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Thread: Is Tennessee really a SHALL ISSUE state?

  1. #1
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    Is Tennessee really a SHALL ISSUE state?

    How can Tennessee be a "shall issue" State if my permit is permanently suspended by an employee of the State with no proof, evidence, or sworn affidavit? It seems, however, that Florida is a "shall issue" State because they just issued me a handgun carry permit.

    Things that make me wonder.

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    Regular Member Kingfish's Avatar
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    Um...You were the one who canceled your appeal. So, you are the one that gave up your permit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingfish View Post
    Um...You were the one who canceled your appeal. So, you are the one that gave up your permit.
    Which came first the suspension or the appeal? The TN permit is permanently suspended with no process set forth to get it back. Furthermore, the permit was illegally suspended.
    Last edited by kwikrnu; 11-30-2010 at 10:32 AM.

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    Regular Member Kingfish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwikrnu View Post
    with no process set forth to get it back.
    There was an appeal that you canceled....Thus, it is YOUR fault the permit is permanently gone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingfish View Post
    There was an appeal that you canceled....Thus, it is YOUR fault the permit is permanently gone.
    The TN AG says the State may regulate the issue of permits and the carry of guns. Does this mean the State can decide to whom to issue, deny, suspend, and revoke based upon the decision of an employee with no evidence, proof, or affidavit of any criminal activity?

    This is why the Supreme Court will rule in my favor. As a side note, I have a Florida handgun permit. When I move to FL I can carry in Tennessee when I choose.

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    Regular Member sst0185's Avatar
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    You gonna DuraCoat yer AK to look like a gator?

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    Regular Member HvyMtl's Avatar
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    Guys, avoid the snide comments, as it typically closes the thread...

    That said, I think you may have made an error in not going through with your Administrative Review Process (the appeal) as such processes have been found Constitutional... Since you canceled the appeal process, the Court may use your act against you, by stating you had the ability to appeal, and chose not to. Now, if you had gone through the process, and then have them state there was no way to, lawfully, re-instate your permit, or given some non-legit reasoning, your case would be far more valid...

    So, to answer your question, they did grant you the permit in the first place. So, yes, it is a Shall Issue state.

    And, if Florida finds out your permit was revoked in Tennessee, they may revoke, too...
    Last edited by HvyMtl; 11-30-2010 at 11:42 AM.
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    Regular Member sst0185's Avatar
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    Sorry

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    Regular Member HvyMtl's Avatar
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    Excellent. A true man apologizes when he realizes his error.

    I just don't want the thread cut down before it gets good...

    But, I bet it will, as there are those who cannot help themselves, and will take the low road...
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    Quote Originally Posted by HvyMtl View Post
    That said, I think you may have made an error in not going through with your Administrative Review Process (the appeal) as such processes have been found Constitutional... Since you canceled the appeal process, the Court may use your act against you, by stating you had the ability to appeal, and chose not to. Now, if you had gone through the process, and then have them state there was no way to, lawfully, re-instate your permit, or given some non-legit reasoning, your case would be far more valid...

    So, to answer your question, they did grant you the permit in the first place. So, yes, it is a Shall Issue state.

    And, if Florida finds out your permit was revoked in Tennessee, they may revoke, too...
    Please cite the Florida law which would revoke my Florida permit.

    Cite the administrative review process for the handgun carry permit which has been ruled constitutional. My permit was suspended with no hearing, which means my fundamental civil rights were suspended w/o a hearing.
    Last edited by kwikrnu; 11-30-2010 at 06:24 PM.

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    It was issued at one point. That meets the "shall issue" definition. "Shall keep" is another issue altogether.

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    Quote Originally Posted by palerider116 View Post
    It was issued at one point. That meets the "shall issue" definition. "Shall keep" is another issue altogether.
    I meet all requirements for the State to issue in tca 39-17-1351 if Tennessee does not issue are they shall issue?

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    Quote Originally Posted by palerider116 View Post
    It was issued at one point. That meets the "shall issue" definition. "Shall keep" is another issue altogether.
    Slow for copy.

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    Qwik , maybe you have said before and I missed it , why did you cancel your appeal? Second question , can you reopen your appeal?

    Having canceled the appeal yourself seems to me like cutting your own throat.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jayspapa View Post
    Qwik , maybe you have said before and I missed it , why did you cancel your appeal? Second question , can you reopen your appeal?

    Having canceled the appeal yourself seems to me like cutting your own throat.
    There is no more appeal. My permit was suspended with no hearing which is a violation of my civil rights. I withdrew the appeal because there is no need. If the State suspended your right to speak and said you have 30 days to appeal or you would lose the right forever is that legal under the constitution? Do you appeal or file a civil rights lawsuit? I made the mistake of appealing, but realized my mistake, filed a lawsuit, and dropped the appeal.

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    Regular Member HvyMtl's Avatar
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    Ok. Your permit was revoked. You then have an appeal process. You did not follow the process, but personally canceled the appeal.

    You claim you dropped the appeal process as "there was no need." Please explain.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HvyMtl View Post
    Ok. Your permit was revoked. You then have an appeal process. You did not follow the process, but personally canceled the appeal.

    You claim you dropped the appeal process as "there was no need." Please explain.
    The suspension of my permit was illegal. My permit was suspended w/o a hearing. It was suspended for a reason not allowed by the Legislature. It was suspended w/o proof, sworn testimony, or affidavit. I'm not going to play their game and it is now suspended indefinately. It is illegal to prohibit the carry of handguns w/o a permit.

  18. #18
    Regular Member HvyMtl's Avatar
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    So... You did not go ahead with the appeal process, because you did not want to "play their game."

    Yet, any court will note you decided not go through the process listed in the law...

    Which could kill your court case.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HvyMtl View Post
    So... You did not go ahead with the appeal process, because you did not want to "play their game."

    Yet, any court will note you decided not go through the process listed in the law...

    Which could kill your court case.
    Do you mean to say that the exercise of a fundamental right may be denied for 2 months w/o a hearing? According to Tennessee law people charged with a felony crime are given a hearing before their handgun carry permits are suspended.

    The handgun appeals process is their illegal game and I won't play.

    The whole appeal is a moot issue. There is no provision in TN law to appeal a suspended handgun permit after the 30 days to appeal is over or the appeal withdrawn. There is no process for someone with a suspended or revoked permit to get a permit once suspended or revoked. Further, the Department of safety may decide to reinstate at any moment.
    Last edited by kwikrnu; 12-03-2010 at 05:56 PM.

  20. #20
    Regular Member HvyMtl's Avatar
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    http://www.michie.com/tennessee/lpex...#JD_39-17-1353

    Hmm. Seems a bit cut and dried to me, you requested your appeal process, and then canceled it, which seems to have made the decision "final."

    Point to where they have the right to reinstate, as you say they might:
    http://www.michie.com/tennessee/lpex...templates&2.0#
    After re-reading, I think you probably would have had your permit reinstated, barring no info not shared, or not known...

    Again, I still see the Courts pointing to this part of the code and stating you failed to follow through...
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by HvyMtl View Post
    http://www.michie.com/tennessee/lpex...#JD_39-17-1353

    Hmm. Seems a bit cut and dried to me, you requested your appeal process, and then canceled it, which seems to have made the decision "final."

    Point to where they have the right to reinstate, as you say they might:
    http://www.michie.com/tennessee/lpex...templates&2.0#
    After re-reading, I think you probably would have had your permit reinstated, barring no info not shared, or not known...

    Again, I still see the Courts pointing to this part of the code and stating you failed to follow through...
    The point is I do not have to go to court to exercise my right to bear arms. Show me in the constitution where I have to prove in court that I have done nothing wrong in order to bear arms. I've not been charged with a crime or any other offense which would disqualify me from own, possessing, purchasing, transporting or carrying arms.

    The facts are clear there was no hearing to suspend my permit. I've not been charged of any offense which would allow the State to revoke my ability to carry arms. The State of Tennessee criminalizes the carry of loaded handguns without a permit. The law is unconstitutional and has been since at least 1989.

    The Department of Safety incorrectly revoked my handgun carry permit in 2008. The permit was reinstated about a month later with no hearing. That is precedent.

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    seems to me................

    there is a lot of missing information and a lot of drama.

    Good luck in Heaven's waiting room!

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    Regular Member sultan62's Avatar
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    Dead thread, concerned user banned.

    I do think he was right about the issue though. Regardless of what happened AFTER the permit was suspended, the initial suspension was illegal.
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  24. #24
    Regular Member Kingfish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sultan62 View Post
    Dead thread, concerned user banned.

    I do think he was right about the issue though. Regardless of what happened AFTER the permit was suspended, the initial suspension was illegal.
    We don't know that. The OP canceled the appeal hearing so we don't know what evidence the state had to suspend the permit. I would suspect the state may have had grounds and that is why the appeal was canceled.

  25. #25
    Regular Member HvyMtl's Avatar
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    Yes, Kwik got banned, due to trolling, so we will have to look elsewhere to find out how well, or not well, he did in court...

    Again, the info is not clear, as not all has been given...

    IMHO, Kwik not hiring a licensed attorney to represent himself may have negatively impacted his case...

    I also think his canceling of the hearing also negatively impacted his case...

    But, I think we will hear, 3rd hand, how well or not well he did...
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