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Thread: Michigan Law and Open Carry / Concealed Carry

  1. #1
    Regular Member jpm84092's Avatar
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    Post Michigan Law and Open Carry / Concealed Carry

    The link below takes the viewer to a document created by the Michigan State Police to help handgun owners understand Michigan law. It may be useful to some on this forum.

    http://www.michigan.gov/documents/ms...2_336854_7.pdf
    My cats support the Second Amendment. NRA Life Member, NRA Instructor: Pistol, Rifle, & Personal Protection - NRA Certified Range Safety Officer, Utah BCI Certified Concealed Firearm Permit Instructor.
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    A non-resident must present the license issued by his or her state of residence!!

    Thank you for posting that, this will finally settle a disagreement between myself and another WI-OCDO member from a week or two ago.

    Whoever you are, please read page 3 of the attached file, bottom left hand column, and it is continued in the upper right hand column.

    It clearly states that to carry a pistol in MI, you must have licensing from your state of residence to do so, A non-resident permit from a state other than your home state does NOT qualify!
    Since WI does not have licensing requirements, WE ARE NOT ALLOWED TO CARRY IN MI, But an IL resident can carry openly in MI due to the FOID card requirement for IL residents.

    Here is a snippet for you;
    Possession of pistols by non-residents
    MCL 28.432 makes it legal for non-residents of Michigan who hold valid CPLs issued by another state to possess a non-concealed pistol in Michigan without complying with Michiganís pistol registration requirements. Additionally, MCL 28.422 exempts residents of other states from Michiganís pistol registration requirements therefore, allowing them to possess a pistol in Michigan, if all of the following requirements are met:
    1. The person is licensed by his or her state of residence to purchase, transport, or carry a pistol,
    2.The person is in possession of the license while in Michigan,
    3.The person owns the pistol possessed in Michigan,
    4.The person possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as defined in MCL 750.231a, and
    5.The person is in Michigan less than 180 days and does not intend to establish residency here.
    A non-resident must present the license issued by his or her state of residence to a police officer upon demand. Failure to do so is a 90-day misdemeanor. When transporting a firearm in Michigan, non-residents must transport pistols in compliance with MCL 750.231a (discussed above in the Transporting Firearms section), unless they have a concealed pistol license issued by their state of residence.

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    Regular Member GlockRDH's Avatar
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    Whoda thunk an Illinois resident would have MORE OC priveleges than a WI resident!

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    Regular Member davegran's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Looks clear to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nutczak View Post
    Thank you for posting that, this will finally settle a disagreement between myself and another WI-OCDO member from a week or two ago.

    Whoever you are, please read page 3 of the attached file, bottom left hand column, and it is continued in the upper right hand column.

    It clearly states that to carry a pistol in MI, you must have licensing from your state of residence to do so, A non-resident permit from a state other than your home state does NOT qualify!
    Since WI does not have licensing requirements, WE ARE NOT ALLOWED TO CARRY IN MI, But an IL resident can carry openly in MI due to the FOID card requirement for IL residents.

    Here is a snippet for you;
    Possession of pistols by non-residents
    MCL 28.432 makes it legal for non-residents of Michigan who hold valid CPLs issued by another state to possess a non-concealed pistol in Michigan without complying with Michiganís pistol registration requirements.
    Additionally, MCL 28.422 exempts residents of other states from Michiganís pistol registration requirements therefore, allowing them to possess a pistol in Michigan, if all of the following requirements are met:
    1. The person is licensed by his or her state of residence to purchase, transport, or carry a pistol,
    2.The person is in possession of the license while in Michigan,
    3.The person owns the pistol possessed in Michigan,
    4.The person possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as defined in MCL 750.231a, and
    5.The person is in Michigan less than 180 days and does not intend to establish residency here.
    A non-resident must present the license issued by his or her state of residence to a police officer upon demand. Failure to do so is a 90-day misdemeanor. When transporting a firearm in Michigan, non-residents must transport pistols in compliance with MCL 750.231a (discussed above in the Transporting Firearms section), unless they have a concealed pistol license issued by their state of residence.
    Possession of pistols by non-residents
    MCL 28.432 makes it legal for non-residents of Michigan who hold valid CPLs issued by another state to possess a non-concealed pistol in Michigan without complying with Michiganís pistol registration requirements.

    This is known as the Janet Kukuk Act. Here it is in it's entirety:
    28.432 Inapplicability of MCL 28.422; citation as ďJanet Kukuk actĒ.

    Sec. 12.

    (1) Section 2 does not apply to any of the following:

    (a) A police or correctional agency of the United States or of this state or any subdivision of this state.

    (b) The United States army, air force, navy, or marine corps.

    (c) An organization authorized by law to purchase or receive weapons from the United States or from this state.

    (d) The national guard, armed forces reserves, or other duly authorized military organization.

    (e) A member of an entity or organization described in subdivisions (a) through (d) for a pistol while engaged in the course of his or her duties with that entity or while going to or returning from those duties.

    (f) A United States citizen holding a license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by another state.

    (g) The regular and ordinary transportation of a pistol as merchandise by an authorized agent of a person licensed to manufacture firearms or a licensed dealer.

    (h) Purchasing, owning, carrying, possessing, using, or transporting an antique firearm. As used in this subdivision, "antique firearm" means that term as defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.

    (i) An individual carrying, possessing, using, or transporting a pistol belonging to another individual, if the other individual's possession of the pistol is authorized by law and the individual carrying, possessing, using, or transporting the pistol has obtained a license under section 5b to carry a concealed pistol or is exempt from licensure as provided in section 12a.

    (2) The amendatory act that added subsection (1)(h) shall be known and may be cited as the "Janet Kukuk act".
    MCL 28.432; known as The ďJanet Kukuk Act", modifies MCL 28.422 to allow a person holding a CCW issued by a state different than Michigan to Open Carry in Michigan. It does NOT specify a RESIDENT CCW permit issued by another state to Open Carry in Michigan.

    I wonder if any of our Michigan forum friends know who Janet Kukuk is/was?
    Last edited by davegran; 12-22-2010 at 09:22 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nutczak View Post
    Thank you for posting that, this will finally settle a disagreement between myself and another WI-OCDO member from a week or two ago.

    Whoever you are, please read page 3 of the attached file, bottom left hand column, and it is continued in the upper right hand column.

    It clearly states that to carry a pistol in MI, you must have licensing from your state of residence to do so, A non-resident permit from a state other than your home state does NOT qualify!
    Since WI does not have licensing requirements, WE ARE NOT ALLOWED TO CARRY IN MI, But an IL resident can carry openly in MI due to the FOID card requirement for IL residents.

    Here is a snippet for you;
    Possession of pistols by non-residents
    MCL 28.432 makes it legal for non-residents of Michigan who hold valid CPLs issued by another state to possess a non-concealed pistol in Michigan without complying with Michiganís pistol registration requirements. Additionally, MCL 28.422 exempts residents of other states from Michiganís pistol registration requirements therefore, allowing them to possess a pistol in Michigan, if all of the following requirements are met:
    1. The person is licensed by his or her state of residence to purchase, transport, or carry a pistol,
    2.The person is in possession of the license while in Michigan,
    3.The person owns the pistol possessed in Michigan,
    4.The person possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as defined in MCL 750.231a, and
    5.The person is in Michigan less than 180 days and does not intend to establish residency here.
    A non-resident must present the license issued by his or her state of residence to a police officer upon demand. Failure to do so is a 90-day misdemeanor. When transporting a firearm in Michigan, non-residents must transport pistols in compliance with MCL 750.231a (discussed above in the Transporting Firearms section), unless they have a concealed pistol license issued by their state of residence.
    May be we ought to carry acopy of Art1 sec25 of our constitution because that is OUR LICENSE !
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    Gotta Luv It!

    I can only surmise that jpm84092 wants to yank my chain. Otherwise why start a Michigan thread in the Wisconsin forum? Or why not submit the information in the thread that generated the interest? I predicted somebody would start a new thread on this issue within 6 months but 4 days is ridiculous. So what is the correct answer? Can a resident of Wisconsin holding a Florida CCW carry openly in Michigan? The polls are now open.
    Last edited by apjonas; 12-21-2010 at 10:14 PM. Reason: correction

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    Quote Originally Posted by apjonas View Post
    I can only surmise that jpm84092 wants to yank my chain. Otherwise why start a Michigan thread in the Wisconsin forum? Or why not submit the information in the thread that generated the interest? I predicted somebody would start a new thread on this issue within 6 months but 4 days is ridiculous. So what is the correct answer? Can a resident of Wisconsin holding a Florida CCW carry openly in Michigan? The polls are now open.
    "Additionally, MCL 28.422 exempts residents of other states from Michiganís pistol registration requirements therefore, allowing them to possess a pistol in Michigan, if all of the following requirements are met:
    1. The person is licensed by his or her state of residence to purchase, transport, or carry a pistol,"

    Technically I am NOT licensed by the state of Wisconsin to carry a gun. I can open carry because it's not forbidden and the constitution stuff. So if I am not licensed by my state of residence (WI) I cannot carry in MI. HA, that doesn't stop me tho. I usually am way out in the woods exploring on my dirt bike and won't go without protection. Also thought I read somewhere about not even being able to transport a gun over the state line in my vehicle. Not going to look for it but I did have it confirmed by their DNR a few years ago.
    By the way, I appreciate that this was posted so quickly because it's still fresh in my mind.

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    http://www.michigan.gov/msp/0,1607,7...l#FIREARMSFAQS

    2. Can a resident of another state legally possess a pistol in Michigan?

    If you are a non-resident of Michigan with a valid concealed pistol permit from your home state, Michigan will recognize your permit (MCL 28.432 & MCL 28.432a). However, you must carry in conformance with any and all restrictions appearing on the permit. You are subject to Michigan's concealed pistol law including but not limited to restrictions on where a concealed pistol may be carried. Without a CPL, a non-resident may not have a pistol in Michigan.

    Their open carry sounds like ours, its not forbidden. Notice the last sentence tho, if you don't have a CPL (described elsewhere as from you state of residence) then you cannot have a pistol at all in Michigan. Not as nice there as I used to think. Hmmm, also sounds like a licensed person can open carry in a vehicle tho (not us up there).

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    You can't carry openly in pistol free zones with your CPL.

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    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    I'll try.

    Concealed carry/loaded vehicle carry:

    *Michigan CPL
    *Concealed pistol license from your state of residence
    *Law enforcement officer carrying under the authority of the LEOSA

    Open carry (no loaded vehicle carry allowed, must follow transport laws):

    *Michigan pistol registration
    *Concealed pistol license from any other state
    *A license/permit to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol from your state of residence as long as:
    ***you have license/permit with you
    ***you must be the legal owner of the pistol
    ***you're possessing the pistol for lawful purposes
    ***you're in MI for 180 days or less with no intent of establishing residency

    Also with a concealed license from any state you are exempt from the general Firearms Free zones (open carry), and since our Concealed Carry law specifically calls out places you cannot carry a CONCEALED pistol it does not apply to an openly carried pisitol.

    So with a concealed license from any state, regardless of residency, a non-MI resident may openly carry their legally possessed pistol in most of the MI state level pistol/firearm free zones (courts/court offices, sterile areas of airports, Federal Reserve Bank in Detroit, and fed. buildings are still a no-go).

    I think that's it. It's late, I'm going to bed

    Bronson
    Last edited by Bronson; 12-22-2010 at 02:12 AM.
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    Thumbs up I finally get to use the word "conflation" in a sentence....

    Quote Originally Posted by Bronson View Post
    I'll try.

    Concealed carry/loaded vehicle carry: 28.422

    Michigan CPL
    Or: Concealed pistol license from your state of residence
    Or: Law enforcement officer carrying under the authority of the LEOSA

    Open carry (no loaded vehicle carry allowed, must follow transport laws): 28.432

    Michigan pistol registration
    Or: Concealed pistol license from any other state
    Or: A license/permit to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol from your state of residence as long as:

    • you have license/permit with you
    • you must be the legal owner of the pistol
    • you're possessing the pistol for lawful purposes
    • you're in MI for 180 days or less with no intent of establishing residency


    Also with a concealed license from any state you are exempt from the general Firearms Free zones (open carry), and since our Concealed Carry law specifically calls out places you cannot carry a CONCEALED pistol it does not apply to an openly carried pisitol.

    So with a concealed license from any state, regardless of residency, a non-MI resident may openly carry their legally possessed pistol in most of the MI state level pistol/firearm free zones (courts/court offices, sterile areas of airports, Federal Reserve Bank in Detroit, and fed. buildings are still a no-go).

    I think that's it. It's late, I'm going to bed

    Bronson
    Thanks, Bronson; I'm glad that a few of us get it! I hope you'll forgive me for highlighting some of your comments (highlighting shown in Bold Red) to emphasize where other people misinterpret Michigan law.

    Conflation: (from Wikipedia)
    Conflation occurs when the identities of two or more individuals, concepts, or places, sharing some characteristics of one another, become confused until there seems to be only a single identity ó the differences appear to become lost.[1] In logic, the practice of treating two distinct concepts as if they were one does often produce error or misunderstanding, as a fusion of distinct subjects tends to obscure analysis of relationships which are emphasized by contrasts.
    People get confused when they conflate MCL 28.432 and MCL 28.433; THEY ARE TWO DIFFERENT STATUTES!

    28.432 was written first and says you must have a CCW license from your state of residence to carry concealed in Michigan.


    28.433 was passed later and says that as long as you have a CCW from ANY STATE, not necessarily your state of residence, that you can open carry in Michigan.


    I don't know how we can make it any more clear, do you Bronson?
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    Quote Originally Posted by davegran View Post
    Possession of pistols by non-residents
    MCL 28.432 makes it legal for non-residents of Michigan who hold valid CPLs issued by another state to possess a non-concealed pistol in Michigan without complying with Michigan’s pistol registration requirements.

    This is known as the Janet Kukuk Act. Here it is in it's entirety:
    MCL 28.432; known as The “Janet Kukuk Act", modifies MCL 28.422 to allow a person holding a CCW issued by a state different than Michigan to Open Carry in Michigan. It does NOT specify a RESIDENT CCW permit issued by another state to Open Carry in Michigan.

    I wonder if any of our Michigan forum friends know who Janet Kukuk is/was?

    The way I am reading MI laws, is that if you are not a MI resident, you must have a license issued from your home state, if you are a MI resident, a license from another state is valid.

    I would not chance it it in MI until clarification is published by the state of MI, it is just not worth getting tagged out of state IMO
    Last edited by Nutczak; 12-22-2010 at 10:14 AM. Reason: corrections

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    Quote Originally Posted by davegran View Post
    Possession of pistols by non-residents
    MCL 28.432 makes it legal for non-residents of Michigan who hold valid CPLs issued by another state to possess a non-concealed pistol in Michigan without complying with Michiganís pistol registration requirements.

    This is known as the Janet Kukuk Act. Here it is in it's entirety:
    MCL 28.432; known as The ďJanet Kukuk Act", modifies MCL 28.422 to allow a person holding a CCW issued by a state different than Michigan to Open Carry in Michigan. It does NOT specify a RESIDENT CCW permit issued by another state to Open Carry in Michigan.

    I wonder if any of our Michigan forum friends know who Janet Kukuk is/was?
    You are correct. This was challenged and now anyone with a CPL license, registration, permit to possess firearms from any state can possess a firearm in Michigan. To conceal carry you need to have a license from your home state. But to possess or OC you can have a CPL from any state. So if a Wisconsin resident had a Florida CPL they could OC in Michigan.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nutczak View Post
    The way I am reading MI laws, is that if you are not a MI resident, you must have a license issued from your home state, if you are a MI resident, a license from another state is valid.
    You are partially correct in that a non-MI resident must have a license from their home state but only for concealed carry or loaded vehicle carry. There is a MI Attorney General's opinion (I can't find it right now) that states it is not allowed for a MI resident to obtain a non-resident concealed license from another state in order to circumvent Michigan's licensing requirements. In effect, if you are a MI resident you need a MI concealed permit.

    750.227 Concealed weapons; carrying; penalty.


    Sec. 227.

    (1) A person shall not carry a dagger, dirk, stiletto, a double-edged nonfolding stabbing instrument of any length, or any other dangerous weapon, except a hunting knife adapted and carried as such, concealed on or about his or her person, or whether concealed or otherwise in any vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business or on other land possessed by the person.

    (2) A person shall not carry a pistol concealed on or about his or her person, or, whether concealed or otherwise, in a vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business, or on other land possessed by the person, without a license to carry the pistol as provided by law and if licensed, shall not carry the pistol in a place or manner inconsistent with any restrictions upon such license.
    But then we have 750.231a which provides exceptions to 750.227:

    750.231a Exceptions to MCL 750.227(2); definitions.

    Sec. 231a.

    (1) Subsection (2) of section 227 does not apply to any of the following:

    (a) To a person holding a valid license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by his or her state of residence except where the pistol is carried in nonconformance with a restriction appearing on the license.
    Again, that is ONLY for concealed carry. Michigan law separates concealed carry from general firearms possession i.e. open carry.

    For general possession or open carry you only need some form of license to possess from your state of residence OR a concealed carry license from ANY state.

    750.234d Possession of firearm on certain premises prohibited; applicability; violation as misdemeanor; penalty.


    Sec. 234d.

    (1) Except as provided in subsection (2), a person shall not possess a firearm on the premises of any of the following:
    (a) A depository financial institution or a subsidiary or affiliate of a depository financial institution.
    (b) A church or other house of religious worship.
    (c) A court.
    (d) A theatre.
    (e) A sports arena.
    (f) A day care center.
    (g) A hospital.
    (h) An establishment licensed under the Michigan liquor control act, Act No. 8 of the Public Acts of the Extra Session of 1933, being sections 436.1 to 436.58 of the Michigan Compiled Laws.
    (2) This section does not apply to any of the following:
    (a) A person who owns, or is employed by or contracted by, an entity described in subsection (1) if the possession of that firearm is to provide security services for that entity.
    (b) A peace officer.
    (c) A person licensed by this state or another state to carry a concealed weapon.
    Notice in section 2(c) in red that there is no residency requirement attached.

    The other way for a non-MI resident to possess (not conceal) a pistol in MI is to meet the exemptions from getting a MI License to Purchase/Possess as detailed in 28.422; section 8:

    (8) An individual who is not a resident of this state is not required to obtain a license under this section if all of the following conditions apply:
    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.
    (b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a).
    (c) The individual is the owner of the pistol he or she possesses, carries, or transports.
    (d) The individual possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as that term is defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.
    (e) The individual is in this state for a period of 180 days or less and does not intend to establish residency in this state.
    Remember this law is referring ONLY to a License to Purchase/Possess, it has nothing to do with a concealed pistol license.

    MCL 28.432 also provides an exemption to the requirement of having a MI License to Purchase/Possess (28.422, excerpted above) to anyone possessing a concealed pistol license from any state.

    28.432 Inapplicability of MCL 28.422; amendatory act as “Janet Kukuk act”.
    Sec. 12.

    (1) Section 2 (this is 28.422, excerpted above) does not apply to any of the following:
    (a) A police or correctional agency of the United States or of this state or any subdivision of this state.
    (b) The United States army, air force, navy, or marine corps.
    (c) An organization authorized by law to purchase or receive weapons from the United States or from this state.
    (d) The national guard, armed forces reserves, or other duly authorized military organization.
    (e) A member of an entity or organization described in subdivisions (a) through (d) for a pistol while engaged in the course of his or her duties with that entity or while going to or returning from those duties.
    (f) A United States citizen holding a license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by another state.
    (g) The regular and ordinary transportation of a pistol as merchandise by an authorized agent of a person licensed to manufacture firearms or a licensed dealer.
    (h) Purchasing, owning, carrying, possessing, using, or transporting an antique firearm. As used in this subdivision, "antique firearm" means that term as defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.
    (i) An individual carrying, possessing, using, or transporting a pistol belonging to another individual, if the other individual's possession of the pistol is authorized by law and the individual carrying, possessing, using, or transporting the pistol has obtained a license under section 5b to carry a concealed pistol or is exempt from licensure as provided in section 12a.
    Remember the exemptions listed in 28.432 above only apply to a License to Purchase/Possess, not a concealed pistol license.

    Bronson
    Last edited by Bronson; 12-22-2010 at 02:46 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by davegran View Post
    I wonder if any of our Michigan forum friends know who Janet Kukuk is/was?
    A State Representative in Michigan, Janet Kukuk died Nov. 19, 2000... cause of death: Breast Cancer.
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

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    Exclamation Warning, strong language, children look away....

    Quote Originally Posted by Nutczak View Post
    The way I am reading MI laws, is that if you are not a MI resident, you must have a license issued from your home state, if you are a MI resident, a license from another state is valid.

    I would not chance it it in MI until clarification is published by the state of MI, it is just not worth getting tagged out of state IMO
    With all due respect, Nutczak, have one of your buddies up there give you a little slap to the back of the head. You are showing the exact same close-mindedness that the antis display when confronted by the facts. And that close-mindedness could prove fatal to someone.

    We have cited to law, exhibited an in-service document from the Michigan State Patrol, shown you to be wrong, and yet you persist in holding out hope that somehow the facts are incorrect.

    I just pray that somebody reading this thread doesn't follow your "opinion" and ends up unarmed in a life or death situation because they thought it was against the law for them to carry in Michigan.
    Dave
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    And it goes the other way too, I feel it would be very stupid to not make absolutely positive you are legal to carry in another state and end up getting tagged for a weapons violation out of state.

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    Oh, and have a merry flippin Christmas too

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    Quote Originally Posted by davegran View Post
    With all due respect, Nutczak, have one of your buddies up there give you a little slap to the back of the head. You are showing the exact same close-mindedness that the antis display when confronted by the facts. And that close-mindedness could prove fatal to someone.
    We have cited to law, exhibited an in-service document from the Michigan State Patrol, shown you to be wrong, and yet you persist in holding out hope that somehow the facts are incorrect.
    I just pray that somebody reading this thread doesn't follow your "opinion" and ends up unarmed in a life or death situation because they thought it was against the law for them to carry in Michigan.
    And in Wisconsin we can legally open carry (with some annoying restrictions) yet people have still been arrested. Why is that? Because some cops are either ignorant of the law or choose to ignore it. What fun to be arrested in another state, have your gun confiscated just because some cop made a mistake. How costly could that be! Legal or not, unless it's black and white, people from Wisconsin would be taking chances. Kind of like how screwed up our own gun laws are, contradicting each other. It could easily happen in Michigan too.

  19. #19
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    People, the law in this document is clear. A WI resident who has an out of state carry permit, may OPEN carry, but may not CONCEAL carry.

    Possession of pistols by non-residents
    MCL 28.432 makes it legal for non-residents of Michigan who hold valid CPLs issued by another state to possess a non-concealed pistol in Michigan without complying with Michiganís pistol registration requirements.

    This is quite clear, and in plain language!! The next sentence adds additional information, for people who live in another state, yet own a firearm which is stored in MI:
    Additionally, MCL 28.422 exempts residents of other states from Michiganís pistol registration requirements therefore, allowing them to possess a pistol in Michigan, if all of the following requirements are met:
    1. The person is licensed by his or her state of residence to purchase, transport, or carry a pistol,
    2. The person is in possession of the license while in Michigan,
    3. The person owns the pistol possessed in Michigan,
    4. The person possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as defined in MCL 750.231a, and
    5. The person is in Michigan less than 180 days and does not intend to establish residency here.

  20. #20
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smithman View Post
    People, the law in this document is clear. A WI resident who has an out of state carry permit, may OPEN carry, but may not CONCEAL carry.

    Possession of pistols by non-residents
    MCL 28.432 makes it legal for non-residents of Michigan who hold valid CPLs issued by another state to possess a non-concealed pistol in Michigan without complying with Michiganís pistol registration requirements.

    This is quite clear, and in plain language!! The next sentence adds additional information, for people who live in another state, yet own a firearm which is stored in MI:
    Additionally, MCL 28.422 exempts residents of other states from Michiganís pistol registration requirements therefore, allowing them to possess a pistol in Michigan, if all of the following requirements are met:
    1. The person is licensed by his or her state of residence to purchase, transport, or carry a pistol,
    2. The person is in possession of the license while in Michigan,
    3. The person owns the pistol possessed in Michigan,
    4. The person possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as defined in MCL 750.231a, and
    5. The person is in Michigan less than 180 days and does not intend to establish residency here.
    I've often wondered about #1. Since WI does not have licenses, how does this affect us?
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  21. #21
    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smithman View Post
    The next sentence adds additional information, for people who live in another state, yet own a firearm which is stored in MI:
    Additionally, MCL 28.422 exempts residents of other states from Michiganís pistol registration requirements therefore, allowing them to possess a pistol in Michigan, if all of the following requirements are met:
    1. The person is licensed by his or her state of residence to purchase, transport, or carry a pistol,
    2. The person is in possession of the license while in Michigan,
    3. The person owns the pistol possessed in Michigan,
    4. The person possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as defined in MCL 750.231a, and
    5. The person is in Michigan less than 180 days and does not intend to establish residency here.
    Not quite.

    Those exemptions are not for non-MI residents to store pistols in MI. Those are for non-MI residents who will be visiting MI with their non-MI registered pistol.

    In order to be in possession of a pistol in MI it must be registered in MI. In order to have it registered in MI the owner/possesser must be a MI resident. The above posted exemptions allow a non-resident to be in possession of their pistol in MI without having to get it registered here, and you must meet ALL of the above OR have a concealed permit from your home state (which will allow you to conceal while here) OR have a concealed permit from ANY state which will allow you to possess the pistol (but not conceal it), OR be a law enforcement officer carrying under the LEOSA. AFAIK the above exemptions do NOT allow a non-MI resident to leave a pistol in storage here.

    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. Ė Thomas Paine

  22. #22
    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    I've often wondered about #1. Since WI does not have licenses, how does this affect us?

    Since WI does not have a license to purchase/possess you cannot have your pistol in MI unless:
    • you have WI concealed license (you don't have these yet do you?), which would allow you to conceal here.
    • you have a concealed license from any other state, which would allow you to OC here.
    • you are a LEO carrying under the LEOSA.
    If you do not fit into one of those categories you may not possess your pistol in MI.

    Bronson
    Last edited by Bronson; 12-25-2010 at 03:41 AM.
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. Ė Thomas Paine

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    Bronson, thank you for the clarification. You are correct indeed. A WI resident having a carry permit from ANY state, may possess and open carry in MI. IN fact, the open carry law in MI with a permit is quite liberal, with those gun free zones disappearing with a permit holder.

  24. #24
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bronson View Post
    Since WI does not have a license to purchase/possess you cannot have your pistol in MI unless:
    • you have WI concealed license (you don't have these yet do you?), which would allow you to conceal here.
    • you have a concealed license from any other state, which would allow you to OC here.
    • you are a LEO carrying under the LEOSA.

    If you do not fit into one of those categories you may not possess your pistol in MI.

    Bronson
    Thank you for the clarification.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    You can't carry openly in pistol free zones with your CPL.
    Stainless, I disagree. Both the AG's opinion AND MSP update 86 state that you CAN OC in PFZ's WITH a MI issued CPL.

    An individual with a valid CPL may carry a non-concealed firearm in the above listed premises.
    Those premises are listed as,


    A depository financial institution (e.g., bank or credit union)

    A church or other place of religious worship

    A court

    A theater

    A sports arena

    A day care center

    A hospital

    An establishment licensed under the Liquor Control Code
    IN addition,

    MCL 28.425o provides that a person with a valid CPL shall not carry a concealed pistol in a pistol-free zone. First offense is a state civil infraction. The following is a list of the premises (excluding parking lots) included in the statute:

    School or school property, except a parent or legal guardian who is dropping off or picking up a child and the pistol is kept in the vehicle

    Public or private day care center

    Sports arena or stadium

    A bar or tavern where sale and consumption of liquor by the glass is the primary source of income (does not apply to owner or employee of the business).

    Any property or facility owned or operated by a church, synagogue, mosque, temple, or other place of worship, unless authorized by the presiding official

    An entertainment facility that has a seating capacity of 2,500 or more

    A hospital

    A dormitory or classroom of a community college, college, or university

    A casino (R 432.1212, MCL 432.202)
    Added bold red underlined for emphasis.

    HOWEVER...

    Note, the above statute applies to CPL holders carrying a concealed pistol. If the CPL holder is carrying a non-concealed pistol, the statute does not apply. As noted above, the unlawful premises listed in MCL 750.234d do not apply to persons with a valid CPL. Therefore, a person with a valid CPL may carry a non-concealed pistol in the areas described in MCL 28.425o and MCL 750.234d.
    Clear?
    Last edited by xd shooter; 12-25-2010 at 01:45 PM.

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