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Thread: Is carrying a compensated gun a bad idea?

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    Is carrying a compensated gun a bad idea?

    i just got me a compensated gun the other day i wanna carry it because its really accurate not much recoil what you think?

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    Some will say no, some will say whatever, some will say bad idea.

    Gases and flashes coming out the top of the gun is a hindrance/negative. I guess it's louder too.

    Carry what you are confident and can shoot with, but understand its drawbacks and make sure you are comfortable with them too.

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    Activist Member Wolf_shadow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curtis View Post
    Some will say no, some will say whatever, some will say bad idea.

    Gases and flashes coming out the top of the gun is a hindrance/negative. I guess it's louder too.

    Carry what you are confident and can shoot with, but understand its drawbacks and make sure you are comfortable with them too.
    +1

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    Regular Member 230therapy's Avatar
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    Yes, it's a bad idea. The reason is that firing from retention will result in hot gas and particles shooting up toward your eyes. Shooting from retention is an essential self-defense skill.
    Last edited by 230therapy; 02-23-2011 at 10:02 PM.
    Does anyone here actually believe that the Founders were sitting around in John Adams' tavern UNARMED because they believed a bar should be a gun free zone?

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Curtis has a remarkably good grasp on reality Terrance.

    Carry what you want but carry it for the right reasons. Don't try to plow a field with an ATV. Get a tractor.

    I don't care for Auto's particularly and I don't care for compensated auto's.

    They look cool though. Cool will get you killed.

    Compensators on handguns were developed for gun games where seconds count but the target doesn't shoot back. Since the likelyhood of needing to shoot at night is pretty good, take it to the range one night and set up two targets. Shoot a mag at the first target then without stopping, finish up on the second with a fresh magazine. Then decide for yourself.

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    Compensated Handguns

    as an every day carry are a bad idea. as previously stated when shooting from retention (gun held close to the body so it cannot be gripped and taken from you easily) the hot gasses will (note that I did not say might) get into your eyes and could set your clothing alight. Additionally if you must fire at night, after the first shot you may find yourself night blind until your pupils relax.

    Just some thoughts.

    Robert

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by p.publius View Post
    as an every day carry are a bad idea. as previously stated when shooting from retention (gun held close to the body so it cannot be gripped and taken from you easily) the hot gasses will (note that I did not say might) get into your eyes and could set your clothing alight. Additionally if you must fire at night, after the first shot you may find yourself night blind until your pupils relax.

    Just some thoughts.

    Robert
    Compensated guns should IMO be reserved for the range, competition where rules allow, certain hunting situations and always with hearing protection.

    For a carry gun, compensation for me is a Commander size 1911 vs full size.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    First, let me welcome you to OCDO and the Virginia section. The water may be rough but all the folks in the pool are trying to play nice with each other.

    I'm curious why you got a compensated gun as your first gun? Who/what sold you on a compensator as the way to control recoil? And just how much less recoil are we talking about?

    Any gun you buy ought to be really accurate - as in the operator needs to work to meet or improve over what the gun can give from a Ransom Rest. The truth is even my crappy guns can shoot better than me.

    stay safe.

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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    I had a G22c (which I traded in for a G29) and two things I was warned about never happened.

    1. My night vision was not affected by having a compensated barrel. Most modern SD ammo uses low flash powder. I see more flash from a 357 magnum.

    2. Gas and debris coming out the top ports were never an issue. But having said that I only fired arm fully extended, so it's limited to that.

    This is only my experience. YMMV

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swinokur View Post
    I had a G22c (which I traded in for a G29) and two things I was warned about never happened.

    1. My night vision was not affected by having a compensated barrel. Most modern SD ammo uses low flash powder. I see more flash from a 357 magnum.

    2. Gas and debris coming out the top ports were never an issue. But having said that I only fired arm fully extended, so it's limited to that.

    This is only my experience. YMMV
    Night vision takes approximately 2 sec. to lose and about 45 min. to reacquire. Even shooting a non-compensated gum will effect it - a compensated gun will have a more pronounced effect in a comparison of the same style gun and same ammo.
    http://www.scribd.com/doc/31401004/H...ght-Operations
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Campaign Veteran roscoe13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Night vision takes approximately 2 sec. to lose and about 45 min. to reacquire. Even shooting a non-compensated gum will effect it - a compensated gun will have a more pronounced effect in a comparison of the same style gun and same ammo.
    http://www.scribd.com/doc/31401004/H...ght-Operations
    Which makes arguments about compensated guns being a bad idea because they're more likely to disrupt your night vision generally moot. How often are you going to be in near complete darkness for 45 minutes before you need to use your handgun in self defense?

    Roscoe, who's only compensated gun is a .450 Marlin...
    Last edited by roscoe13; 02-24-2011 at 01:56 PM.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Night vision takes approximately 2 sec. to lose and about 45 min. to reacquire. Even shooting a non-compensated gum will effect it - a compensated gun will have a more pronounced effect in a comparison of the same style gun and same ammo.
    http://www.scribd.com/doc/31401004/H...ght-Operations
    Quote Originally Posted by roscoe13 View Post
    Which makes arguments about compensated guns being a bad idea because they're more likely to disrupt your night vision generally moot. How often are you going to be in near complete darkness for 45 minutes before you need to use your handgun in self defense?

    Roscoe, who's only compensated gun is a .450 Marlin...
    You misapplied the information.

    Before is not the problem -immediately after is. Yes the rods and cones (receptors) are slow to acclimate, but a bright light will quickly effect your night vision and it does NOT have to be in "near complete darkness" to have a profound effect.

    A good old fashion .357 mag Silver Tip will do it quite well - think flame thrower.

    If the question is moot, it is because the OP only has one gun and one is better than none.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by roscoe13 View Post
    Which makes arguments about compensated guns being a bad idea because they're more likely to disrupt your night vision generally moot. How often are you going to be in near complete darkness for 45 minutes before you need to use your handgun in self defense?
    Yeah, I mean, I never go anywhere where its dark. And if I do, I run scared indoors within a minute.

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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    In addition to flash, I would rather not give a bad guy the postmortem satisfaction of knowing at least he damaged my hearing forever.

    I'll take an uncompensated .45 for self-defense, thankyouverymuch.

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    Regular Member Gunslinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Compensated guns should IMO be reserved for the range, competition where rules allow, certain hunting situations and always with hearing protection.

    For a carry gun, compensation for me is a Commander size 1911 vs full size.
    Agree 100%. I 'compensate' when carrying my 1911s vice Hi-Power by carrying an extra mag.

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    Regular Member MSC 45ACP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Compensated guns should IMO be reserved for the range, competition where rules allow, certain hunting situations and always with hearing protection.

    For a carry gun, compensation for me is a Commander size 1911 vs full size.
    Grape is a very wise and experienced fellow. I happen to share his opinion most of the time.

    I am profoundly sorry someone sold you a compensated pistol as a carry gun, for all the reasons already listed above. You should NEVER COMPENSATE for poor marksmanship ability. Learn how to shoot better. Your money would be wisely invested in proper marksmanship instruction and a lot of practice ammo and time well-spent at the range. Simply sending rounds downrange without being able to analyze what you're doing wrong is a big waste of ammo and time.

    For example, if you find that you are consistently hitting "low", a neophyte will assume his pistol sights are wrong rather than having a very consistent (but still incorrect) wrong trigger squeeze. If you learned how to shoot from Uncle Billy-Joe-Jim-Bob (who meant well but never really learned proper marksmanship without something to rest his worn-out rifle upon when shooting), you may assume "the barrel is shot out" rather than learn that you're not focusing on your front sight when you squeeze the trigger. You also wouldn't know when the sights are truly "off" when you have an improper grip or trigger squeeze or if the rear sight is actually off to one side from years of being in a left-side holster and the seat-belt assembly of your car has actually 'pushed' the rear sight sideways.

    My advice may be expensive, but well-worth it: Get rid of the compensated pistol (unless you're getting into ISPC shooting) and get some advice about a 'carry gun" and get some PROPER range instruction. Feel free to PM me if you want to discuss some options. I don't mind helping you out at the range if you're receptive.
    "If I know that I am headed for a fight, I want something larger with more power, preferably crew-served.
    However, like most of us, as I go through my daily life, I carry something a bit more compact, with a lot less power."
    (unknown 'gun~writer')

    Remington 1911 R1 (Back to Basics)
    SERPA retention or concealed...

    "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~Thomas Jefferson
    (Borrowed from "The Perfect Day" by LTC Dave Grossman)

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    My take on race gun bells and whistles:

    If you are in a situation where the ported barrel would make a difference, you as a human in that situation would not reap the benefit the reduced recoil would offer. You're simply under too much stress and adrenalin to get the intended results. Rely on your bodies chemistry and training to kick in, [some] police that have been in shootings can't even recall the number of rounds they fired, or the fact that they even reloaded.

    That leaves the night blindness, hearing loss and potentially pre-contaminated ports as a downside.

    OTOH, if you want to carry it as a conversation piece cause the little slits "look cool", that's on you.
    Last edited by epilogue; 02-25-2011 at 09:59 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MSC 45ACP View Post
    Grape is a very wise and experienced fellow. I happen to share his opinion most of the time.

    I am profoundly sorry someone sold you a compensated pistol as a carry gun, for all the reasons already listed above. You should NEVER COMPENSATE for poor marksmanship ability. Learn how to shoot better. Your money would be wisely invested in proper marksmanship instruction and a lot of practice ammo and time well-spent at the range. Simply sending rounds downrange without being able to analyze what you're doing wrong is a big waste of ammo and time.

    For example, if you find that you are consistently hitting "low", a neophyte will assume his pistol sights are wrong rather than having a very consistent (but still incorrect) wrong trigger squeeze. If you learned how to shoot from Uncle Billy-Joe-Jim-Bob (who meant well but never really learned proper marksmanship without something to rest his worn-out rifle upon when shooting), you may assume "the barrel is shot out" rather than learn that you're not focusing on your front sight when you squeeze the trigger. You also wouldn't know when the sights are truly "off" when you have an improper grip or trigger squeeze or if the rear sight is actually off to one side from years of being in a left-side holster and the seat-belt assembly of your car has actually 'pushed' the rear sight sideways.

    My advice may be expensive, but well-worth it: Get rid of the compensated pistol (unless you're getting into ISPC shooting) and get some advice about a 'carry gun" and get some PROPER range instruction. Feel free to PM me if you want to discuss some options. I don't mind helping you out at the range if you're receptive.
    I would have to partially disagree with you here. There are logical arguments in favor of a compensated gun for carry, just like there are logical arguments against it. Ultimately, it needs to fall to the individual to decide whether or not it is worth carrying.

    For example, I have a friend who pocket carries a Diamondback DB380C (subcompact 380 ACP with a compensated barrel, although he also has an uncompensated barrel for it) as his BUG/casual carry firearm. (His standard carry gun is a 3.5" 1911.) Even though it's a weaker round, because the gun is so small, the compensated barrel significantly aids in controlling the recoil. He's an experienced shooter (over 2 decades), and after testing the gun thoroughly, decided to use it with the compensated barrel.

    This sort of decision is no different than anything else with choosing a carry gun. You need to evaluate the available options and choose the one that you are most comfortable with. Every carry gun has potential issues and risks associated with it. Rather than criticize someone for what they choose to carry, it is better to make sure that they understand both the potential benefits as well as accept the potential risks.

    Currently, my wife is limited to carrying a 22 because that is all that we have that her current wardrobe will support (she's still wearing maternity clothes). She understands the risks associated with the smaller caliber, but views it as the best option for her current situation. (She's a better shot with a 45 than I am.)

    If Terrence Holman understands the risks (such as potential damage to night vision) associated with carrying a compensated gun, and accepts those risks, then it is a perfectly acceptable option for him. It's really not our place to tell him he shouldn't do that.
    Alma 43:47 - "And again, the Lord has said that: Ye shall defend your families even unto bloodshed...."
    Self defense isn't just a good idea, it's a commandment.

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    Quote Originally Posted by grylnsmn View Post
    It's really not our place to tell him he shouldn't do that.
    Except that he asked.

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    Quote Originally Posted by epilogue View Post
    Except that he asked.
    He asked what do we think. That is a golden opportunity to educate him on both the benefits and risks. We should still leave drawing conclusions up to him.
    Alma 43:47 - "And again, the Lord has said that: Ye shall defend your families even unto bloodshed...."
    Self defense isn't just a good idea, it's a commandment.

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grylnsmn View Post
    I would have to partially disagree with you here. There are logical arguments in favor of a compensated gun for carry, just like there are logical arguments against it. Ultimately, it needs to fall to the individual to decide whether or not it is worth carrying.

    For example, I have a friend who pocket carries a Diamondback DB380C (subcompact 380 ACP with a compensated barrel, although he also has an uncompensated barrel for it) as his BUG/casual carry firearm. (His standard carry gun is a 3.5" 1911.) Even though it's a weaker round, because the gun is so small, the compensated barrel significantly aids in controlling the recoil. He's an experienced shooter (over 2 decades), and after testing the gun thoroughly, decided to use it with the compensated barrel.

    This sort of decision is no different than anything else with choosing a carry gun. You need to evaluate the available options and choose the one that you are most comfortable with. Every carry gun has potential issues and risks associated with it. Rather than criticize someone for what they choose to carry, it is better to make sure that they understand both the potential benefits as well as accept the potential risks.

    Currently, my wife is limited to carrying a 22 because that is all that we have that her current wardrobe will support (she's still wearing maternity clothes). She understands the risks associated with the smaller caliber, but views it as the best option for her current situation. (She's a better shot with a 45 than I am.)

    If Terrence Holman understands the risks (such as potential damage to night vision) associated with carrying a compensated gun, and accepts those risks, then it is a perfectly acceptable option for him. It's really not our place to tell him he shouldn't do that.
    That's completely true except for one thing. The OP is new to this and the people you mention are not. As you master the basics you can move into the more refined equipment fully realizing the benefits and liabilities.

    MY EDC's are absolutely not for everyone and certainly not for beginners...but I've been shooting for 50 years and know what my specific needs and abilities are.
    I also know the limits of my hardware and my training is geared to that.

    MSC 45ACP is an experienced shooter and instructor, He's repeatedly offered to help new shooters and I hope some of them have taken him up on it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    That's completely true except for one thing. The OP is new to this and the people you mention are not. As you master the basics you can move into the more refined equipment fully realizing the benefits and liabilities.
    Just because he's new to this doesn't mean that he is unable to understand both the benefits and risks that we present, and come to a reasoned decision on his own.

    To use a somewhat personal analogy, I work in computer security. My primary job is to analyze risks that our systems face and present a variety of options for how to address those risks. My boss doesn't understand as much about the security side of things, but that doesn't stop him from being the one who has to make the final decisions on which options we actually implement. My job is to help him understand the benefits and risks so that he can make a better decision. It's not my place to make the decision for him, nor to tell him which decision he should make.
    Alma 43:47 - "And again, the Lord has said that: Ye shall defend your families even unto bloodshed...."
    Self defense isn't just a good idea, it's a commandment.

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grylnsmn View Post
    Just because he's new to this doesn't mean that he is unable to understand both the benefits and risks that we present, and come to a reasoned decision on his own.

    To use a somewhat personal analogy, I work in computer security. My primary job is to analyze risks that our systems face and present a variety of options for how to address those risks. My boss doesn't understand as much about the security side of things, but that doesn't stop him from being the one who has to make the final decisions on which options we actually implement. My job is to help him understand the benefits and risks so that he can make a better decision. It's not my place to make the decision for him, nor to tell him which decision he should make.
    I agree again......but again, HE Asked!

    I didn't just see him on the street and say "Hey Dude...You'll shoot your eye out and grow hair on your palms using that thar race gun".

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    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    I agree again......but again, HE Asked!

    I didn't just see him on the street and say "Hey Dude...You'll shoot your eye out and grow hair on your palms using that thar race gun".
    Of course he won't shoot his eye out. What do you think it is? A Red Ryder BB gun?

    I mean, I understand using hypothetical examples, but could you please try to make them at least a little believable?
    Alma 43:47 - "And again, the Lord has said that: Ye shall defend your families even unto bloodshed...."
    Self defense isn't just a good idea, it's a commandment.

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    Quote Originally Posted by grylnsmn View Post
    He asked what do we think. That is a golden opportunity to educate him on both the benefits and risks. We should still leave drawing conclusions up to him.
    Could have sworn we've each been telling him what we think. I don't believe anyone here can make him come to a conclusion without some sort of long range telepathy super power of persuasion. Free men make free choices.

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