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Thread: innovative handgun design patent

  1. #1
    Regular Member kryptonian's Avatar
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    innovative handgun design patent

    a few years ago i came up with an innovative handgun design and checked into getting it developed. here's what i ran into -
    patent) starts at about $5000 and goes up quick. talked to a patent attorney i knew and said a handgun design would be a lot more due to federal intervention. the patents have to be written, blueprinted and researched to cover slight variations that someone could do to gob off of your design. also said to do all the development under an LLC to seperate your assets from your company.

    gun manufacterers) contacted several by email and asked if they were interested in helping me with developing it. sig, smith and wesson, colt, glock etc. NOT ONE RESPONSE.

    ATF) prototype approval needed from them. they asked if it were an automatic weapon or could be modified to be one. i said no.

    research) patent attorney gave me US patent research website. as far as i can see it is a unique design. thats good.

    invention submission companies) don't waste your time. old girlfriend went to one with her concept for an air dryer thing for the bathroom. they of course tell you it's a great idea and we have companies interested blah blah..we need $1500 to have designs made up blah blah..then we need $3000 for a prototype blah blah... plus heard horror stories about proprietary rights just plain stolen from unpatented ideas despite confidentiality agreements.

    sorry guys can't even give you a hint on it and hate to be a tease but i thought you may have ideas, connections, or thoughts on it. yes you can OC it. any help appreciated. thanks

  2. #2
    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    I wish you the best of luck!

    All OCDO members will get free models every 5 years right?
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

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  3. #3
    Regular Member kryptonian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eastmeyers View Post
    I wish you the best of luck!

    All OCDO members will get free models every 5 years right?
    of course

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    Inventing things can be tricky. The rewards are proportionate to the difficulty in attaining it. Don't give up I have an idea or two myself.

    Do you know what a poor mans patent is?

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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Inventing things can be tricky. The rewards are proportionate to the difficulty in attaining it. Don't give up I have an idea or two myself.

    Do you know what a poor mans patent is?
    Don't waste your time with a patent. If your design gets picked up by someone with the resources to actually enforce such ridiculous notions in court, they will also have the money to obtain the patent in the first place.

    Without such resources, a patent is a great way to reveal your design to anybody who might wish to copy its innovations before you've secured a place in the market or have the means to defend your monopoly.

    But, then again, I'm one of those folks who doesn't believe in imaginary property (including patents), so my opinion is biased.

  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Do you know what a poor mans patent is?
    No such thing.

    Unfortunately, no aspect of IP law is designed or bears the potential to benefit true individual innovators, creators, artists and the like, especially those who have little or no money of their own. The whole concept has become a racket to defend the obscene profits of lawyers and middlemen, and the occasional super-rich rock star, who receive decent royalty payments only as a salary for their second job as professional shills for the concept of IP, and to convince them the lies they tell are truth, since those lies seem to be true in their own experience (in case any of said super-rich performance "artists" have morals to go with their utter lack of intellect).
    Last edited by marshaul; 01-15-2011 at 01:45 AM.

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    You write out your idea in as much detail as possible, include drawings etc. Include something like a newsclipping, or bank receipt with a date. Then send it through the mail to yourself. Do not open the package. The postmark date will establish a timeline that you can use to prove that you had the idea first.

  8. #8
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    You write out your idea in as much detail as possible, include drawings etc. Include something like a newsclipping, or bank receipt with a date. Then send it through the mail to yourself. Do not open the package. The postmark date will establish a timeline that you can use to prove that you had the idea first.
    Nope. That doesn't work. Really.

    http://www.inventionpatent.net/paten...;s-patent.html

    http://spectrum.ieee.org/at-work/inn...or-mans-patent

    I meant every word I said.

    Edit: Are you an IP apologist? (I didn't bother to figure out what the point of those links is. I hate eminem.) That's always hilarious. Nothing like a belief in the imaginary.
    Last edited by marshaul; 01-15-2011 at 02:03 AM.

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    People often hate what they do not understand.

  10. #10
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    People often hate what they do not understand.
    So far, I've demonstrated a bit more knowledge on the subject than you have. Poor man's patent? Good look getting that to hold up in court! And, if I needed to impress you, I'd assure you that I'm anything but unacquainted with the concept and its legal ins and outs.

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    my bad, I was referring to your reaction to my links, not your advice, which I find accurate.

  12. #12
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    my bad, I was referring to your reaction to my links, not your advice, which I find accurate.
    Ah, I see. My apologies for the snarky reply. Well, you got me there. I cannot understand what I do not explore. I confess to the sin of willful ignorance.

    Edit: Actually, I don't hate Eminem himself. He has written decent lyrics (an ex girlfriend forced me to concede this point). I just don't find any connection to the culture of most hip-hip or rap music. Nor do I entertain it musically. So hate is not the correct term. I am merely uninterested in Eminem.
    Last edited by marshaul; 01-15-2011 at 02:21 AM.

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    I understand. His lyrics reflect much that I have experienced, and for me, he is a local, so I tend to gravitate to the guy. I really don't like to limit myself too much with music, if my ipod is on shuffle, you'll hear M&M, then maybe Metallica, then Tim McGraw, some church music, then maybe Lady Gaga, it can at times be a little amusing. :P

  14. #14
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    I understand. His lyrics reflect much that I have experienced, and for me, he is a local, so I tend to gravitate to the guy. I really don't like to limit myself too much with music, if my ipod is on shuffle, you'll hear M&M, then maybe Metallica, then Tim McGraw, some church music, then maybe Lady Gaga, it can at times be a little amusing. :P
    Actually, sounds like you'd get along with the aforementioned ex better than I would.

    Seriously though, I have pretty eclectic music taste as well. I do like most things, and I can understand the appreciation of all forms of music. Hip-hop is one of the very few things that I've never developed the acquired taste for. Although I do confess to having Ready to Die and a couple of Cypress Hill albums kicking around.

    Anyway, I'm actually curious about this gun design. If it really is innovative, I hope to one day get a look at it. Of course the designer is free to keep his secrets as he sees fit, but I've always been exceptionally interested in firearm mechanics and design. And, I might not support IP, but I respect contracts, and my word is my bond. I'd sign an NDA.

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    Me too, its itchin at me good.

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    Regular Member kryptonian's Avatar
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    thanks guys. wasn't meant to stir up a sociological debate on the economic structure or eminem lyrics. the poor man's patent i also heard was an urban legend but thanks for the info. i used to deliver to kid rock's manager in birmingham and they said they had to do all kind of extra stuff to avoid copyright lawsuits sent thru the mail. people used to send trackable packages to them with a self addressed stamped envelope with a tshirt to sign or something and when new cd comes out these people hit them with copyright lawsuits saying they wrote his hit songs and their package contained lyrics. funny no suits for songs that aren't hits.
    hey marshaul - theres a rich rockstar who loves guns. i could call it the the kid rock gun. get some street cred.

  17. #17
    Regular Member Golden Eagle's Avatar
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    Wink

    Quote Originally Posted by kryptonian View Post
    sorry guys can't even give you a hint on it...
    Leaked video of prototype!: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7-Q-PkeO94

  18. #18
    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Golden Eagle View Post
    Leaked video of prototype!: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7-Q-PkeO94
    Would never work without the Scope Bottle...

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    Quote Originally Posted by kryptonian View Post
    a few years ago i came up with an innovative handgun design and checked into getting it developed. here's what i ran into -
    patent) starts at about $5000 and goes up quick. talked to a patent attorney i knew and said a handgun design would be a lot more due to federal intervention. the patents have to be written, blueprinted and researched to cover slight variations that someone could do to gob off of your design. also said to do all the development under an LLC to seperate your assets from your company.

    gun manufacterers) contacted several by email and asked if they were interested in helping me with developing it. sig, smith and wesson, colt, glock etc. NOT ONE RESPONSE.

    ATF) prototype approval needed from them. they asked if it were an automatic weapon or could be modified to be one. i said no.

    research) patent attorney gave me US patent research website. as far as i can see it is a unique design. thats good.

    invention submission companies) don't waste your time. old girlfriend went to one with her concept for an air dryer thing for the bathroom. they of course tell you it's a great idea and we have companies interested blah blah..we need $1500 to have designs made up blah blah..then we need $3000 for a prototype blah blah... plus heard horror stories about proprietary rights just plain stolen from unpatented ideas despite confidentiality agreements.

    sorry guys can't even give you a hint on it and hate to be a tease but i thought you may have ideas, connections, or thoughts on it. yes you can OC it. any help appreciated. thanks

    I would suggest bringing in a financial partner if you have something you feel would be a real winner. You can have a privacy agreement drawn up and have potential investors sign it before showing them. A lot of good ideas go to waste due to lack of funds, there are other options than just sitting on it. good luck!

  20. #20
    Regular Member NHCGRPR45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    I understand. His lyrics reflect much that I have experienced, and for me, he is a local, so I tend to gravitate to the guy. I really don't like to limit myself too much with music, if my ipod is on shuffle, you'll hear M&M, then maybe Metallica, then Tim McGraw, some church music, then maybe Lady Gaga, it can at times be a little amusing. :P

    Stainless your always surprising me!!! You so don't dress the part of a MM and lady Gaga fan! Simply by wearing pants that fit and a belt that works you would have been thrown out of that band wagon (pun intended)! And I apologise before hand for this comment. That homemade drop leg would never pass muster with any self repecting "gangsta" party. Its certainly not a bling bling deal, its pretty wack homie. So upgrade your fly gear my main dude and party on!!

    I also apologise for any mistake in proper gangsta terminology before hand. My bad homies.
    But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Declaration of Independence July 4, 1776

    Michigan Concealed Pistol Instructor. Cost 80.00 With advanced techniques included free. PM for more information!

  21. #21
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    Baaahahahaha

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    My advice would be to find an experienced machinast, toll and die maker, you can trust. Build the thing, blue prints, etc,start with the ATF stuff first, that way a govt agency has the design dated and on record, then immediately file for the patent. If the ATF rejects it, you can correct the problems and amend the patent. Good luck.
    This site has been hijacked by leftists who attack opposition to further their own ends. Those who have never served this country and attack those who do are no longer worthy of my time or attention.

  23. #23
    Regular Member kryptonian's Avatar
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    thanks guys. keep your ears open and let me know. was a cop and lots of my mental inventions spring from there. actually think of stuff like this all the time but lack the backing to start them. my concept is very simple and it's one of those "why didn't anybody else think of this before?" things.

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    The poor Mans Patent

    Actually it does exist. It's called a Provisional Patent and only costs 105 dollars to apply. However, there are some significant downsides to using this approach. You have 1 year to file for a full Patent, if you don't follow through your idea is up for grabs for anyone who's read your provisional. Yeah, there are outfits who's wole purpose is to scan the Provisional Patents and file on good ideas the originator couldn't afford to patent.

    BTW, I've actually done some looking into getting a patent. Unfortunately, in my case getting a full patent would cost well north to 75K because I'd need to go international. My particular idea has the potential of increasing the cruise fuel efficiency of a gasoline engine by at least 30%. Bad news is it will probably run about 2 million to put together a working engine that uses this idea.

    Now, here is one approach you may want to consider. That is to file for a Provisional and then take that to a Venture Capital firm to get the funding for a full Patent and build some working prototypes. If it's a really good solid and innovative idea, there are Venture firms that will take a risk on something like this. Downside is that you'll have to sign away some or all of your rights to the Patent to the Venture firm in return for their money.

    The other approach is to put together a working model, make sure it works as envisioned, and then pool a group of family and friends to obtain the funds for a full patent who then have a share in any proceeds resulting from that Patent.

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    Is there a specific reason you capitalized Venture?

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