Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 34

Thread: A PERSON'S "right to remain silent" after being arrested will be abolished.

  1. #1
    Regular Member Haz.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    I come from a land downunder.
    Posts
    1,227

    A PERSON'S "right to remain silent" after being arrested will be abolished.

    Anyone reading the thread "Who needs a gun in Australia," will find that crime in Australia has not substancially decreased as the government claims, since the firearms ban. Now, the NSW police are campaigning to have a persons right to remain silent abolished.

    http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/new...-1225964137276

    Right to silence could be revoked Joe Hildebrand From: The Daily Telegraph December 02, 2010 12:00AM

    A PERSON'S "right to remain silent" with impunity after being arrested will be effectively abolished under a police campaign to be taken to the next state election.
    Instead of what a person says being used against them in a court, police say a person's refusal to speak should also be able to be used against them in some circumstances.

    The NSW Police Association will launch a campaign against the current laws in an effort to pressure both parties ahead of March's poll.

    Police say professional criminals are exploiting the right to silence, making it harder for police to obtain convictions.

    However, civil libertarians said the move would result in more innocent people in jail.

    Police association president Scott Weber said the changes would make it harder for criminals to dodge the law and protect innocent people.

    He called on the State Government to adopt laws similar to those in the UK. "The British parliament changed the application of the right to silence over 15 years ago to combat the growing misuse of this right, and to deal with the rise of organised crime and terrorism," Mr Weber said.

    "The British model still gives people the right to stay silent but allows for courts to draw an inference of guilt from a person's silence in certain situations."

    NSW Council for Civil Liberties president Cameron Murphy said being pressured to answer questions that might incriminate them would result in countless innocent people going to jail. "It doesn't serve any benefit," he said.

  2. #2
    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Va Beach, Occupied VA
    Posts
    3,037
    I'm more disturbed by the poll results than I am at the article. That even one person would consider this a "good" idea is deplorable.

    That they are CARRYING THE POLL is downright terrifying.
    The quiet war has begun, with silent weapons
    And the newest slavery is to keep the people poor, and stupid
    Novos ordo seclorum ~ Mustaine

    Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

  3. #3
    Regular Member Haz.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    I come from a land downunder.
    Posts
    1,227
    Quote Originally Posted by wylde007 View Post
    I'm more disturbed by the poll results than I am at the article. That even one person would consider this a "good" idea is deplorable.

    That they are CARRYING THE POLL is downright terrifying.
    Just goes to show what a bunch of loosers we have become down-under. The younger generation as a whole have been brainwashed by the yuppie teachers who fill our places of learning. The poloticians will be falling over themselves the appease these idiots. Once this is passed and made law we will finally be "A POLICE STATE."

    Wont be long and as soon as we walk outside our homes we will hear: "Ve vant to see you papers please."

  4. #4
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Fairborn, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    13,063
    What disturbs me most is that a right that protects individuals from the state can be abolished by a majority vote.

    This is the problem with democracy and why I am glad that we do not live in one.

  5. #5
    Regular Member Fallschirmjäger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Georgia, USA
    Posts
    3,915
    Such a poorly worded poll .. "Should Criminals Lose the Right to Remain Silent"

    Apparently, just the mere act of being arrested proves guilt.

  6. #6
    Regular Member Haz.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    I come from a land downunder.
    Posts
    1,227
    Quote Originally Posted by Fallschirmjäger View Post
    Such a poorly worded poll .. "Should Criminals Lose the Right to Remain Silent"

    Apparently, just the mere act of being arrested proves guilt.
    Yes, I thought that as soon as I read the article.

  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Fallon, Nevada, USA
    Posts
    5,580
    Quote Originally Posted by Fallschirmjäger View Post
    Such a poorly worded poll .. "Should Criminals Lose the Right to Remain Silent"

    Apparently, just the mere act of being arrested proves guilt.
    The pollster should be pointed out as "poisoning the well."
    "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

  8. #8
    Regular Member sultan62's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Clayton, NC
    Posts
    1,319

    http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/new...-1225964137276

    Police say professional criminals are exploiting the right to silence, making it harder for police to obtain convictions.
    It is not exploiting. It is using it exactly as intended.
    "They don't give a damn about any trumpet playing band
    It ain't what they call rock and roll
    And the Sultans...
    Yeah the Sultans, they play Creole"

    OCDO Member
    NCGO Member

  9. #9
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Fairborn, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    13,063
    The once distinctive and pleasant Australian accent has been morphing of late:

    "Ve haf vays of makink you talk!"

  10. #10
    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    In My Coffee
    Posts
    5,278
    That is insane.

    Thank God I am an American.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

  11. #11
    Regular Member Haz.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    I come from a land downunder.
    Posts
    1,227
    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    The once distinctive and pleasant Australian accent has been morphing of late:

    "Ve haf vays of makink you talk!"
    G-day mate.

    My grandchildren sometimes play a game called spot the Aussie whenever I take them down to the big smoke, (Sydney). As the years go by, I'm not hearing many, "There's one Pop" The place truly is chock full of all-sorts? Even the police department is slowly being filled with short statured all-sorts. I'm beginning to seriously think of pulling the pin and coming over to the USA.

  12. #12
    Regular Member OldCurlyWolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Posts
    912
    Quote Originally Posted by wylde007 View Post
    I'm more disturbed by the poll results than I am at the article. That even one person would consider this a "good" idea is deplorable.

    That they are CARRYING THE POLL is downright terrifying.
    The reason it is ahead in the polls is the LOADED way the question is asked.

    It asks if CRIMINALS should lose the right to remain silent. Of course most people think that is perfectly reasonable. What they do not even start to consider is that they would also lose that right. They think it would only apply to criminals and not the rest of the population.

    UNTHINKING MORONS.


    I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do those things to other people and I require the same of them.

    Politicians should serve two terms, one in office and one in prison.(borrowed from RioKid)

  13. #13
    Regular Member OldCurlyWolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Posts
    912
    Quote Originally Posted by Haz. View Post
    G-day mate.

    My grandchildren sometimes play a game called spot the Aussie whenever I take them down to the big smoke, (Sydney). As the years go by, I'm not hearing many, "There's one Pop" The place truly is chock full of all-sorts? Even the police department is slowly being filled with short statured all-sorts. I'm beginning to seriously think of pulling the pin and coming over to the USA.
    Come on up to the Northern Hemisphere and help us put a bunch of politicians in some very uncomfortable places. If we can stand some of them "up against the wall" we can keep this country as the founders intended.
    I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do those things to other people and I require the same of them.

    Politicians should serve two terms, one in office and one in prison.(borrowed from RioKid)

  14. #14
    Founder's Club Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Fairfax Co., VA
    Posts
    18,766
    Oh, lets just immediately go back to Star Chamber courts, and skip the piecemeal approach.

    What is a Star Chamber court, you ask? 16th Century England. And, it wasn't just a right to silence violated. You were required to swear an oath--thus you 1) had to answer, and 2) if you didn't answer truthfully, or they found out you lied, or manufactured evidence you lied, they had you on breaking the oath, and 3) you were eternally damned as a Christian for breaking the oath.

    I can't imagine there wasn't a penalty for refusing the oath; and I have this vague recollection that the questioning wasn't particularly friendly, although I have no information that torture was involved.

    All in violation of the most fundamental and strongest impulse in nature--self-preservation. This is what the right to silence is all about--a person cannot be compelled to jeopardize himself by giving the government ammunition that can be used against him. It is a shocking violation of the conscience of the compelled, and the conscience of the civilized.

    Star Chamber is part of the history of the 5th Amendment right against self-incrimination. It is discussed briefly in Miranda vs Arizona.

    Three-hundred and some years since the Star Chamber was abolished. Centuries of blood--including the head of Saint Thomas More--to win respect for the right to silence, and some thugs in Australia want to undermine it all and head us back towards barbarism.


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Chamber
    Last edited by Citizen; 12-01-2010 at 11:51 PM.

  15. #15
    Regular Member Haz.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    I come from a land downunder.
    Posts
    1,227
    Quote Originally Posted by OldCurlyWolf View Post
    Come on up to the Northern Hemisphere and help us put a bunch of politicians in some very uncomfortable places. If we can stand some of them "up against the wall" we can keep this country as the founders intended.
    G-day OldCurlyWolf.
    Ya know, Im ashamed to say this but its true. Many, but thankfully not all, people down under these days are so stupid. Whenever something happenes to which they dont agree, they immediately phone the talk back radio stations, of which there are many, write letters in to editors complaing about the situation they disagree with and constantly add to the drivel they verbally and in writing spew forth,

    "WE SHOULD ALL BE UP IN ARMS OVER THIS!"

    I say what?

    Dont you . . . UNTHINKING MORONS . . . even realise you have allowed yourselves to be dissarmed by your government???

    The only arms you can now be up in is, uselessly waving your arms in the air and the government know thisonly too well.

  16. #16
    Regular Member VAopencarry's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    The 'Dena, Mаяуlaпd
    Posts
    2,147
    I guess I should remember this when I think how bad it is here in the States.
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson

  17. #17
    Founder's Club Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Fairfax Co., VA
    Posts
    18,766
    Quote Originally Posted by VAopencarry View Post
    I guess I should remember this when I think how bad it is here in the States.
    If you don't show up here more often, we're gonna have a hard time remembering you!


  18. #18
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    America
    Posts
    2,226
    proof why democracy is a bad idea. Thank the founders for giving us a federal Republic.

  19. #19
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Urban Skeet City, Alabama
    Posts
    897
    If I do not have a right to remain silent, must I confess to crimes I did not commit?

    Holy cow...That's just a bad idea. It almost hearkens to the police state that is Japan.
    It takes a village to raise an idiot.

  20. #20
    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Newport News, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    4,961
    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    What disturbs me most is that a right that protects individuals from the state can be abolished by a majority vote.

    This is the problem with democracy and why I am glad that we do not live in one.
    +1

    Of course certain laws have been passed in this constitutional republic that tread upon fundamental rights as well. That is, after all, what "gun control" is all about.
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

  21. #21
    Campaign Veteran since9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Colorado Springs, Colorado, USA
    Posts
    6,787
    Quote Originally Posted by wylde007 View Post
    I'm more disturbed by the poll results than I am at the article. That even one person would consider this a "good" idea is deplorable.
    This will sound harsh, but it's my firm conviction after studying rights issues in both England and Australia: That 51% of Australians thought it was a good idea reveals one of the principle reasons the Austrailian government is free to walk all over the civil rights of its citizens: The citizens are inviting their own abuse.

    Let's hope and pray our American citizenry never becomes so brainwashed as to sit still for such abuses of our civil rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    Three-hundred and some years since the Star Chamber was abolished. Centuries of blood--including the head of Saint Thomas More--to win respect for the right to silence, and some thugs in Australia want to undermine it all and head us back towards barbarism.
    You mean moronic thugs, don't you? Although I sincerely hope they're reading this, if they're as moronic as they appear to be, they won't understand a word of it.
    Last edited by since9; 12-06-2010 at 10:47 PM.
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. Together, they protect the rest of our Bill of Rights and our United States Constitution, and help We the People protect ourselves in the spirit of our Declaration of Independence.

  22. #22
    Regular Member Haz.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    I come from a land downunder.
    Posts
    1,227

    Bligh considers firearm law revamp after Gold Coast shootings.

    SSAA E -alert, recieved this afternoon.
    "Shootings prompt criticism of firearm laws
    Firearm laws in Queensland are in question following three shootings on the Gold Coast in recent days.

    The Queensland Government is the target of criticism amid claims current firearm laws are not strict enough. Premier Anna Bligh has said she will consider changing firearm laws following a full investigation into the shootings.

    SSAA National is encouraging members to vote on the poll located to the right of the news story and answer the question “Should we have stricter gun controls in Australia?”

    Members can also choose to have their say on the issue online, or by writing a letter to the editor.

    According to Australian Institute of Criminology researchers Jack Dearden and Warwick Jones “more than 93 per cent of firearms used in homicides in 2006-07 were unlicensed and unregistered”.

    Of the estimated 760,000 licensed firearms owners in Australia, about 700 report firearm robberies each year. This is a miniscule percentage (0.09%) of firearms that potentially enter the illegal market in this manner.

    It is the criminals and their use of illegal firearms that are the problem, not licensed, law-abiding firearm owners."
    .


    Anyone following the thread on these boards, "Who Needs a Gun in Australia" will know how bad things are Down Under regarding the illegal use of firearms by criminals ever increasing since the Gun Ban. Every so often a politician will ruffel their feathers and cry for a tightening of already the tightest gun laws in the western world.

    Heres an example. So far the poll included shows an 80% swing against the governments suggestion re the revamp of firearms laws. In the Have your say colums people are also voicing their opinions, that the government should consentrate on the criminals and leave law abiding sporting shooters alone. An interesting read. Vote in the poll as well.

    Poll included in article:
    Should we have stricter gun control in Australia?

    Results so far,

    YES . . . 13%
    NO . . . 87%

    The people are finally waking up. . . . Haz.

    http://www.goldcoast.com.au/article/...oast-news.html

    Bligh considers firearm law revamp
    Sue Lappeman | December 7th, 2010

    Related Links
    Pictures: Bundall Road shooting
    THE shootings on the Gold Coast could spark another round of bitter public debate over gun control with Premier Anna Bligh vowing to tighten firearm laws if necessary.

    Ms Bligh yesterday said she had been shocked by the shootings because they were so unusual.

    She said police were throwing everything at the investigation and if they found laws needed to be changed, they would be.

    "Here in Queensland we have some of the toughest gun laws in Australia but if in this investigation we find anything that suggests we should be revisiting them then we won't hesitate," she said.

    "This sort of lawlessness has no place in a civilised society.

    Have your say on the feedback form below
    Third shooting on Gold Coast
    Sniper victim just a `normal guy
    Rooftop sniper at Surfers; shooting on M1
    Pictures: Surfers sniper
    Pictures: Bundall Road shooting

    "These events at the Gold Coast are frankly just shocking. There is no place for them in Australia and they are shocking precisely because they are extreme and unusual."

    The Opposition seized on the shootings to launch an attack on the Bligh Government over police numbers, claiming Gold Coasters were right to be concerned about going out at night and the tourism industry would suffer.

    LNP police spokesman and Noosa MP Glen Elmes said there had been increasingly violent incidents on the Gold Coast's tourist strip.

    "The shootings over the past few days are very disturbing, and come on top of the string of violent crime fuelled by alcohol and drugs that occurs in party precincts," he said.

    "The Gold Coast community is rightly extremely concerned about leaving their homes at night at the moment and the shootings could have a detrimental effect on the tourism industry which is already struggling."

    Your Say
    "Legal firearm ownership should be a completely separate argument to the illegal acquisition and use of firearms. Tougher penalties for illegal activity makes perfect sense. Making legal ownership more restrictive does not, given that we already have comprehensive licencing and registration laws. Many innocent people have been harmed as a result of illegal vehicle use, yet there is no outcry to ban the use of vehicles by licenced drivers. So why link legal gun ownership to illegal gun crime?"
    Craig

    But Police Minister Neil Roberts said crime rates across a range of categories had decreased over the past 12 months and police numbers had increased.

    "Obviously these three incidents are of grave concern and police are throwing tremendous resources into resolving these as quickly as possible," he said.

    "In terms of the Gold Coast generally, the recent statistical review showed there was reductions in crime rates across a range of categories, from break and enters to assaults.

    "Police are obviously very concerned about these incidents and we are really calling for people with any information, no matter how small, to provide that information to police either directly or through Crimestoppers on 1300 333 000."
    Last edited by Haz.; 12-07-2010 at 12:23 AM.

  23. #23
    Campaign Veteran since9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Colorado Springs, Colorado, USA
    Posts
    6,787
    Quote Originally Posted by Haz. View Post
    Anyone following the thread on these boards, "Who Needs a Gun in Australia" will know how bad things are Down Under regarding the illegal use of firearms by criminals ever increasing since the Gun Ban.
    That's what happens when a government bans guns. The law-abiding citizens obey the law. The criminals do not, and instead use it to their advantage.

    Every so often a politician will ruffel their feathers and cry for a tightening of already the tightest gun laws in the western world.
    We have a word for those sort of knuckleheards here in the U.S. It's a seven-letter word, beginning with "dumb..." but for propriety's sake I can't mention the last three letters here.

    Poll included in article: Should we have stricter gun control in Australia?

    Results so far,

    YES . . . 13%
    NO . . . 87%

    The people are finally waking up.
    About time!

    Send as many of them as you can this (attached). They might wake up just a little bit further. Every little bit helps to secure the inalienable civil rights naturally due every one of us on this planet.
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. Together, they protect the rest of our Bill of Rights and our United States Constitution, and help We the People protect ourselves in the spirit of our Declaration of Independence.

  24. #24
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    SE, WI
    Posts
    7,322
    I've wanted to visit Australia for a number of years now, but if this goes through, I will not venture down under.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  25. #25
    Regular Member Whitney's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Poulsbo, Kitsap County, Washington, USA
    Posts
    449

    Innocent until proven guilty

    An experienced police officer tells you why you should never agree to be interviewed by the police.



    The problem with America is stupidity.
    I'm not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •