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Not just LEOs, elected officials and instructors misinformed....... salesmen too!

KIX

KIX

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Man, I wonder how much this happens every day.

Guy, permitted for a long time, but is just now buying a gun. Looking at holstering options and says he knows that it can't show because he has a "concealed carry" permit.

Mentions that he's originally from a state that can open carry and he is clear that in CT, we can't.

Later, bumped into him and we started talking rifles, and the conversation quickly jumped into how to carry (holstering questions). And we had the discussion about what is legal and that I'd show him the statutes. He seemed genuinely interested and grateful.

But, makes me wonder...... just how many people sell dozens of firearms a day and misinform permit holders on a daily basis.

Jonathan
 
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Shawn Mitola

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yeah it happens to me all the time where I work. I talk to gun owners a lot and every time I mention OC they always tell me "that's Illegal" and I show them the info and eventually get them to understand that it isn't illegal. The biggest thing I have used has been my CT and FL permits where the FL one specifically states "Concealed" and my CT is of course just a Permit to carry.

There are a lot of people severely misinformed.
 
KIX

KIX

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When I was talking to this guy, I did something similar. He said he had a concealed carry permit. So, I told him to look at it.

Response: "hmmmm"

Those that like to have the "You're wrong, open carry is illegal in CT" mindset are fun. I usually tell them, I'll make them a deal. Fine cigar if I'm write, favorite liquor if you're right.

You should see how many say something like "I knew it was in there somewhere"....

I must have a couple of boxes of cigars by now......

Jonathan
 
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emsjeep

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It's because most gun shops have at least one former cop working at them and/or are frequented by cops who provide the wrong information authoritatively.

Gun shops are notoriously some of the worst places to get legal advice.
 
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KIX

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No doubt.

And, I make it clear that I'm not offering legal advice either. Two semesters of law don't make me a lawyer. What I do, is point them to the statutes and let them make up their own mind.

It also helps to point out prior cases here in the state and how they were handled as well.

Last thing I want is to look like I'm trying to offer advise or "school" someone. Not exactly the positive image we would want!

Jonathan
 
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Shawn Mitola

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Yeah I guess I just never understood the LEO view on this. as a LEO I would WANT to know who is carrying a firearm. When I do a traffic stop I want to KNOW if that person is armed or not. I would feel safer seeing it than if it was concealed.
 
MKEgal

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Shawn Mitola said:
As a LEO I would WANT to know who is carrying a firearm. When I do a traffic stop I want to KNOW if that person is armed or not. I would feel safer seeing it than if it was concealed.
Click to expand...

If you were a smart LEO, you'd assume everyone was armed until & unless you searched them.
And probably the only way you'll see a gun during a traffic stop is if you get them out of their car, or it's in a shoulder holster.

If you can see the gun, you're probably OK, since even the FBI says criminals don't open carry.
People who tell you they're carrying generally wouldn't be a problem.
People who tell you they're not carrying might really not be carrying, or might be intending to harm you. How do you tell which is which?
 
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emsjeep

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emsjeep said:
COMMENTS REMOVED BY ADMINISTRATOR: LEO Bashing
Click to expand...

Aww...did someone's feelings get hurt by the implication that a military ruling class exists in the United States? This is Law School 101 people, everyone knows the real motivations behind the actions even if we're not allowed to talk about it. Corruption is corruption even if I can't call it corruption.
 
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KIX

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I don't agree with the admin that that was LEO bashing.

It is indeed a fact herein CT that when you ask most LEO's, they still think open carry is illegal.

And it also a fact that many retired LEOs do work in our gun shops, so.......

Where's the bashing?

I'm just sayin'.

Jonathan
 
Fallschirjmäger

Fallschirjmäger

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MKEgal said:
If you were a smart LEO, you'd assume everyone was armed until & unless you searched them.
And probably the only way you'll see a gun during a traffic stop is if you get them out of their car, or it's in a shoulder holster.

If you can see the gun, you're probably OK, since even the FBI says criminals don't open carry.
People who tell you they're carrying generally wouldn't be a problem.
People who tell you they're not carrying might really not be carrying, or might be intending to harm you. How do you tell which is which?
Click to expand...

Well said. There is absolutely No Way that an officer could "know" who was carrying at any particular time. Therefore, an intelligent officer hopes for the best and plans for the worst.
 
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emsjeep

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KIX said:
I don't agree with the admin that that was LEO bashing.

It is indeed a fact herein CT that when you ask most LEO's, they still think open carry is illegal.

And it also a fact that many retired LEOs do work in our gun shops, so.......

Where's the bashing?

I'm just sayin'.

Jonathan
Click to expand...

I made some comment about entitlement, superiority and job security. I guess I see how it could be characterized as overly harsh, but that doesn't mean it isn't true. I've seen enough of it to know...hell, just flip through a few of the more active state forums here and you have all the evidence you need...
 
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Tazman2

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Newington, Connecticut, USA
KIX said:
When I was talking to this guy, I did something similar. He said he had a concealed carry permit. So, I told him to look at it.

Response: "hmmmm"

Those that like to have the "You're wrong, open carry is illegal in CT" mindset are fun. I usually tell them, I'll make them a deal. Fine cigar if I'm write, favorite liquor if you're right.

You should see how many say something like "I knew it was in there somewhere"....

I must have a couple of boxes of cigars by now......

Jonathan
Click to expand...

I've bet a older guy who's had his permit for a very long time $100 on the table at that moment cash not even a check if he can provide me with written proof that its illegal as he was CONVINCED that its in the booklet from the DPS. Next time I saw him he changed it to "yeah well you'd get arrested for it!" and even agreed with the BOP as a valid arrest for OC! Ugh I hate stupid people!
 
Rich B

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Tazman2 said:
I've bet a older guy who's had his permit for a very long time $100 on the table at that moment cash not even a check if he can provide me with written proof that its illegal as he was CONVINCED that its in the booklet from the DPS. Next time I saw him he changed it to "yeah well you'd get arrested for it!" and even agreed with the BOP as a valid arrest for OC! Ugh I hate stupid people!
Click to expand...

It is a lot easier to win the debate when you are OCing already right in front of them.
 
KIX

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Rich B said:
It is a lot easier to win the debate when you are OCing already right in front of them.
Click to expand...

Not really, because as the post above ya states, the usual response would be "well, you just haven't gotten caught yet".

Even if I show them what you went through, same deal. People just don't want to be open to changing their mythconceptions.

Jonathan
 
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Shawn Mitola

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KIX said:
Not really, because as the post above ya states, the usual response would be "well, you just haven't gotten caught yet".

Even if I show them what you went through, same deal. People just don't want to be open to changing their mythconceptions.

Jonathan
Click to expand...

People are just stubborn and refuse to admit that they are wrong. and will look for any reason to justify their point of view.
 
KIX

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I'm going through that with a good friend now.

He said a friend is fighting a huge case, just for his gun printing or showing on his waist - criminal case.

He says I'm wrong. OK, I can deal with him being wrong. However, he will provide NO information on his friend and the case pending. The few people that know a little bit of what the issues we are fighting with seem to always go "but what happened to that Goldberg fella?".

Jonathan
 
Rich B

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KIX said:
I'm going through that with a good friend now.

He said a friend is fighting a huge case, just for his gun printing or showing on his waist - criminal case.

He says I'm wrong. OK, I can deal with him being wrong. However, he will provide NO information on his friend and the case pending. The few people that know a little bit of what the issues we are fighting with seem to always go "but what happened to that Goldberg fella?".
Click to expand...

I have had a lot of people misinterpret Goldberg's case and sometimes insist that there is another one like it that hasn't been settled, etc.

Heck, I even had Old Saybrook PD call me to tell me that the most recent Goldberg ruling somehow gives them the authority to stop and detain anyone who is open carrying, despite the fact that Goldberg was not open carrying, and the Glastonbury PD (just like the OSPD) didn't even have the laws straight on why they stopped him in the first place.

I love ignorance, especially when it is mixed with a healthy dose of arrogance.
 
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emsjeep

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Rich B said:
I have had a lot of people misinterpret Goldberg's case and sometimes insist that there is another one like it that hasn't been settled, etc.

Heck, I even had Old Saybrook PD call me to tell me that the most recent Goldberg ruling somehow gives them the authority to stop and detain anyone who is open carrying, despite the fact that Goldberg was not open carrying, and the Glastonbury PD (just like the OSPD) didn't even have the laws straight on why they stopped him in the first place.

I love ignorance, especially when it is mixed with a healthy dose of arrogance.
Click to expand...

Your best defense to that would be to simply ask them to pull out the law reporter that contains the Goldberg decision (there isn't one) and ask them to point to the text that affirmatively and unquestionably gives them that right....
 
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Shawn Mitola

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Rich B said:
I have had a lot of people misinterpret Goldberg's case and sometimes insist that there is another one like it that hasn't been settled, etc.

Heck, I even had Old Saybrook PD call me to tell me that the most recent Goldberg ruling somehow gives them the authority to stop and detain anyone who is open carrying, despite the fact that Goldberg was not open carrying, and the Glastonbury PD (just like the OSPD) didn't even have the laws straight on why they stopped him in the first place.

I love ignorance, especially when it is mixed with a healthy dose of arrogance.
Click to expand...

Did I miss something in the Goldberg case Rich? he was let go wasn't he? I was under the impression that the charges against him were dropped. Or are we talking about the suit he brought against the town? I read that transcript and it doesn't sound to me like the judge said anything about LEO's being able to do that.
 
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