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Thread: It's working...

  1. #1
    Regular Member clarkebar's Avatar
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    It's working...

    So, for the past three days I've open carried, in a tactical thigh holster, everywhere I have traveled while riding a motorcycle. I have been passed by three police officers on my right side, which is where I wear my firearm, and I have been to numerous places with moderate to large groups of people. I KNOW I have been noticed. I'm a little shocked though...

    NOBODY CARES!!!

    It's AMAZING! The worst I've gotten so far is a few frightened looks but by-in-large the response has been a positive one. I've had a couple of people express thier curiosity about what kind of revolver I'm carrying. Absolutely NOONE has asked me why or if it was legal. I think our movement is working! Well, at least in Idaho... :-)

  2. #2
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Carry on!
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    Maybe we'll see you next week at the meeting?!?

  4. #4
    Regular Member clarkebar's Avatar
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    Uh... Duh! Without me you guys wouldn't know who to beat for membership dues

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    Sorry, I wasn't clear, I meant that for Protias man.....

  6. #6
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ecocks View Post
    Maybe we'll see you next week at the meeting?!?
    It may be a long time before I make a trip out to ID. Maybe one day, but first I'd have to study your carry laws first.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by ecocks View Post
    Maybe we'll see you next week at the meeting?!?
    Uhhh... Isn't the meeting tomorrow eve?

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    Sigh......Maybe we'll see you at the meeting THIS week.

    My days/weeks are all running together now.

    Apologies.

  9. #9
    Regular Member cdub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    It may be a long time before I make a trip out to ID. Maybe one day, but first I'd have to study your carry laws first.

    pretty simple

    OC is legal EVERY WERE but public schools k-12
    no licensee required

  10. #10
    Regular Member Jero1987's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by clarkebar View Post
    ...
    NOBODY CARES!!!
    ... ... I think our movement is working! ... :-)
    Couldn't have said it better.

    Carry on!

  11. #11
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdub View Post
    pretty simple

    OC is legal EVERY WERE but public schools k-12
    no licensee required
    On the property or that stupid 1000 ft rule? Is there a permit to OC or only need a permit to CC?
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  12. #12
    Regular Member clarkebar's Avatar
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    Actually...

    Federal law provides for no carry within 1000 ft of a public school and other federal property. Idaho statutes provide acceptions to the public school carry prohibition. These are in sections (d) and (e), Here's the law:

    TITLE 18
    CRIMES AND PUNISHMENTS
    CHAPTER 33
    FIREARMS, EXPLOSIVES AND OTHER DEADLY WEAPONS
    18-3302D.Possessing weapons or firearms on school property.
    (1) (a) It shall be unlawful and is a misdemeanor for any person to possess a firearm or other deadly or dangerous weapon while on the property of a school or in those portions of any building, stadium or other structure on school grounds which, at the time of the violation, were being used for an activity sponsored by or through a school in this state or while riding school provided transportation.
    (b) The provisions of this section regarding the possession of a firearm or other deadly or dangerous weapon on school property shall also apply to students of schools while attending or participating in any school sponsored activity, program or event regardless of location.
    (2) Definitions. As used in this section:
    (a) "Deadly or dangerous weapon" means any weapon as defined in 18 U.S.C. section 930;
    (b) "Firearm" means any firearm as defined in 18 U.S.C. section 921;
    (c) "Minor" means a person under the age of eighteen (18) years;
    (d) "Possess" means to bring an object, or to cause it to be brought, onto the property of a public or private elementary or secondary school, or onto a vehicle being used for school provided transportation, or to exercise dominion and control over an object located anywhere on such property or vehicle. For purposes of subsection (1)(b) of this section, "possess" shall also mean to bring an object onto the site of a school sponsored activity, program or event, regardless of location, or to exercise dominion and control over an object located anywhere on such a site;
    (e) "School" means a private or public elementary or secondary school.
    (3) Right to search students or minors. For purposes of enforcing the provisions of this section, employees of a school district shall have the right to search all students or minors, including their belongings and lockers, that are reasonably believed to be in violation of the provisions of this section, or applicable school rule or district policy, regarding the possessing of a firearm or other deadly or dangerous weapon.
    (4) The provisions of this section shall not apply to the following persons:
    (a) A peace officer;
    (b) A person who lawfully possesses a firearm or deadly or dangerous weapon as an appropriate part of a program, an event, activity or other circumstance approved by the board of trustees or governing board;
    (c) A person or persons complying with the provisions of section 19-202A, Idaho Code;
    (d) Any adult over eighteen (18) years of age and not enrolled in a public or private elementary or secondary school who has lawful possession of a firearm or other deadly or dangerous weapon, secured and locked in his vehicle in an unobtrusive, nonthreatening manner;
    (e) A person who lawfully possesses a firearm or other deadly or dangerous weapon in a private vehicle while delivering minor children, students or school employees to and from school or a school activity;
    (f) Notwithstanding the provisions of section 18-3302C, Idaho Code, a person or an employee of the school or school district who is authorized to carry a firearm with the permission of the board of trustees of the school district or the governing board.
    (5) Penalties. Persons who are found guilty of violating the provisions of this section may be sentenced to a jail term of not more than one (1) year or fined an amount not in excess of one thousand dollars ($1,000) or both. If a violator is a student and under the age of eighteen (18) years, the court may place the violator on probation and suspend the juvenile detention or fine or both as long as the violator is enrolled in a program of study recognized by the court that, upon successful completion, will grant the violator a general equivalency diploma (GED) or a high school diploma or other educational program authorized by the court. Upon successful completion of the terms imposed by the court, the court shall discharge the offender from serving the remainder of the sentence. If the violator does not complete, is suspended from, or otherwise withdraws from the program of study imposed by the court, the court, upon receiving such information, shall order the violator to commence serving the sentence provided for in this section.


    I feel I should also mention this because (some of you may have noticed) it's cited as an acception above and it's my favorite Idaho statute... Oh, and also because it exempts one from ANY prosecution for carrying/discharging/brandishing/anything else when coming to the aid of another.

    TITLE 19
    CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
    CHAPTER 2
    PREVENTION OF PUBLIC OFFENSES
    19-202A.Legal jeopardy in cases of self-defense and defense of other threatened parties.
    No person in this state shall be placed in legal jeopardy of any kind whatsoever for protecting himself or his family by reasonable means necessary, or when coming to the aid of another whom he reasonably believes to be in imminent danger of or the victim of aggravated assault, robbery, rape, murder or other heinous crime.
    Last edited by clarkebar; 01-13-2011 at 01:25 PM.

  13. #13
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    The current federal GFSZ has a stipulation in it that the 1000' rule does not apply to permitted people by their state.


    Title 18 U.S.C §922(q) The Gun Free School Zones Act of 1995 States:
    (A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.

    (B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm—
    (i) on private property not part of school grounds;
    (ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license;
    (iii) that is— (I) not loaded; and (II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
    (iv) by an individual for use in a program approved by a school in the school zone;
    (v) by an individual in accordance with a contract entered into between a school in the school zone and the individual or an employer of the individual;
    (vi) by a law enforcement officer acting in his or her official capacity; or
    (vii) that is unloaded and is possessed by an individual while traversing school premises for the purpose of gaining access to public or private lands open to hunting, if the entry on school premises is authorized by school authorities.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  14. #14
    Regular Member clarkebar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    The current federal GFSZ has a stipulation in it that the 1000' rule does not apply to permitted people by their state.
    Oh yeah! I forgot about that!

  15. #15
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by clarkebar View Post
    Oh yeah! I forgot about that!
    It happens. It took me a few reminders to remember that stipulation.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  16. #16
    Regular Member oldbanger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    The current federal GFSZ has a stipulation in it that the 1000' rule does not apply to permitted people by their state.
    (ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State...

    Unfortunately that is the kicker, open carry is not licensed in Idaho so you really have to have a CWL to walk down the street (OC) lest you enter a "Twilight Zone".

    However

    (e) A person who lawfully possesses a firearm or other deadly or dangerous weapon in a private vehicle while delivering minor children, students or school employees to and from school or a school activity;

    Idaho Code allows OC & CC in a vehicle...

    (9) While in any motor vehicle, inside the limits or confines of any city, a person shall not carry a concealed weapon on or about his person without a license to carry a concealed weapon. This shall not apply to any firearm located in plain view whether it is loaded or unloaded.
    http://legislature.idaho.gov/idstat/...ECT18-3302.htm

    So without a CWL you would not be "permitted" and fall under the GFSZ
    Last edited by oldbanger; 01-13-2011 at 05:29 PM.

  17. #17
    Regular Member oldbanger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by clarkebar View Post
    Federal law provides for no carry within 1000 ft of a public school and other federal property.
    Just schools I think.

  18. #18
    Regular Member clarkebar's Avatar
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    And other federal property

    Is there a federal property in Idaho that isn't a gun free zone? I know the VA hospital is DEFINATELY a gun free zone, signs are posted everywhere citing a US code. I'd have to go look at them to look up the specific one. I thought Post Offices were also supposedly gun free, although someone said there's an exception that isn't posted on the signs for the post office which exempts everyone who can legally own a gun.

    I'm gonna do some more research...

  19. #19
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by clarkebar View Post
    Is there a federal property in Idaho that isn't a gun free zone? I know the VA hospital is DEFINATELY a gun free zone, signs are posted everywhere citing a US code. I'd have to go look at them to look up the specific one. I thought Post Offices were also supposedly gun free, although someone said there's an exception that isn't posted on the signs for the post office which exempts everyone who can legally own a gun.

    I'm gonna do some more research...
    I've heard some people do carry in post officers, but I do not know if that is legal or not. I've never taken the time to really look.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  20. #20
    Regular Member shad0wfax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    I've heard some people do carry in post officers, but I do not know if that is legal or not. I've never taken the time to really look.
    Carry in a U.S. Post Office is actually not a violation of 18 USC "federal law" but is a violation of the Postal Code (which is in the CFR's or Code of Federal Regulations.)

    It's been discussed in other forums, and a forum search should reveal it. (I believe our WA state forums have handled it in the past.)

    It's nuanced, and I'd recommend not doing it because whether it's CFR or USC you're still dealing with federal agencies...

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