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Thread: Got a new pistol...Don't think I'll OC it though...

  1. #1
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    Got a new pistol...Don't think I'll OC it though...

    OK, so I built it...

    7.62x39 AR pistol. All polymer lower, TRX Extreme rail, 7.5" barrel, etc etc.

    I was able to shave a pound off of the weight just by going with the TRX rail and the polymer lower... Lightweight was what I was going for and I nailed it.


















    Having some issues with light primer strikes, but that's normal with 7.62x39 builds and Wolf ammo. Soviet ammo tends to have really hard primers.. An upgraded hammer spring should solve that...

  2. #2
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    THATS considered a PISTOL?! Looks like a mini Assault Rifle. Looks awesome though!

  3. #3
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tannerwaterbury View Post
    THATS considered a PISTOL?! Looks like a mini Assault Rifle. Looks awesome though!
    Under ATF and WA rules/law it is indeed a pistol, and 'registered' as such (State transfer form)

  4. #4
    Regular Member IanB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TechnoWeenie View Post
    Under ATF and WA rules/law it is indeed a pistol, and 'registered' as such (State transfer form)
    Bravo. I was about to point out that a lower can be either a pistol OR rifle, but NOT both at the same time. If you convert a rifle AR to pistol, that is now a SBR, not a pistol. Looks like you did this the right way if it was orig registered as a pistol.

  5. #5
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nakedshoplifter View Post
    Bravo. I was about to point out that a lower can be either a pistol OR rifle, but NOT both at the same time. If you convert a rifle AR to pistol, that is now a SBR, not a pistol. Looks like you did this the right way if it was orig registered as a pistol.
    There is no 'registration' for the ATF... only thing they're concerned with is whats it's made into.

    Lower can't ever have been 'made' as a rifle, Ie have an upper affixed to it with a buttstock.

    A receiver is a receiver is a receiver until the barrel has been placed on it and is actionable as a _________ (rifle, AOW, pistol, SBR/SBS,etc)

  6. #6
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Somehow I feel that calling this a "Pistol" is like calling an H-2 Hummer a "Family Car".

    Rather than building a 7.62X39, why not a 50 Beowulf?
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

  7. #7
    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    Are you an FFL Manufacturer or just someone that made their own handgun?
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

  8. #8
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    T-weenie

    Why didn't you make it a "folder" like this:



    (when opened it looks like this)




    Since this is built on a Glock FA chassis, I wonder if they will ever market one in SA?

    " It is also small enough even to fit in the back pocket of most everyday pants."
    Last edited by amlevin; 12-29-2010 at 02:58 PM.
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

  9. #9
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thundar View Post
    Are you an FFL Manufacturer or just someone that made their own handgun?
    Built my own.

    AR's are simple. The receiver is the firearm and is the only thing requiring a NICS check. All the other parts are ordered like any other item. Just gotta make sure not to assemble it in an illegal configuration (SBR,AOW,etc)

  10. #10
    Regular Member massivedesign's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by amlevin View Post
    T-weenie

    Why didn't you make it a "folder" like this:



    (when opened it looks like this)




    Since this is built on a Glock FA chassis, I wonder if they will ever market one in SA?

    " It is also small enough even to fit in the back pocket of most everyday pants."
    Because with a rear butt stock, it is no longer a Pistol, but now a SBR, which is illegal in WA.

  11. #11
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by massivedesign View Post
    Because with a rear butt stock, it is no longer a Pistol, but now a SBR, which is illegal in WA.
    That leaves 49 other states, many of which it is not.

    Since my first post on this I discovered that it was built off a Glock 17 "platform". Wonder if one could merely get the remaining parts as a "kit", of course for those states where they are more "progressive" as to SBR's.
    Last edited by amlevin; 12-29-2010 at 05:35 PM.
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

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    Let me iterate 2 things:

    #1. NICE PISTOL!

    7.62x39, especially out of a short barrel, makes for a decent self-defense round. It has better cavitation (energy transfer) than 9mm FMJ, or .38spc, when striking flesh.

    #2. I wish people would stop exaggerating the ballistic capabilities of 7.62x39mm & 5.56( or .223) when it comes to a defense round. Both are actually markedly better than most pistol rounds for stopping an assailant, while having less clean penetration (again, better kinetic transfer) than others.


    The AR as a pistol is nothing worth getting all worked up over.

    Ok wait wait, it IS, but not for the reasons as Amlevin stated.
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  13. #13
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slowfiveoh View Post
    Let me iterate 2 things:

    #1. NICE PISTOL!

    7.62x39, especially out of a short barrel, makes for a decent self-defense round. It has better cavitation (energy transfer) than 9mm FMJ, or .38spc, when striking flesh.

    #2. I wish people would stop exaggerating the ballistic capabilities of 7.62x39mm & 5.56( or .223) when it comes to a defense round. Both are actually markedly better than most pistol rounds for stopping an assailant, while having less clean penetration (again, better kinetic transfer) than others.


    The AR as a pistol is nothing worth getting all worked up over.

    Ok wait wait, it IS, but not for the reasons as Amlevin stated.

    Actually, the "Spitzer" bullet does penetrate better than Round Nosed or HP bullets. A .223 round, even from a barrel less than half the length of a rifle, can penetrate soft body armor. Not if also equipped with a plate. Also can be more effective against a "target" inside a vehicle. Given the choice I would just as soon carry a pistol and have my "Carbine" readily available, either in house or vehicle.
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

  14. #14
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by amlevin View Post
    Actually, the "Spitzer" bullet does penetrate better than Round Nosed or HP bullets. A .223 round, even from a barrel less than half the length of a rifle, can penetrate soft body armor. Not if also equipped with a plate. Also can be more effective against a "target" inside a vehicle. Given the choice I would just as soon carry a pistol and have my "Carbine" readily available, either in house or vehicle.
    I can have this legally loaded in my car, and can legally conceal it. Not the same for your carbine.

    It is also super lightweight.

  15. #15
    Regular Member gsx1138's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TechnoWeenie View Post
    I can have this legally loaded in my car, and can legally conceal it. Not the same for your carbine.

    It is also super lightweight.
    And the chics dig it.

  16. #16
    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    why 7.62 in an AR platform tho? Just for the satisfaction of building it yourself?

    Can't fault the caliber choice tho, I'm itching to get a small family of 7.62 AK pistols myself, one to keep in each vehicle. Just can't get past the AR pistol's "junk inna trunk" look.
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

  17. #17
    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    I have been thinking about picking up an AK pistol.

    Question:

    I plan on putting a quad-rail on it. I know that I can not have a fore-end grip attached to the pistol, but can I have it packed in the same case as the pistol? The pistola is legal as long as I do not attach a stock or fore-end grip, right?

    Thank you. Oh, sweet AR!
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

  18. #18
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalhead47 View Post
    why 7.62 in an AR platform tho? Just for the satisfaction of building it yourself?

    Can't fault the caliber choice tho, I'm itching to get a small family of 7.62 AK pistols myself, one to keep in each vehicle. Just can't get past the AR pistol's "junk inna trunk" look.
    5.56 in a pistol has crappy ballistics. I can load 154 gr soft points instead of 55gr FMJ and about double the energy put on target.



    The 154gr sp is a beast of a round... Perfect for the short range I intend to use it @.

    It's super cheap to buy, and will defeat cover easily.

    I plan on putting a quad-rail on it. I know that I can not have a fore-end grip attached to the pistol, but can I have it packed in the same case as the pistol? The pistola is legal as long as I do not attach a stock or fore-end grip, right?
    No. Constructive possession applies. Same reason I can't have a buttstock laying around without a rifle upper and lower to go with it, as I'd have the parts to make an unregistered SBR. You'd have the parts to make an unregistered AOW.

  19. #19
    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    I have been thinking about picking up an AK pistol.

    Question:

    I plan on putting a quad-rail on it. I know that I can not have a fore-end grip attached to the pistol, but can I have it packed in the same case as the pistol? The pistola is legal as long as I do not attach a stock or fore-end grip, right?

    Thank you. Oh, sweet AR!
    Now that you mention it... (to anyone who can answer), like the lady's question about the fore-grip, what if one had the provision to quickly mount a stock to such a pistol, but no stock was "ever" mounted?
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

  20. #20
    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TechnoWeenie View Post
    5.56 in a pistol has crappy ballistics. I can load 154 gr soft points instead of 55gr FMJ and about double the energy put on target.


    The 154gr sp is a beast of a round... Perfect for the short range I intend to use it @.

    It's super cheap to buy, and will defeat cover easily.



    No. Constructive possession applies. Same reason I can't have a buttstock laying around without a rifle upper and lower to go with it, as I'd have the parts to make an unregistered SBR. You'd have the parts to make an unregistered AOW.

    You've got to be kidding. They can actually bust you based on something you might do with the items at hand???


    So what if you just have a great big mishmosh of all sorts of parts lying on your workbench?
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

  21. #21
    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TechnoWeenie View Post
    No. Constructive possession applies. Same reason I can't have a buttstock laying around without a rifle upper and lower to go with it, as I'd have the parts to make an unregistered SBR. You'd have the parts to make an unregistered AOW.
    Hmmm, what if the grip is attached to an AK rifle, and the rifle and pistol are kept in the same case?

    These types of things are confusing. So, if you have a loose stock sitting around in your house when you have a AR pistol, you could be charged with a crime?

    I am not trying to be difficult. It just appears to be unclear what they require.
    Last edited by Beretta92FSLady; 12-30-2010 at 12:26 AM.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

  22. #22
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    BATFE's "constructive possession" doctrine is just like telling a guy that because he has all his "MAN" parts that he is a rapist because HE MIGHT DO IT or that a Woman is a prostitute because she might "sell" some.

    It is a pretend crime of MAYBE! Might as well be "MINORITY REPORT"--- you know, the movie!

    All the more reason to have the BATFE defunded and DIS-ORGANIZED as the UNCONSTITUTIONAL Federal agency that it is!
    Last edited by JoeSparky; 12-30-2010 at 12:29 AM.

  23. #23
    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeSparky View Post
    BATFE's "constructive possession" doctrine is just like telling a guy that because he has all his "MAN" parts that he is a rapist because HE MIGHT DO IT or that a Woman is a prostitute because she might "sell" some.

    It is a pretend crime of MAYBE! Might as well be "MINORITY REPORT"--- you know, the movie!

    All the more reason to have the BATFE defunded and DIS-ORGANIZED as the UNCONSTITUTIONAL Federal agency that it is!

    ^ ^ ^ ^

    what he said.

    Of course, then there's WA stupid "no loaded rifles in a vehicle" which is what makes these lil "not-rifles" so appealing, at least to me. I'd much rather have an underfolder AK in the back of the truck, even with a standard 16" barrel, but don't want to go hunting around for the magazine that will inevitably work its way to the opposite corner of the rig.
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

  24. #24
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalhead47 View Post
    Now that you mention it... (to anyone who can answer), like the lady's question about the fore-grip, what if one had the provision to quickly mount a stock to such a pistol, but no stock was "ever" mounted?
    Again, no. The mere fact that it's easily capable of being added makes it a no-no.

    BUT... the advantage of the AR platform is the modularity..

    One can swap the lowers in about 10 seconds (not even exaggerating). Going from a pistol lower to a lower with a stock would take about 10 seconds, but would also comprise a violation of state and federal law if the barrel was less than 16"...

    In a WROL situation, the BATFE is the last thing to worry about.

  25. #25
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalhead47 View Post
    You've got to be kidding. They can actually bust you based on something you might do with the items at hand???


    So what if you just have a great big mishmosh of all sorts of parts lying on your workbench?
    As long as they are spare parts THAT CAN BE CONFIGURED IN A LEGAL MANNER, then you're good.

    BUT, let's say that all you have is rifle lowers with buttstocks, but you have a 'spare' barrel that's less than 16", you're now in constructive possession of an unregistered SBR because you have the parts to make it...

    There was a guy who had just that, spare parts laying around from misc guns he had owned, one happened to be a short barrel. He had sold the lower but still had the barrel, he was convicted of possessing an unregistered SBR because he could have put them in an illegal configuration, even though he never did.

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