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Thread: State employee and carry

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    State employee and carry

    I work for the state under the transportation cabinent. The dept. of highways, and they will not allow us to carry guns while on shift, and district nine attorney john johnson even tried saying we couldnt keep a gun in our personal vehicle. At a meeting i tried bringing up krs 237 that states no employer can deny an employee from doing so, and they just shook me off. This coming from the same guy that said open carry was illegall and that if u have a gun in your vehicle it has to be unloaded and in the glove box and locked, or ud be arrested. Is it illegal for an attorney to give inaccurate legal advice in KY? and do you know if working for state govt. they can legally not let me carry? I figured that being I was employed with them they prolly could, but i heard a lawyer who works in frankforty say they couldnt and even heard a guy that works for a different dept. talking about carrying on a daily basis. any help??

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    I believe the law is very clear in that any employer may regulate carry while you are working for them. I believe it's equally clear that an employer may not regulate car carry. I'd be careful if I were you in dealing with this with your employer.

    I don't know if a lawyer knowing gives incorrect information is illegal, but I'm sure it's against the bar and they would at the very least receive a reprimand. Perhaps you should sit down one on one with him and calmly discuss this policy. I would also ask to see the policy in writing.

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    Regular Member neuroblades's Avatar
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    Langzaiguy is correct. Your employer can set rules against you carrying while "on the clock" but they CAN NOT dictate you having a sidearm in your personal vehicle! Additionally, IF you are driving your personal vehicle on the job, you can still have your sidearm in the vehicle and they can not dictate. IF you're driving a company vehicle, your employer CAN dictate against your carrying on the job.

    In reference to federal jobs, I'm not sure but I believe that that is a whloe other story.

    As for attorney's lying. Well, let's face it, they do it everyday, it's part of their job unless you are their client and then they're supposed to do their very best to serve you to the best of their ability.
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    I found this in krs 237.110. I recently applied for my cc license. What i have gathered is that they can prohibit me from carrying in the building but once im out, they cant limit my carrying in their vehicles.

    237.110 A private but not a PUBLIC employer may prohibit employees or other persons holding a concealed deadly weapons license from carrying concealed deadly weapons, or ammunition, or both in vehicles owned by the employer,

    If a public employer cant keep me from ccarrying in their vehicles, then they couldnt prevent me from open carrying could they???? I just dont see how they would allow cc but not oc, being as it is protected by constitution and cc isnt.

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    Regular Member neuroblades's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gutshot View Post
    No, if it was most of them would be in jail. If your attorney gives you bad advice and that advice damages you somehow, it could be malpractice and you could sue him. An attorney hired by someone else may tell you almost anything to get you to do what his client wants you to do. This guy is the attorney for the Transportation Cabinet. He will represent their interests and try to find a way to do what they want done by any means possible. He will not want to break the law and get this employer sued and get himself fired. He most likely doesn't know anything about the law on this subject and probably thinks you don't either. Your best bet is to hire a lawyer that knows the Ky. employment laws and Ky. gun laws. I doubt that one of those exists. Your next best bet is to educate yourself on the law and try to educate this guy. He won't like that. If you don't do as they say you'll very likely get fired, then you can sue and win (if you find a competent attorney), get your job back and a pile of money. By that time this lawyer and his bosses will be retired and collecting their state pensions and SS. When you finally win and somebody calls him up and tells him you won the lawsuit he'll say "no ****, imagine that". He knows all of this. Good luck.



    What do you think gives them the power to prevent carrying a firearm in the building?



    He probably blew you off because he never heard of KRS 237.110 and has no idea that this subject is covered by state statutes. Have you tried printing out KRS 237.110 (17) handing it to them and saying "read this, its the state law on this matter and says I can do this"?




    Once you get the CCDW there is nothing that says you have to conceal, you still have all the rights of a licensee.
    This is some very interesting info! i was aware of some of these but not all of this. What exactly would be the legal definition of a PRIVATE employer & a PUBLIC employer?

    I do know that unless the wording was changed in the Constitutional Carry bill that's pending, there are some legal teeth given to the part about employers, both profit or non-profit, preventing employees from carrying in their vehicles. It they do attempt to prevent carry and take actions against the carrier, there would be legal teeth to make the employer pay for it!
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    Regular Member neuroblades's Avatar
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    Just Wondering About This.

    Quote Originally Posted by gutshot View Post
    A public employer = government agency, funded with money received from taxpayers. A private employer=personal or corporate business, all personal or corporate money.
    OK, not to digress this but in theory though I have to inquire. I work for a store (Private employer) "they" have policy that no weapons are allowed while on the clock. I know from geenral knowledge that IF one of us are caught carrying (obviously concealed) that they would fire that employee but what I wonder is if there's actually KRS/KAR to back it up.

    I've never carried while "on the clock" but my employers do know that I carry while off the clock and nothings said, as it should be. I DO carry other things that would possibly allow for me to fight my way to my weapon IF need be though, these things do not classify as a weapon under their rules so they are not looked at in that fashion and my weapons are located very close by, just in case the situation arises.
    Got SIG? MOLON LABE

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    I intend on fighting this as far as possible if it takes that route. We have policy but I am a little rusty on it, I will have to REread it and get back to you. However I am certain that it would not be enforcable because it would interfere with 237.110. I have sent the attorney all of the important firearm laws, and all of the krs chapters and sub-chapters. However they have found out that I carry in my vehicle and I do not believe they are going to push that. When I do get my cc license I most certainly plan on carrying concealed while on the job. If they want to do something about it then I will file depr. of rights lawsuits and see what happens with it. I dont know where I got that they can keep me from carrying in the buildings, because doesnt KY allow cc in all buildings besides det. fac. and court of justice only courthouses., well and our state fairgrounds, which I happen to think is a joke btw., since oc is legal in all anyways.? I will get into the gap policies and get back to you. I most certainly will not allow them to denie myself the right of personal protection if the law allows me to do so while on the job for state govt.

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    Gutshot....

    here is what i have found on state employee policy. It is GAP-801.

    Carrying firearms or other weapons at any work site, including stateowned
    vehicles or buildings, unless expressly authorized by law.

    It used to not have the "unless expressly authorized by law" phrase. I have found the laws on state policy that trumps state law cannot be enforced, I have printed the updated GAP policy out, and I have copies of the laws that allow me to carry while at work concealed, and where law strictly says all employees in my cabinent can keep firearms in personal vehicles. I am going to bring it all to their attention tommorow just to see what they say. You could help me out though, do you know of anywhere that it states in law that state employees can openly carry? I find it odd that we are only allowed to conceal carry with a license when they cant even make laws governing open carry. any help???

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    yea, ill just cc and if they wanna say anything then i will bring up that the legislators gave me the right to cc at work with the state and take it from there.

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    absolutely, that will be something i keep to myself, if they was to find out by some freak accident, then I will see where it goes, hopefully they will never find out though. thanks for the wisdom.

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