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Thread: Stopped by the Law

  1. #1
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    Stopped by the Law

    While driving back to valley from Globe I was stopped by DPS. I put hands at 10 and 2 and out of respect let him know I was carrying and where my weapon was holstered. With out any questions or any warning he reached for my holstered gun. I yelled at him "wait wait you have no idea how I am carrying if my guns ready to go, and I really do not want to be shot with my own gun today" He takes my gun and tells me to come back to his car. Where he while trying to figure out how to unload my gun points my gun at me 3 times. I told him each and every time I did not want to be shot with my own gun. He then make me wait as he ran the numbers to see if my gun was stolen. My points are these. First if an officer has no idea how to be safe with a gun, though it is his right to take my gun during the stop. If he can not be safe he has no business taking my gun. Second for my safety I am not sure I would ever announce to another officer I am carrying. If I was asked I would not lie, I am just saying I will not volunteer it anymore. I am not a police hater or distrust them, but this experience left me very upset at this one officer.

  2. #2
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    What are you going to do about it?

  3. #3
    Regular Member TOF's Avatar
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    DPS, County Mountie or?

    I sugest you advise his HQ that he does not know how to handle guns. In a nice manner of course.
    Were you ticketed?
    If you woke up breathing, congratulations! You get another chance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOF View Post
    DPS, County Mountie or?

    I sugest you advise his HQ that he does not know how to handle guns. In a nice manner of course.
    Were you ticketed?
    No ticket!!

  5. #5
    Regular Member Nevada carrier's Avatar
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    I take it you will be filing a civil rights lawsuit on Monday?
    Last edited by Nevada carrier; 01-09-2011 at 07:18 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nevada carrier View Post
    I take it you will be filing a civil rights lawsuit on Monday?
    I have not made any plan as of yet. I am angry about it and do plan on at least filing a formal complaint.

  7. #7
    Regular Member AZkopper's Avatar
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    1. He had no 'need' to confiscate the weapon, although within his authority to do so for the duration of the detention.

    2. He had no reason whatsoever to tamper with the weapon (unload it). 'Playing' with a a gun, especially if unfamiliar with it, can have bad consequences (as you saw). best to take it and place it 'as is' on his passenger seat if he must. Better yet, tell you "I'm going to walk back to my vehicle, I want you to leave you gun in the car and then walk back to me."

    3. Since possession of a firearm is not a crime in itself, and he had no reasonable suspicion to suspect any crime was afoot (most traffic offenses are civil) the running of the serial number was highly improper (but I don't know if it crosses the line in to an illegal search).

    Sounds like a DPS newbie to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thickslicedbacon View Post
    While driving back to valley from Globe I was stopped by DPS. I put hands at 10 and 2 and out of respect let him know I was carrying and where my weapon was holstered. With out any questions or any warning he reached for my holstered gun. I yelled at him "wait wait you have no idea how I am carrying if my guns ready to go, and I really do not want to be shot with my own gun today" He takes my gun and tells me to come back to his car. Where he while trying to figure out how to unload my gun points my gun at me 3 times. I told him each and every time I did not want to be shot with my own gun. He then make me wait as he ran the numbers to see if my gun was stolen. My points are these. First if an officer has no idea how to be safe with a gun, though it is his right to take my gun during the stop. If he can not be safe he has no business taking my gun. Second for my safety I am not sure I would ever announce to another officer I am carrying. If I was asked I would not lie, I am just saying I will not volunteer it anymore. I am not a police hater or distrust them, but this experience left me very upset at this one officer.
    and you see how that worked out for you...

    What was the reason for the stop?
    Last edited by mrjam2jab; 01-10-2011 at 09:43 AM.

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    Regular Member rickc1962's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrjam2jab View Post
    and you see how that worked out for you...

    What was the reason for the stop?
    In Pa. things might work like this, but in Az. this as not the norm, this Trouper was wrong and if he keeps doing these kind of things, I can`t see him on the job long. Most Az. LEOs either are gun friendly, or at least obay State law. The problem we have here is a lot of new LE recruits have ether just moved here or grew up in Ca. and not accustom to living in a free state where the 2nd Amendment is respected.

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    Regular Member mFonz77's Avatar
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    It's up to you how you want to handle it, but I'd urge you to file a complain or a lawsuit if warranted. For the rest of us, if not yourself. Glad you were not shot with your own weapon!
    My location says I am from Sierra Vista, AZ which is where I live now but I actually lived in MO for 26 years! So please stop telling me I don't know what I'm talking about when I post in the Missouri forum!

  11. #11
    Regular Member Gunslinger's Avatar
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    What kind of gun are you talking about?

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    I'm sorry to offend you but

    the whole story sounds made up, no cop could be that dumb.
    Maybe it was a police impersonator, or maybe you're just telling stories on the net for fun.
    If it really happened, I apologize- but my BS detector is on red.
    Perhaps you can be more forthcoming with some real facts that can be checked, time /place/Officers number and name?

  13. #13
    Regular Member rodbender's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrsjhnsn View Post
    the whole story sounds made up, no cop could be that dumb.
    Maybe it was a police impersonator, or maybe you're just telling stories on the net for fun.
    If it really happened, I apologize- but my BS detector is on red.
    Perhaps you can be more forthcoming with some real facts that can be checked, time /place/Officers number and name?
    I agree. My BS red alert is flashing a very bright red.
    The thing about common sense is....it ain't too common.
    Will Rogers

  14. #14
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Wall of text.
    No evidence.
    Bad spelling/grammar.
    3 posts.

    I smell something... manure mixed with rotten cabbage and Kool Aid; a Democrat Sock Puppet.
    Last edited by ixtow; 01-10-2011 at 10:01 PM.

  15. #15
    28kfps
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    If right handed the cop would have to reach over the top of arms with the hands at 10 and 2. Making a very awkward angle to pull the gun out of the holster. With the seat belt hookup and the seat back, it is difficult for the wearer pull the gun without some body shift in the seat. I cannot see an officer reaching over the top of a person through a window with the upper half of his body in the window to disarm a person.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by 28kfps View Post
    If right handed the cop would have to reach over the top of arms with the hands at 10 and 2. Making a very awkward angle to pull the gun out of the holster. With the seat belt hookup and the seat back, it is difficult for the wearer pull the gun without some body shift in the seat. I cannot see an officer reaching over the top of a person through a window with the upper half of his body in the window to disarm a person.
    The OP has not told us where the holster was.

    I've learned that unless there is something conclusive to keep any suspicions to myself. Every once in a while an outlandish-seeming post will clear up and turn out to be entirely plausible.

    I've also learned that little is accomplished by early "BS calling". The OPs often contain angles or elements that it does not hurt to discuss. I recommend treating "suspicious" OPs as though they are genuine until something fairly conclusive in the other direction arises.

    Plus, if one wants to follow up a suspicion, one can ask questions sneakily. For example, "Wow. Reached right in and grabbed the gun. Where were you carrying it?" Etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chrsjhnsn View Post
    the whole story sounds made up, no cop could be that dumb.
    Maybe it was a police impersonator, or maybe you're just telling stories on the net for fun.
    If it really happened, I apologize- but my BS detector is on red.
    Perhaps you can be more forthcoming with some real facts that can be checked, time /place/Officers number and name?
    I don't know if his story is true or not, but damn straight there are people, including police officers, that can be that dumb. I had a handgun taken out of my car at a sobriety checkpoint and during my detainment I was swept with the weapon twice from about 3 feet away while the officer struggled to unload it. The first time he did it, it startled me and I tried to move out of the line of fire and protested the negligence and then damn if he didn't do it again. It wasn't only me he swept but other officers that were crowded next to me as well.

    I am not going to reveal to an officer in my state that I have a firearm in my car. In fact, going into that stop, I took the weapon off my belt and put it in a closed container on my passenger seat just so my weapon wouldn't be an issue and turn into a hassle. When I was removed from my car and an officer got in it to move it from the roadway and despite that I had told them I didn't consent to anyone searching my car, that officer opened the container, found and retrieved that weapon.

    If I were ever to declare that I have a weapon in my vehicle, it isn't going to be for the officer's safety or out of respect for him. Its going to be for my safety and only if its in open view so I don't get shot because I am stopped and seen with a gun in easy reach of me. I already know that officer has nothing to worry about unless he or his partner open up with a hail of gunfire and end up shooting each other in a crossfire. I am no threat. My disclosure would be purely for my own safety.

  18. #18
    Regular Member rickc1962's Avatar
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    While in the Army, we had a " solder? " in our platoon, while on the pistol range he was called by the range instructor, instead of putting his safety on and lowering his firearm before turning, he just swung around weapon in firing position and finger on trigger.Our range instructor was a black man, but that day he did turn white. can`t remember what happened to this knucklehead, but it wasn't good. Cops are human, even bad cops, and you just can`t fix stupid!

  19. #19
    Regular Member azcdlfred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rickc1962 View Post
    While in the Army, we had a " solder? " in our platoon, while on the pistol range he was called by the range instructor, instead of putting his safety on and lowering his firearm before turning, he just swung around weapon in firing position and finger on trigger.
    I volunteer at local public ranges as a line safety officer. From my observations (and from having many guns pointed at me), the two groups of people who commit the most safety violations are (1) law enforcement personnel and (2) military personnel. It's as if they are not taught anything about safety or to treat a gun differently if they think it's not loaded.

    Civilian gun handling isn't that good either. Safety errors abound with guns pointed in the wrong direction and fingers on triggers when they shouldn't be.

    I've become so safety conscious that I can't pick up a gas nozzle from the pump without putting my trigger finger alongside the frame. Same with electric drills, spray bottles, etc.

    Fred

  20. #20
    28kfps
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    The OP has not told us where the holster was.

    I've learned that unless there is something conclusive to keep any suspicions to myself. Every once in a while an outlandish-seeming post will clear up and turn out to be entirely plausible.

    I've also learned that little is accomplished by early "BS calling". The OPs often contain angles or elements that it does not hurt to discuss. I recommend treating "suspicious" OPs as though they are genuine until something fairly conclusive in the other direction arises.

    Plus, if one wants to follow up a suspicion, one can ask questions sneakily. For example, "Wow. Reached right in and grabbed the gun. Where were you carrying it?" Etc.
    I do agree with some of your posting. However, I have no need for the follow up questioning coaching. My intention was to submit a questioning post and to encourage a reply with additional information, not a post as if I was a witness to the event or to throw the BS flag. That is why I started out with “IF” right handed. The OP did not say where the holster was, he did say, “I put hands at 10 and 2, and out of respect let him know I was carrying and where my weapon was holstered. Without any questions or any warning he reached for my holstered gun.” This statement has very little wiggle room and for the most part leads one to assume he was in the vehicle when the cop reached for gun. Very seldom do we read where a cop reached into a vehicle to disarm a person unless the cop felt an aggressive threat. As you say additional information can clear up a seeming outlandish post however, I doubt we will see any more information from the OP. I could be wrong. I thought I was wrong once before and realized I had made a mistake.

  21. #21
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    I also call BS

  22. #22
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
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    well,,,

    Quote Originally Posted by jeremy05 View Post
    I also call BS
    its most assuredly a proved BS post now!
    at least he came back 2 times, but never no more, not anywhere!
    Case Closed!!!!
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

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  23. #23
    Regular Member mFonz77's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by azcdlfred View Post

    I've become so safety conscious that I can't pick up a gas nozzle from the pump without putting my trigger finger alongside the frame. Same with electric drills, spray bottles, etc.
    I will pay attention next time I fill up the Jeep, I don't think I do it with gas pumps (mechanism is different muscle memory) but I do do that with drills, etc, anything that is index-trigger actuated...
    My location says I am from Sierra Vista, AZ which is where I live now but I actually lived in MO for 26 years! So please stop telling me I don't know what I'm talking about when I post in the Missouri forum!

  24. #24
    Regular Member azcdlfred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mFonz77 View Post
    I will pay attention next time I fill up the Jeep, I don't think I do it with gas pumps (mechanism is different muscle memory) but I do do that with drills, etc, anything that is index-trigger actuated...
    I didn't start paying attention until I was walking around with a spray bottle and noticed my hand was hurting. I looked down and saw that I had my index finger alongside the nozzle. That's when I started becoming aware of doing that with anything that has a trigger or is shaped like a gun. I go out of my way not to "muzzle" myslef when handling these items also.

    I also can't pick up any gun without doing a chamber check and magazine check. Even at home, whenever I pick up my own gun.

    Fred

  25. #25
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrsjhnsn View Post
    the whole story sounds made up, no cop could be that dumb.
    I beg to differ...

    I was detained in WA for open carrying.. The officer racked the slide back on my glock, then dropped the magazine.. I told the officer that there was a round in the chamber and he yelled back that he knew what he was doing, and handed my gun to another officer.. The other officer glared at him, racked the slide back, and of course out popped the chambered round.... I just shook my head at him....

    The scary part was... They were issued Glock 22s, I had a Glock 17, they are IDENTICAL in size and function.....

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