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Thread: Visiting Tucson This Weekend...

  1. #1
    Regular Member demnogis's Avatar
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    Visiting Tucson This Weekend...

    Figured I'd OC since you 'Zonies got constitutional carry and all...

    Any places I can't go while OC/CC ? And it is loaded... one not in the pipe?
    Gun control isn't about guns -- it is about control.

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    Regular Member acmariner99's Avatar
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    You are in a free state. The only caveat here is for places that serve alcohol for on premises consumption. In that respect you have to: 1) Have a CWP, 2) Carry concealed, 3) Not consume alcohol, 4) The establishment must have no signs prohibiting carry. There are the usual off limits places like federal buildings and such, but the 1000 ft school zone is not enforced here and you don't have to worry about any e-check nonsense here. Carry loaded, with one in the pipe if you want. Don't lie to LEO's if they ask if you are carrying, but that is just common sense. Did I miss anything?

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    Regular Member AZkopper's Avatar
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    Welcome!!

    1st--Carry anyway you chose (open carry in a holster; holstered discretely under a shirt or jacket; etc). Unless you are 18-20 years old, then you MUST carry openly.
    2nd--carry loaded, with 'one in the pipe'.
    3rd--Firearms are not permitted in federal buildings (like everywhere else), polling places, hydroelectric plants, and nuke plants.
    4th--Firearms are not allowed on K-12 grounds (unloaded and out of sight in vehicle, in school parking lots are OK).
    5th--General retail type stores that post 'no firearms' or 'no weapons' signs have no weight of law in and of themselves. They are like 'no shoes = no service' signs, or 'no dogs' signs. Carry discretely, and no one cares. Carry openly, and if they ask you to leave, you must.
    6th--As stated in the previous post, state law says that carry in places that serve alcohol for on-premise drinking (restaurants and bars), allow CONCEALED carry, if you have a CWP (Concealed Weapon Permit), and if you do not drink, and if the establishment does not post the state official "NO FIREARMS" sign at the liquor license (and usually near the door as well).

    Carrying guns is overwhelmingly accepted in AZ, generally speaking. No one cares. Cops know the laws.

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    Regular Member mFonz77's Avatar
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    U of A is posted, in case you miss the hideous signs.
    My location says I am from Sierra Vista, AZ which is where I live now but I actually lived in MO for 26 years! So please stop telling me I don't know what I'm talking about when I post in the Missouri forum!

  5. #5
    Regular Member demnogis's Avatar
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    Thanks everyone! Last year I rode out to Tucson and didn't carry (forgot my range bag & firearms). But a lot has happened in a year... I hear [gang related] crime is up and up. Not looking to vacation as a victim.
    Gun control isn't about guns -- it is about control.

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    Regular Member azcdlfred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by demnogis View Post
    Thanks everyone! Last year I rode out to Tucson and didn't carry (forgot my range bag & firearms). But a lot has happened in a year... I hear [gang related] crime is up and up. Not looking to vacation as a victim.
    As an FYI, Tucson has two County run shooting ranges (you have those in California, right?).

    Fred

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    Quote Originally Posted by azcdlfred View Post
    As an FYI, Tucson has two County run shooting ranges (you have those in California, right?).

    Fred
    ROFL!! You crack me up Fred!

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    Quote Originally Posted by AZkopper View Post
    Welcome!!

    1st--Carry anyway you chose (open carry in a holster; holstered discretely under a shirt or jacket; etc). Unless you are 18-20 years old, then you MUST carry openly.
    2nd--carry loaded, with 'one in the pipe'.
    3rd--Firearms are not permitted in federal buildings (like everywhere else), polling places, hydroelectric plants, and nuke plants.
    4th--Firearms are not allowed on K-12 grounds (unloaded and out of sight in vehicle, in school parking lots are OK).
    5th--General retail type stores that post 'no firearms' or 'no weapons' signs have no weight of law in and of themselves. They are like 'no shoes = no service' signs, or 'no dogs' signs. Carry discretely, and no one cares. Carry openly, and if they ask you to leave, you must.
    6th--As stated in the previous post, state law says that carry in places that serve alcohol for on-premise drinking (restaurants and bars), allow CONCEALED carry, if you have a CWP (Concealed Weapon Permit), and if you do not drink, and if the establishment does not post the state official "NO FIREARMS" sign at the liquor license (and usually near the door as well).

    Carrying guns is overwhelmingly accepted in AZ, generally speaking. No one cares. Cops know the laws.
    how about a out of state ccw? I have reciprocity with AZ is it still cool for me to enter a bar as long as I conceal/don't drink?

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    Regular Member AZkopper's Avatar
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    ARS 4-229 says that the permit must comply with ARS 13-3112 (our concealed weapons permit section).

    ARS 13-3112, paragraph T, says that any out of state concealed weapon permit is a valid permit in AZ if the issued possessor is legal to own a gun in AZ (ie: not a prohibited possessor under AZ law).

    So, yes, with a valid out of state permit, you can carry in a bar as long as you follow the above specified requirements.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AZkopper View Post
    ARS 4-229 says that the permit must comply with ARS 13-3112 (our concealed weapons permit section).

    ARS 13-3112, paragraph T, says that any out of state concealed weapon permit is a valid permit in AZ if the issued possessor is legal to own a gun in AZ (ie: not a prohibited possessor under AZ law).

    So, yes, with a valid out of state permit, you can carry in a bar as long as you follow the above specified requirements.
    thanks!!

  11. #11
    Regular Member mspgunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mFonz77 View Post
    U of A is posted, in case you miss the hideous signs.
    OK mFonz, AZ is looking really good for our vacation, thanks for the input. Tombstone, not too far from you is one place I'd like to see, especially with OC being legal in AZ. Missouri really gives me a pain some times. Going to an OC get together tomorrow. We have lunch then a photo op in front of a City Hall. May not be a big thing in AZ but an exciting trip out of doors with OC here. We're doing a City hall a week. There is a very nice fella who gets us together. he is sohighlyinlikely to be that sort of guy.... Get my drift?
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!
    I worked 24/7 for 2A OC rights! Don't like what I did? Try it yourself, it was my full time job!
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    Regular Member azcdlfred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mspgunner View Post
    Tombstone, not too far from you is one place I'd like to see, especially with OC being legal in AZ.
    I wouldn't call Tombstone "gun friendly.' Remember, the Earps declared Tombstone a "no gun" town back way back when. I'm not sure they changed much since then. Other forum members will correct me on this.

    I've never OC'd in Tombstone but I've seen lots of "no firearms" signs, including where they re-enact the OK Corral shoot-out. I'm pretty sure all the places that serve booze ban guns.

    Fred

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    Regular Member mspgunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by azcdlfred View Post
    I wouldn't call Tombstone "gun friendly.' Remember, the Earps declared Tombstone a "no gun" town back way back when. I'm not sure they changed much since then. Other forum members will correct me on this.

    I've never OC'd in Tombstone but I've seen lots of "no firearms" signs, including where they re-enact the OK Corral shoot-out. I'm pretty sure all the places that serve booze ban guns.

    Fred
    I don't drink, no problem there. Ouch, I hate to see it so un-gun friendly. Can always CCW where necessary, I live in Missouri so CCW for a day is no big shake.
    Thanks
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!
    I worked 24/7 for 2A OC rights! Don't like what I did? Try it yourself, it was my full time job!
    Certified NRA Range Safety Officer - RSO

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    Quote Originally Posted by azcdlfred View Post
    As an FYI, Tucson has two County run shooting ranges (you have those in California, right?).

    Fred
    My understanding is that the Shooting ranges in California are all run by/controlled by the California State Legislature. The have MANY MANY Victim disarmament zones where criminals are able and do shoot toward/at targets/victims regularly. Many jurisdictions within the state us 12031(e) to regularly harass and ensure that potential targets/victims are in fact UNLOADED even though they may in small enclaves openly carry a holstered UNLOADED handgun. The ranges are easily located as any where South of Oregon, North of Mexico, West of Nevada and Arizona, and East of the Pacific Ocean!

    Please read the above with extreme bitterness and sarcasm!
    Last edited by JoeSparky; 02-26-2011 at 08:46 PM.

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    Now, if you folks in AZ could get OC/CC carry into a bar without a permit, along with the right to drink in the bar like we do here in Nevada, THEN you would have true constitutional carry! I'm glad for the Az forum as I visit AZ from time to time, especially the Yuma area. The Az laws make my head hurt with the 'permit vs. no permit, vs OC and CC distinctions'. It's a bit surreal to go to a 'gun-friendly' state and see so many 'No Firearms' signs around. Here in Nevada where I live I know of only one business in my town with a 'No Firearms' sign.

  16. #16
    Regular Member azcdlfred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loneviking View Post
    Now, if you folks in AZ could get OC/CC carry into a bar without a permit, along with the right to drink in the bar like we do here in Nevada
    Which do you think will happen first? Arizona improving our Restaurant Carry laws, or Nevada getting Constitutional Carry?

    Just wondering

    Fred

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    Quote Originally Posted by azcdlfred View Post
    Which do you think will happen first? Arizona improving our Restaurant Carry laws, or Nevada getting Constitutional Carry?

    Just wondering

    Fred
    Dunno. We do have Constitutional Carry introduced into this sessions legislation but I'd bet that we'll have to rework the permit process this time and then in two years go for the Constitutional Carry.

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    Hey, NM also has constitutional carry.

    Our constitution doesn't protect concealed carry, and we have open carry.

    :P

  19. #19
    Regular Member azcdlfred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PracticalTactical View Post
    Hey, NM also has constitutional carry. Our constitution doesn't protect concealed carry, and we have open carry. :P
    Constitutional Carry means you can carry openly or discreetly ("concealed" implies the criminal act of hiding something) without needing to ask permission from the government via a "permit."

    Arizona's constitution orginially protected all forms of carry. In 1990 a state appeals court ruled that discreet carry wasn't protected. The state supreme court upheld the decision by refusing to review it. In 1994 Arizona's onerous CCW law was created.

    Fast forward to 2010 and we (AzCDL) succeeded in removing the requirement, in statute, to have a permit to carry discreetly.

    Even though discreet carry is not protected in the New Mexico constitution, there is no reason why the legislature can't pass a law saying a permit is not required to carry discreetly.

    Fred

  20. #20
    Regular Member Gunslinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by demnogis View Post
    Figured I'd OC since you 'Zonies got constitutional carry and all...

    Any places I can't go while OC/CC ? And it is loaded... one not in the pipe?
    Should be nice to get out of the PDR concentration camps and visit a free state.

  21. #21
    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by azcdlfred View Post
    Constitutional Carry means you can carry openly or discreetly ("concealed" implies the criminal act of hiding something) without needing to ask permission from the government via a "permit."

    Arizona's constitution orginially protected all forms of carry. In 1990 a state appeals court ruled that discreet carry wasn't protected. The state supreme court upheld the decision by refusing to review it. In 1994 Arizona's onerous CCW law was created.

    Fast forward to 2010 and we (AzCDL) succeeded in removing the requirement, in statute, to have a permit to carry discreetly.

    Even though discreet carry is not protected in the New Mexico constitution, there is no reason why the legislature can't pass a law saying a permit is not required to carry discreetly.
    Fred
    When I first came to Arizona (1966) you were either heeled or not and there was no discussion or question as to how. It wasn't an issue for consideration or conversation. It was just a 'given' that people carried guns. How they did it... or if they did it, or with what was never an issue. Then came the GCA of 1968 on the heels of the MLK riots and media hype. The media spread this idea that ya had to have a permit to carry a gun. The media also spread the mis/disinformation that guns had to be registered as well. We still hear/read this crap from so-called journalists. Where'd this come from? Consider the MSM is based to a large degree in NYC and DC. The 'Sullivan Act' has been imposed upon NYC since 1911. (An onerous unconstitutional law enacted for and by the benefit of onerous politicians.) This is the culture these media types live and work in. We just witnessed an example of this when the guy carried an AR-15 at a Tea Party event in PHX last year or so... 'n the MSM TV weenies went nuts in Chicago... MSNBC or somethin'... They couldn't believe it!

    I remember the 'permit' thing in '90... and the arguments of unconstitutionality (State Constitution). I take a bit of issue with Fred's stance that a 'law' "saying a permit is not required to carry discreetly." Laws don't tell ya what you 'can ' do. Laws tell ya what you can't. They don't need to pass a law... they need to omit/nullify the damn thing 'n make it an option for reciprocity carry or whatever... such as 'Campus/Restaurant Carry' if that's what it takes to satisfy the bed-wetters. I have an Az CWP... to cover all the 'gray' areas that might prove a problem. My primary concern was transiting or riding/hiking the national parks... 'til that stuff went by the boards not long ago. Hell yes I carried a gun in the parks. There's nothin' out there... and cell phone usage is spotty. Not that a cell phone is gonna do you much good anyway. I don't own a GPS unit to give coordinates in the event somethin' went down. 2-3 miles (much less more) off road 'n you may as well be on another planet. You're on your own.

  22. #22
    Regular Member azcdlfred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonora Rebel View Post
    I take a bit of issue with Fred's stance that a 'law' "saying a permit is not required to carry discreetly." Laws don't tell ya what you 'can ' do. Laws tell ya what you can't. They don't need to pass a law... they need to omit/nullify the damn thing 'n make it an option for reciprocity carry or whatever
    You are correct. To get to Constitutional Carry, we didn't add a law saying you could carry discreetly, we eliminated the law that said you had to have a permit. We're working on the rest of the stuff that requires a permit or prevents carrying. It's a long battle and it is a lot more Sun Szu and Saul Alinksy than it is "Mr. Smith Goes to Washingon."

    Fred

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