. What's to stop them from abusing even EXTREMELY limited circumstances for a no knock warrant? They already abuse enough things, why give them another? (Remember the Magna Carta).

You're so quick to condemn the Hitlers of the world, you're so quick to condemn Nazism (aka Fascism, which, for the record, I despise), but then you advocate it in the form of no-knock warrants!

In closing, we simply can not give agents of the state and/or country that much leeway, we can not give them that much power. After all, all power is supposed to be inherent to the people, and if WE relinquish too much power, we will be left powerless.

Especially considering the fact that sometimes the cops go to the wrong house.

You hear the sound of a door breaking in, you hear the sound of multiple men shouting, but being half asleep you cant hear what they are saying. You quickly grab your pistol and flashlight, walk out the door.............. a few moments, and 75 shots later you have 6 bullets in your body, 30, in your floor 30 in your walls, and 9 in your ceiling. You are now paralyzed for life and perhaps even charged with threatening the lives of the officers.

When its all over someone discovers, oh this is 1234 N.E fake ST? ooops we wanted 1234 SE fake st. sorry our bad.
 

devildoc5

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2010
Messages
791
Location
Somewhere over run with mud(s)
Especially considering the fact that sometimes the cops go to the wrong house.

You hear the sound of a door breaking in, you hear the sound of multiple men shouting, but being half asleep you cant hear what they are saying. You quickly grab your pistol and flashlight, walk out the door.............. a few moments, and 75 shots later you have 6 bullets in your body, 30, in your floor 30 in your walls, and 9 in your ceiling. You are now paralyzed for life and perhaps even charged with threatening the lives of the officers.

When its all over someone discovers, oh this is 1234 N.E fake ST? ooops we wanted 1234 SE fake st. sorry our bad.

EXCELLENT POINT... the other thing that bears in mind is the fact that WA state law CLEARLY and WITHOUT any sort of compunctions states that I am entitled to defend myself in ANY place I have the legal right to be at.... If "ZOG/someone" just busts down my door without any sort of warning or WARRANT how I am to know they are the FATPO (Federal Anti Terrorism POlice)? If they dont have they COMMON DECENCY to respect me and my property than what gives them the right to say that I CAN'T shoot them as I dont know who the F!#@$ they are???!!!???!!!????!!!!!

Ammurica needs to change and change SOON.

I for one WILL NOT stand for this kind of BS high and mighty Gubmet knows all and is only looking out for you BS!

The time to change the status quo is quickly approaching...what side will you be on???
 

sudden valley gunner

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
16,674
Location
Whatcom County
Well, suppose you were at home watching the tube with your wife/girlfriend when suddenly your door gets kicked in and a flashbang goes off... You're disoriented, your wife doesn't know what's going on, suddenly you have a boot in your neck, an MP5 in your face, your retinas are burning, and all you can think is "WTF is going on?!?! What did I do? Who the hell is in my house?" There was no knock, no forewarning, just all of a sudden you go from making time with the lady to face buried in the carpet with no idea of what's going on. Then they say they "think" you may have done something.

Essentially, my point is if you give them an inch, they'll take a mile. What's to stop them from abusing even EXTREMELY limited circumstances for a no knock warrant? They already abuse enough things, why give them another? (Remember the Magna Carta).

You're so quick to condemn the Hitlers of the world, you're so quick to condemn Nazism (aka Fascism, which, for the record, I despise), but then you advocate it in the form of no-knock warrants!

In closing, we simply can not give agents of the state and/or country that much leeway, we can not give them that much power. After all, all power is supposed to be inherent to the people, and if WE relinquish too much power, we will be left powerless.

+1000

An then there's the old guy in Colorado who got killed when they raided the wrong house, the governments response something to the effect, he'd still be alive if he didn't own a gun.
:banghead::banghead:
 

sudden valley gunner

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
16,674
Location
Whatcom County
i have no cites, very little info, and this isnt even first hand!

a friend of my friend is a WAC member,
early this morning ATF broke down his door,
shot his dog,
almost shot him,
took all his guns,
didnt arrest him.

reason given, that he sells gun "to make a profit"!

I'm not going to be douche and jump to the conclusion that a well respected and posted member on here is selling me a BS story.

I understand the reason why you are being vague and if you can share more details as you learn more about this case in PM or later I would like to know more about this.
 
Last edited:

Aaron1124

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 5, 2009
Messages
2,044
Location
Kent, Washington, USA
That's why a professional organization like a police force NEEDS to be absolutely 100% sure of their target house, There should be no ifs, ands or butts on the certainty of it. If a police force is getting the wrong house on a warrant, then maybe they need to re-evaluate theirs career choice.

I look at it like this: In a case of apprehending a heavily armed and violent group of suspects, knocking prior to a warrant could be a death wish. It's basically alerting them to go grab their weapons to engage in a fire fight. I do not see how this in unconstitutional in any way if it comes by way of a court issued warrant and sufficient evidence shows that a no knock warrant is encouraged to help protect the lives of the officers.

The U.S. Constitution is designed to be interpreted. If the Supreme Court feels that no knock warrants are still within the realms of the Constitution and the 4th Amendment, then I see absolutely nothing wrong with that, as long as sufficient evidence is presented to suggest it's the only reasonable option.

The power should be given to the State's, and organizations like the DEA should be abolished, leaving full Federal Authority to the FBI.

I honestly see no constitutional problem for no knock warrants under the general circumstances of:

# Circumstances that present a threat of physical violence
# There is "reason to believe that evidence would likely be destroyed if advance notice were given"
# Knocking and announcing would be dangerous or "futile"
# However, the Court expressly stated that whether or not reasonable suspicion exists depends in no way on whether police must destroy property in order to enter

As long as absolute, credible evidence is provided to determine certainty on their target house.
 
Last edited:

tannerwaterbury

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 21, 2009
Messages
269
Location
Kelso, Washington, USA
And I am selling the Golden Gate Bridge Cheap, interested?

GoldenGateBridge.jpg

Sorry, that bridge was mine for years. I called Private Eminent Domain.

So what in the hell was the BATF thinking? Was this even reasonable? SERIOUSLY, YOU CAN'T MAKE A PROFIT SELLING GUNS?!!! WHO IN THE HELL ARE THEY TO DETERMINE THAT?!!

I am going to blow a gasket here, this reminds me of the Redcoats coming to Concord to confiscate the guns from the Minuteman.
 

GreatWhiteLlama

Regular Member
Joined
May 29, 2007
Messages
287
Location
Bothell, Washington, USA
Especially considering the fact that sometimes the cops go to the wrong house.

You hear the sound of a door breaking in, you hear the sound of multiple men shouting, but being half asleep you cant hear what they are saying. You quickly grab your pistol and flashlight, walk out the door.............. a few moments, and 75 shots later you have 6 bullets in your body, 30, in your floor 30 in your walls, and 9 in your ceiling. You are now paralyzed for life and perhaps even charged with threatening the lives of the officers.

When its all over someone discovers, oh this is 1234 N.E fake ST? ooops we wanted 1234 SE fake st. sorry our bad.

http://www.cato.org/raidmap/
 
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