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Thread: Police: Settlement won't change police response to reports of weapons

  1. #1
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Police: Settlement won't change police response to reports of weapons

    http://www.brookfieldnow.com/news/113281074.html

    The city of Brookfield will pay $7,500 to settle a federal lawsuit filed by a Milwaukee woman who was arrested for carrying a holstered handgun to a church service in July, but that doesn't mean the Police Department will change its policies about responding to similar reports.
    Brookfield Police Capt. Phil Horter said the lawsuit won't change protocol for officers responding to reports of armed individuals - but he urges residents to provide as much information as possible when reporting these cases so officers can temper their responses.
    "Is it somebody who has a handgun in a holster, or someone who has it in their hand? There's a big difference," he said. "The open-carry response is going to be less than that of a man with a gun. But if we don't get proper information, we will respond with force more similar to a man with a gun."


    click the link for rest of article

    So looks like they'll still respond to anyone carrying. Make sure to carry a recorder while in Brookfield!
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    Regular Member johnny amish's Avatar
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    Sounds like easy profits to be made in Brookfield.
    Last edited by johnny amish; 01-11-2011 at 10:38 PM.
    "To sin by silence, when we should protest makes cowards out of men."
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    We must contact our lawmakers today, tomorrow and the next day to remind them of Constitutional Carry.
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    Regular Member oak1971's Avatar
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    I see dollar signs $$$
    In God I trust. Everyone else needs to keep your hands where I can see them.

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oak1971 View Post
    I see dollar signs $$$
    Really? I see a city that is willing to infringe upon people's right to bear arms. They seem to forget "The people have the right to keep and bear arms for security, defense, hunting, recreation or any other lawful purpose."
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    Regular Member oak1971's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    Really? I see a city that is willing to infringe upon people's right to bear arms.
    Which is why they will be paying.
    In God I trust. Everyone else needs to keep your hands where I can see them.

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    Somebody just needs to tell the residents these things are different:
    • Man carrying gun in holster
    • Man threatening with gun
    • Man shooting gun at people
    It really is that simple. Apparently, the chief is incapable of 1) telling people there is a difference, and 2) telling his dispatchers to ask

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    Regular Member Kelevra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    Somebody just needs to tell the residents these things are different:
    • Man carrying gun in holster
    • Man threatening with gun
    • Man shooting gun at people
    It really is that simple. Apparently, the chief is incapable of 1) telling people there is a difference, and 2) telling his dispatchers to ask
    Good idea. The problem is not one of education but rather ego and arrogance. This would have all gone away if the award had been $75000 or $750000.

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    Campaign Veteran GLOCK21GB's Avatar
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    With 7500.00 I could buy that Submachine gun in my Avatar. maybe Brookfield would like to give me the money...LOL
    http://youtu.be/xWgVGu3OR4U AACFI, Wisconsin / Minnesota Carry Certified. Action Pistol & Advanced Action pistol concepts + Urban Carbine course. When the entitlement Zombies begin looting, pillaging, raping, burning & killing..remember HEAD SHOTS it's the only way to kill a Zombie. Stockpile food & water now.

    Please support your local,county, state & Federal Law enforcement agencies, right ???

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    funny...I didn't know liberty had a monetary price.

  10. #10
    McX
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    it's funny, the article sounds like the police are begging the public to be more accurate and correct in their reporting, so they can be more accurate and correct in their responses.

  11. #11
    Regular Member paul@paul-fisher.com's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McX View Post
    it's funny, the article sounds like the police are begging the public to be more accurate and correct in their reporting, so they can be more accurate and correct in their responses.
    That sounds almost reasonable. However, they need to train their dispatchers to ask the correct questions:

    911 what is your emergency
    well... there's a guy with a gun
    Is the gun in a holster or in his hand?
    in a holster
    is the man yelling or physically threatening anyone?
    No

    One of 2 scenarios:

    OK. Well send an officer by to have a look (dispatch to officer) - mwag, most likely an OC'er

    officer drives by, see nothing amiss and goes on his way.

    Or

    dispatcher tells caller, it is legal, call back if he does something threatening.

    Obviously if 'brandishing' or discharge or other violence/threats occur, dispatch occurs.


    No matter what, when/if officer arrives, assesses situation and responds appropriately, which could mean no contact.

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    "he urges residents to provide as much information as possible when reporting these cases so officers can temper their responses"
    HA.
    Sounds like he's trying to get the public to think that their over-reaction in my case was due to the people making the call.

    Those of you who've listened to the call know that the calltaker, dispatcher, & responding officers had all the information they needed to know I wasn't doing anything wrong, yet they did the wrong thing anyway.

    Here's the link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oz3KCf2l9QI

    I agree with Pauls scenario - either the dispatcher tells the caller it's not an issue & stop tying up the emergency system, or they do a drive-by & see there's no problem & keep on driving.
    For liability, I think the second reaction is more probable.
    But I really like how Delavan handled it!
    Last edited by MKEgal; 01-13-2011 at 12:36 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by MLK, Jr
    The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort & convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge & controversy.
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    Citizenship is a verb.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proverbs 27:12
    A prudent person foresees the danger ahead and takes precautions.
    The simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences.
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    Regular Member LR Yote 312's Avatar
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    At least now I know how to get the money for the Dana 60 air locker
    axles and lift kit I want for the Jeep.

    Just take a walk in Brookfield.

    LR Yote
    *NOTE: No Longer under the tyranny of Milwaukee County.


    Watch your thoughts; they become words.
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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LR Yote 312
    At least now I know how to get the money for the Dana 60 air locker axles and lift kit I want for the Jeep.
    Come to the Panera lunch on the 22nd!
    Quote Originally Posted by MLK, Jr
    The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort & convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge & controversy.
    Quote Originally Posted by MSG Laigaie
    Citizenship is a verb.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proverbs 27:12
    A prudent person foresees the danger ahead and takes precautions.
    The simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proverbs 31:17
    She dresses herself with strength and makes her arms strong.

  15. #15
    Regular Member LR Yote 312's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MKEgal View Post
    Come to the Panera lunch on the 22nd!
    Dont know if I can make that yet or not.
    Unemployment hasnt been goin far and the new job will hold back a week.

    If I can... I will try to be there.

    LR Yote
    *NOTE: No Longer under the tyranny of Milwaukee County.


    Watch your thoughts; they become words.
    Watch your words; they become actions.
    Watch your actions; they become habits.
    Watch your habits; they become character.
    Watch your character; it becomes your destiny.
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    Founder's Club Member Brass Magnet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MKEgal View Post
    I agree with Pauls' scenario - either the dispatcher tells the caller it's not an issue & stop tying up the emergency system, or they do a drive-by & see there's no problem & keep on driving.
    For liability, I think the second reaction is more probable.
    But I really like how Delavan handled it!
    Where does this come from? I've heard this quite a few times before and I believe it's a misconception that the police are in anyway liable for NOT responding to something. Is there a statute I'm missing?

    They didn't respond to the poor women in Warren v. D.C. who were repeatedly raped and beaten. The courts didn't find them liable as they have no duty to protect us.

    I think this comes from the cops themselves trying to say that's the reason they must harass OC'ers however; I don't think there is any liability there for failure to respond; only screwing up while responding.
    Last edited by Brass Magnet; 01-12-2011 at 04:00 PM.
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    Regular Member LR Yote 312's Avatar
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    I spent a half hour cuffed,because Cudahy cant distinguish a LAC from a
    BG even when they had a description of the BG.

    The more ANY LEO leaves me alone, The happier I feel.

    LR Yote
    *NOTE: No Longer under the tyranny of Milwaukee County.


    Watch your thoughts; they become words.
    Watch your words; they become actions.
    Watch your actions; they become habits.
    Watch your habits; they become character.
    Watch your character; it becomes your destiny.
    - Frank Outlaw

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    Campaign Veteran GLOCK21GB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LR Yote 312 View Post
    I spent a half hour cuffed,because Cudahy cant distinguish a LAC from a
    BG even when they had a description of the BG.

    The more ANY LEO leaves me alone, The happier I feel.

    LR Yote
    How were you dressed today ? Were you wearing a tacticool drop leg thigh holster ? Camo Pants ?
    sometimes it helps to look like you could be a cop. Nice clothes, flat top hair cut, clean shaven. The key to not dealing with cops is to blend.

    Not saying you did anything wrong, but I have yet to have any type of a run in with LEO. because I look like I could be one. 6'6" 290, Military style hair cut, etc.
    Last edited by GLOCK21GB; 01-12-2011 at 07:03 PM.
    http://youtu.be/xWgVGu3OR4U AACFI, Wisconsin / Minnesota Carry Certified. Action Pistol & Advanced Action pistol concepts + Urban Carbine course. When the entitlement Zombies begin looting, pillaging, raping, burning & killing..remember HEAD SHOTS it's the only way to kill a Zombie. Stockpile food & water now.

    Please support your local,county, state & Federal Law enforcement agencies, right ???

  19. #19
    Regular Member oak1971's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock34 View Post
    How were you dressed today ? Were you wearing a tacticool drop leg thigh holster ? Camo Pants ?
    sometimes it helps to look like you could be a cop. Nice clothes, flat top hair cut, clean shaven. The key to not dealing with cops is to blend.

    Not saying you did anything wrong, but I have yet to have any type of a run in with LEO. because I look like I could be one. 6'6" 290, Military style hair cut, etc.
    I don't look like a cop, never seems to get me any undue attention.
    In God I trust. Everyone else needs to keep your hands where I can see them.

  20. #20
    Regular Member paul@paul-fisher.com's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oak1971 View Post
    I don't look like a cop, never seems to get me any undue attention.
    +1

  21. #21
    Regular Member HandyHamlet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock34 View Post
    How were you dressed today ? Were you wearing a tacticool drop leg thigh holster ? Camo Pants ?
    sometimes it helps to look like you could be a cop. Nice clothes, flat top hair cut, clean shaven. The key to not dealing with cops is to blend.
    oh boy...

    Never assume for the obvious reasoning.
    "Don't interfere with anything in the Constitution. That must be maintained, for it is the only safeguard of our liberties."
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    "Some time ago, a bunch of lefties defied the law by dancing at the Jefferson Memorial, resulting in their arrests. Last week, a bunch of them pulled the same stunt and - using patented Lefist techniques - provoked the Park Police into having to use force to arrest them."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock34 View Post
    .......... I have yet to have any type of a run in with LEO. because I look like I could be one. 6'6" 290, Military style hair cut, etc.
    Aaahhh, 6'6" 290, yea there are VERY FEW people going to mess with you!

    I thought my 6'2" 250 with a bald head and a Fu-Man-Chu kept keep everyone away!

  23. #23
    Regular Member Zeus's Avatar
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    Glock34, I think you should be on the plane to ATL this weekend. Big game ya know
    When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.
    --Thomas Jefferson

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    Quote Originally Posted by McX View Post
    it's funny, the article sounds like the police are begging the public to be more accurate and correct in their reporting, so they can be more accurate and correct in their responses.
    What is omitted is that the police, upon arriving, can just make their own observation.

    No brandishing, no shooting, then no RAS (unless something is alleged by a caller who also meets whatever are the courts' standards for indicators of reliability). No RAS? Then, consensual encounter only.

  25. #25
    Regular Member LR Yote 312's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock34 View Post


    I'm sorry...Did you say somethin ??

    LR Yote
    *NOTE: No Longer under the tyranny of Milwaukee County.


    Watch your thoughts; they become words.
    Watch your words; they become actions.
    Watch your actions; they become habits.
    Watch your habits; they become character.
    Watch your character; it becomes your destiny.
    - Frank Outlaw

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