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Thread: Citizen Criminal Complaint Procedure

  1. #1
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    Citizen Criminal Complaint Procedure

    Here is a link to a petition for a citizen criminal complaint against police officers in Washington. I present it for it's instructional value, not for any comments about the merits of the case outlined in the complaint. The case is not OC related.

    Link to complaint.
    Last edited by deanf; 02-15-2011 at 01:15 AM.

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    Regular Member FMCDH's Avatar
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    Interesting read.

    Thx.

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    _Comments Removed at the request of OP _
    They were off topic and distracted from the intended focus of the thread.
    Last edited by END_THE_FED; 02-16-2011 at 12:49 AM.
    A wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.- Thomas Jefferson March 4 1801

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    I was truly afraid the other day, a car with lights on top of it was outside my house and there was an LEO in it? Who do I call? And yes I am serious.

    Private prosecution needs a comeback, and here is a perfect example why. The prosecutor (not surprisingly) fails in his duty, they don't bring charges against officers. This link is a recent case where a private prosecution made it to SCOTUS and the private person won!!!!!

    http://www.scotuswiki.com/index.php?...Ex_Rel._Watson

    http://scholar.google.com/scholar_ca...=2,48&as_vis=1

    This story did make me sick though and does show the mentality and actions of many in our LEO that people try so hard to say doesn't exist. I feel the dog as property is worth more than $750 dollars, the reckless endangerment they engaged in, the waste of tax payers money, they need to be charged with felonies.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  5. #5
    Regular Member skiingislife725's Avatar
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    Man reading that makes my blood boil. Nobody that sick needs to be out in public, let alone working as a police officer.

  6. #6
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    I see the complaint but not the procedure? I think the procedure is just having enough money to be able to hire a private lawyer to file the complaints.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    The court rules on citizen criminal complaints are referenced in at least two places in the petition. It's a long petition. If it's something you care about, you'll have to put in the effort.

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    Regular Member HK_dave's Avatar
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    bunch of ********...
    US Constitution - void where prohibited by law.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deanf View Post
    The court rules on citizen criminal complaints are referenced in at least two places in the petition. It's a long petition. If it's something you care about, you'll have to put in the effort.
    Well I have to read through the whole document about a horrible incident you don't want us talking about to get your points? Why can't you just copy the section applicable or page it's on?
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member skiingislife725's Avatar
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    Dean, as you said in your PM, I was not actually commenting on the topic you wanted to focus on. Was just too steamed about a bunch of civil servants high-fiving and exclaiming on audio tape, "Nice!" after their buddy practices with his cool AR on a non-aggressive dog 20 yards away cowered in some blackberry bushes.

    That said, as far as the procedures are concerned, are you referring to pages 3 & 4 of the document? I read just about the entire thing (and the word of the day for me is: scalping) and I don't recall much of anything that went into any detail on the citizen criminal complaint procedures.
    Last edited by skiingislife725; 02-15-2011 at 10:45 PM.

  11. #11
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Since the original link is just the complaint not showing you how to complain here is a link to rules for it.

    http://www.courts.wa.gov/search/inde...h.start_search

    You can attempt this on your own. But this story the victims have a private attorney doing it. I am guessing they are doing it on contingency or by donation, from the name of the firm.

    I am searching to see if there is a downloadable complaint form, but it looks like your first step is a letter written to a judge.

    From number 4. on the courts site.

    SCLCrRLJ 2.1(c)
    CITIZEN COMPLAINTS


    Any person filing a criminal citizen complaint pursuant to CrRLJ 2.1(c)
    must provide a sworn written statement of the probable cause supporting the
    crimes alleged. The judge will review the alleged crimes and the probable
    cause statement to determine whether the request should be granted or denied.
    At the discretion of the judge, a hearing may be set to hear additional
    evidence or to allow the named defendant or the prosecuting attorney an
    opportunity to present evidence in opposition to the filing of the complaint.
    If the judge grants or denies the filing of the complaint on the basis of the
    sworn affidavit without hearing, the judge shall state in writing the reasons
    for granting or denying the filing of the complaint.
    Last edited by sudden valley gunner; 02-15-2011 at 10:51 PM.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  12. #12
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiingislife725 View Post
    Dean, as you said in your PM, I was not actually commenting on the topic you wanted to focus on. Was just too steamed about a bunch of civil servants high-fiving and exclaiming on audio tape, "Nice!" after their buddy practices with his cool AR on a non-aggressive dog 20 yards away cowered in some blackberry bushes.

    That said, as far as the procedures are concerned, are you referring to pages 3 & 4 of the document? I read just about the entire thing (and the word of the day for me is: scalping) and I don't recall much of anything that went into any detail on the citizen criminal complaint procedures.
    I think this is what he is referring to...I did a quick search on it, his link doesn't educate you on how to do it, it just shows that it can be done. The link I found for our state courts tells you the rules on it, I have only perused it quickly though, book marked it for a later read.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member skiingislife725's Avatar
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    Good find SVG. I like to have these sorts of things and be prepared ahead of time...even if I never need it (crossing my fingers).

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    Regular Member Whitney's Avatar
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    Wow.........!!

    Quote Originally Posted by deanf View Post
    Here is a link to a petition for a citizen criminal complaint against police officers in Washington. I present it for it's instructional value, not for any comments about the merits of the case outlined in the complaint. The case is not OC related.

    Link to complaint.
    Thank You, this was very informative and educational. I will put this one to the memory banks. Is there a method by which we can follow the progress of this complaint or do we have to wait for it to be adjudicated?

    ~Whitney
    The problem with America is stupidity.
    I'm not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?

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    Thanks for posting Dean,


    I found the link to be very informative.
    True it doesn't tell you exactly how to do it, but it does tell you where to start, you just have to read carefully, it looks like SVG is on the right track.
    I am not sure if you would need a private attorney, I would think you could do it yourself.
    However a wise man once told me, "He who represents himself has a fool for a client".
    A wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.- Thomas Jefferson March 4 1801

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Yea Dean thanks for the thread, this has lead to some great research yesterday and a lot to think about.

    You could do this yourself, but man what a hassle, I know personally I would probably F it all up on some stupid technicality that unseasoned newbie attorney hired by whoever would be able to dismiss the whole claim. I'll just stick to carpentry.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Perhaps we need to forward a copy of this to the Family of John T. Williams and their attorney.
    A wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.- Thomas Jefferson March 4 1801

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    Regular Member Aryk45XD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by END_THE_FED View Post
    Perhaps we need to forward a copy of this to the Family of John T. Williams and their attorney.
    +1 before anything gets outta hand. The powers that be are stong, but the Native's are restless. This is great information. Thanks for the post and long read.

  19. #19
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    The more I look into this the not so hard it seems to do.

    The first hurdle is getting a judge to go along with it.

    I also don't think someone like myself would be good at a jury selection process, that is definitely something for a professional in my opinion.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  20. #20
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Posted late

    Judge has decided to hear the citizen complaint.

    http://www.waterlandblog.com/2011/02...ting-of-rosie/
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  21. #21
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Saw this is a local Attorney for me so I called to see what the update is. He said they granted his hearing but he hasn't gotten it yet and they are bouncing him around to different courts. King, then Peirce now back to King.

    I told him about this site and why I am interested, he had no Idea that attorney's for John T. Williams seeking private prosecution and I was able to give him that firm and attorneys name, he said that should help him in his case. He also agreed that Whatcom County courthouse isn't following state law (for 4th amendment reasons) and pointed me in a direction I didn't think about too.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Quote Originally Posted by deanf View Post
    Here is a link to a petition for a citizen criminal complaint against police officers in Washington. I present it for it's instructional value, not for any comments about the merits of the case outlined in the complaint. The case is not OC related.

    Link to complaint.
    except the link you provided shows the CITY OF DES MOINES listed as the complainant

    iow, not a true private prosecution

    a private prosecution is where the PRIVATE PERSON , NOT A GOVERNMENTAL etc. body is listed as the sole complainant

    i stand by my point

    find me one case in WA where there was a true private prosecution

    i'll stand by

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    Regular Member GuidoZ's Avatar
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    And since this thread is being revived, any update on it you're aware of SVG? Sorry I'm going to miss the party again this Sun morn. Another birthday party to go to. (I'm starting to think my newly 6yr has too many friends...)

    --
    Peace. ~G
    Last edited by GuidoZ; 03-17-2012 at 01:09 AM. Reason: Very small typo
    Carry weapon: SA XDm .40 SC + 11rd Ranger SXT 180gr

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    [COLOR=#333333]And since this thread is being revived, any update on it you're aware of SVG?
    The case against the officers was dismissed in Snohomish County on March 9th. I don't know if that's the end of it.

    Read this.
    Last edited by deanf; 03-17-2012 at 01:17 AM.

  25. #25
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PALO View Post
    except the link you provided shows the CITY OF DES MOINES listed as the complainant

    iow, not a true private prosecution

    a private prosecution is where the PRIVATE PERSON , NOT A GOVERNMENTAL etc. body is listed as the sole complainant

    i stand by my point

    find me one case in WA where there was a true private prosecution

    i'll stand by
    I talked to the lawyer who filed this complaint, he is in Bellingham.

    Whether you like it or not private prosecution is legal I provided the info for you in the other thread.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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