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Thread: Lucky LEO!!!

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    Regular Member Tucker6900's Avatar
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    Lucky LEO!!!

    This was posted on Iowacarry.org.

    A "routine traffic stop" in Montana turned ugly. Listen for the first "click" as the stopped driver pulls out and a .41 magnum revolver at the police officer.
    The "click" is the hammer dropping on an already fired round in the cylinder. The second round was live! A lucky police officer indeed!
    The 'suspect' was shot in the back while driving away and died on scene after crashing into a telephone pole.
    Please note the outstanding speed at which the trooper draws his weapon and fires... the entire magazine...all 15 rounds -- Accurately!

    Practice makes perfect. Any chance to practice helps to save innocent lives.

    The subject Dashboard video, from a January 2010 traffic stop in Hamilton, Montana. A jury ruled on April 13, 2010, that Hamilton Police Officer Ross Jessop was justified in shooting Raymond Thane Davis.

    Please click here to view the evidence video:

    http://billingsgazette.com/news/stat...cc4c002e0.html


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    Regular Member frommycolddeadhands's Avatar
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    The link is no good. I get a 'page doesn't exist' error.
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    lucky and well trained cop

    glad he is safe

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    Quote Originally Posted by manicdevery View Post
    lucky and well trained cop

    glad he is safe
    When I was trained as a USAF SP, we were taught to stand by the door frame between the front and back seats, not directly in front of the driver's window. It is much harder for a driver to aim a gun at you if you are not directly in front of the driver's side window. This officer stood where the driver could easily and suddenly aim the firearm at him.

    I hope he adjusts how he handles stops in the future.

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    The LEO fired 14 times, and people ask why we need more than a 10-round magazine?

    Sheesh... I'm going to keep this for play at any trial whereby I, with my 16-round magazine would ever be accused of using "excessive force."

    Good on the cop for ducking away instead of standing right next to the door while he draws!

    I'm glad he wasn't hurt. He sure was level-headed as he called it in.

    The guy certainly got what was coming to him.
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    Regular Member OldCurlyWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manicdevery View Post
    lucky and well trained cop

    glad he is safe
    Not Quite. He would be dead without the misfire(empty case). He was badly out of position for a safe traffic stop.

    I am glad he was lucky. I hate LEO funerals for LOD deaths.
    Last edited by OldCurlyWolf; 01-18-2011 at 11:18 AM.
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    i have never seen someone openly admit that they've had "plenty" to drink...so i knew something was gonna go bad after that because no one just wants to go to jail. he probably figured he'd tell the truth and lay another LEO down in a rain of bullets and get off scotch free....

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    Why didn't the LEO use a Taser on the gun owner?

    /sarcasm off

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldCurlyWolf View Post
    Not Quite. He would be dead without the misfire(empty case). He was badly out of position for a safe traffic stop.

    I am glad he was lucky. I hate LEO funerals for LOD deaths.
    You are one of the few on this forum OCW. A true gentleman.

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    Regular Member OldCurlyWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by palerider116 View Post
    You are one of the few on this forum OCW. A true gentleman.
    In 1994 I had to help bury a friend and an acquaintance, both of them were Pasadena, TX, PD. In 1979, I came real close to burying an academy mate. But he had DR. Red Duke as his surgeon and he "got'r done".

    I hate having to do that.
    I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do those things to other people and I require the same of them.

    Politicians should serve two terms, one in office and one in prison.(borrowed from RioKid)

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    Wow. He was very lucky. Glad he is safe and one more BG is off the streets for good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by palerider116 View Post
    You are one of the few on this forum OCW. A true gentleman.
    Not true, most of hate funerals for "any" person, we just don't hold funerals for officer at a higher standard than the rest of humanity.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

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    Does anyone have a link for the Mark Coates traffic stop? I have not been able to find one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Not true, most of hate funerals for "any" person, we just don't hold funerals for officer at a higher standard than the rest of humanity.
    I'll agree, except LOD funerals, which would be on par with other murders IMO.
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    Regular Member CenTex's Avatar
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    Article states: "The suspect was shot in the back while driving away and died on scene after crashing." (emphasis mine)

    This LEO made the decision to shoot back "after" the man started to drive away. The immediate threat was over. You have to admit, from what we can see from the video, the LEO was no longer in immediate danger, yet he kept firing until his pistol was empty during the time the man was obviously fleeing. Now, if the man in the vehicle had started backing up toward the LEO, then the LEO had every right to fire his weapon until the immediate threat ended.

    Before you argue the LEO had every right to fire his weapon at a "fleeing" suspect who had just fired a weapon at him . . . I agree. I am actually supporting the right of the LEO ending this man's life. It was the suspect's intention to kill this officer. Consequently, the suspect had just forfeited his right to life. The LEO was professional, calm, and polite to the suspect. He did nothing to elicit the reaction of the suspect.

    So, having said that, why cannot law-abiding citizens use the same discretion when they are attacked by someone intending to do them great, bodily harm or killing them? Why are law-abiding citizens charged with a felony when they commit a commensurate action toward their assailants?

    In conclusion, police officers should have no more right to protect themselves than ordinary law-abiding citizens should have in protecting themselves. LEOs should be limited by the same laws that limit us or we should have the same options that they have when protecting ourselves. This is my point and the end of my diatribe (criticism).
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    Quote Originally Posted by CenTex View Post
    Article states: "The suspect was shot in the back while driving away and died on scene after crashing." (emphasis mine)

    This LEO made the decision to shoot back "after" the man started to drive away. The immediate threat was over. You have to admit, from what we can see from the video, the LEO was no longer in immediate danger, yet he kept firing until his pistol was empty during the time the man was obviously fleeing. Now, if the man in the vehicle had started backing up toward the LEO, then the LEO had every right to fire his weapon until the immediate threat ended.

    Before you argue the LEO had every right to fire his weapon at a "fleeing" suspect who had just fired a weapon at him . . . I agree. I am actually supporting the right of the LEO ending this man's life. It was the suspect's intention to kill this officer. Consequently, the suspect had just forfeited his right to life. The LEO was professional, calm, and polite to the suspect. He did nothing to elicit the reaction of the suspect.

    So, having said that, why cannot law-abiding citizens use the same discretion when they are attacked by someone intending to do them great, bodily harm or killing them? Why are law-abiding citizens charged with a felony when they commit a commensurate action toward their assailants?

    In conclusion, police officers should have no more right to protect themselves than ordinary law-abiding citizens should have in protecting themselves. LEOs should be limited by the same laws that limit us or we should have the same options that they have when protecting ourselves. This is my point and the end of my diatribe (criticism).
    You know, I gotta agree. I have no problem with that POS being sent to the devil. There is no doubt that evil was inside of that SUV that night. The same should apply to me as a citizen. If some jackarse shoots at me or tries to rob me, steal from me I must have the right to end that threat at all times. I don't care if he is running out my front door and all I can see is his back.

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    You know, I gotta disagree.

    Laws vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction. You may feel that you have the "right" to shoot a fleeing felon, but nowhere does the law consider this a right. It would be a crime anywhere that the authority to do so has not been provided as a defense to a murder charge. In some jurisdictions, police may have been given the authority to use deadly force on a fleeing felon, but I know of no jurisdiction that specifically allows non-LEOs to do so.

    Disclaimer: I am not saying there isn't one. You'd just better be darn sure you are in one before shooting that guy running out the front door after a failed assault.

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    Not related to the actual incident, but I wonder if it would be legally "OK" to shoot & kill an intruder, if he was leaving.. while trying to do harm to you? IE: He's bolting for the front door, but also firing rounds in your direction?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirge View Post
    Not related to the actual incident, but I wonder if it would be legally "OK" to shoot & kill an intruder, if he was leaving.. while trying to do harm to you? IE: He's bolting for the front door, but also firing rounds in your direction?
    Not only would it be "OK," in almost every jurisdiction (except where running and hiding is required by law), it would be justifiable self-defense. Here in Alabama, if I reasonably believe that I am in grave danger, I can (and will) shoot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    Not only would it be "OK," in almost every jurisdiction (except where running and hiding is required by law), it would be justifiable self-defense. Here in Alabama, if I reasonably believe that I am in grave danger, I can (and will) shoot.
    Gotcha. I couldn't imagine that being illegal... but wanted a second opinion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirge View Post
    Gotcha. I couldn't imagine that being illegal... but wanted a second opinion.

    But let's not forget about the guy up in WA state (sorry cant find the link right now, it is in the WA forums somewhere) that noticed a house he owned and was remodeling was being broken into, he stayed the night to protect it, suspects entered heard "click" and started running. Home owner was blinded by head lights and fired instinctively, shot one of the perps in the back and ended up being tried for 2nd degree murder.

    Just adding this anecdote here to remind everyone that it is FEASIBLY possible for the ordinary "lowly" citizen to get charges filed against them for something that is ok for (most of them with less training in firearms and use of deadly force than joe blow firearms owner) LEO's to do....
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    Quote Originally Posted by devildoc5 View Post
    But let's not forget about the guy up in WA state (sorry cant find the link right now, it is in the WA forums somewhere) that noticed a house he owned and was remodeling was being broken into, he stayed the night to protect it, suspects entered heard "click" and started running. Home owner was blinded by head lights and fired instinctively, shot one of the perps in the back and ended up being tried for 2nd degree murder.

    Just adding this anecdote here to remind everyone that it is FEASIBLY possible for the ordinary "lowly" citizen to get charges filed against them for something that is ok for (most of them with less training in firearms and use of deadly force than joe blow firearms owner) LEO's to do....
    Wow, was he convicted?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirge View Post
    Wow, was he convicted?
    I lost track of what happened after the initial charges were filed but I will try and find a link and post it here if I can remember...

    Here is a link to the thread on the WA forum, I was mistaken btw, it was 1st degree murder...And it also appears that this was one of those "detached garage incidents"...

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ee-for-murder-!!
    Last edited by devildoc5; 02-14-2011 at 01:03 AM.
    "And shepherds we shall be, for Thee, my Lord, for Thee.
    Power hath descended forth from Thy hand, that our feet may swiftly carry out Thy command.
    So we shall flow a river forth to Thee and teeming with souls shall it ever be.
    E nomine Patri, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti."


    "If the rest of the world says: 'War,' I can only say: 'Very well. I do not want war, but no one, however peaceable, can live in peace if his neighbor intends to force a quarrel.'" - Adolf Hitler...

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    Quote Originally Posted by devildoc5 View Post
    I lost track of what happened after the initial charges were filed but I will try and find a link and post it here if I can remember...

    Here is a link to the thread on the WA forum, I was mistaken btw, it was 1st degree murder...And it also appears that this was one of those "detached garage incidents"...

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ee-for-murder-!!
    Excellent, thanks for sharing. Reading up on it now.

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