Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 57

Thread: HELP, Anyone been through this?

  1. #1
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Tumwater
    Posts
    35

    HELP, Anyone been through this?

    I will make this short; my live in girlfriend has a felony. All my guns are in a safe or at times on my hip. She is reconnecting with her child and a court ordered guardian at Litem wants to check out my house.

    Never thought I would be posting this.
    Last edited by Stat; 03-04-2011 at 10:58 AM.

  2. #2
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Everett, Washington, USA
    Posts
    3,339
    Read up on Physical Possession and Constructive Possession.

    This is a slippery slope for you and your girlfriend.
    "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."

    "though I walk through the valley in the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for I know that you are by my side" Glock 23:40

  3. #3
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    North of Seattle, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,953
    You might consider an alternate storage location for a while. Also make sure that you aren't seen carrying by the investigator.

    Could be an issue.
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

  4. #4
    Regular Member Dave_pro2a's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    2,227
    I haven't been through it, but my understanding is that as long as she has 'no ability' to access the firearms then she should be ok.

    That means no keeping a gun in the nightstand.

    But with a kid & custody involved, ya never know.
    Last edited by Dave_pro2a; 03-04-2011 at 11:40 AM.

  5. #5
    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Federal Way, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,667
    I am going to make a short, curt and striking point.

    You need to get a new girlfriend, plain and simple.
    Live Free or Die!

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Tumwater
    Posts
    35
    Quote Originally Posted by gogodawgs View Post
    I am going to make a short, curt and striking point.

    You need to get a new girlfriend, plain and simple.
    I knew that was coming

  7. #7
    Regular Member DEROS72's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    SEATAC, Washington, USA
    Posts
    2,819
    I agree with Nick,time to get a new girlfriend.I also agree with the other posters on this.Could be a real problem.These investigators have never been known for a pro2A stance.At the very least don't live together ,you seriously put your rights in jepordy.

  8. #8
    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Federal Way, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,667
    Quote Originally Posted by Stat View Post
    I knew that was coming
    Ask yourself a basic question.

    Are your fundamental rights worth this one person, your current girlfriend?

    I can not answer that question with a yes, and can not imagine how another would answer in the affirmative either. While it may be a difficult decission, the decission is the correct one and I would suspect that you know that is the correct answer as well.

    (Would you also give up your right to free speach? Would you give up your right to be free against unreasonable searches?)
    Last edited by gogodawgs; 03-04-2011 at 12:24 PM.
    Live Free or Die!

  9. #9
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Tumwater
    Posts
    35
    Quote Originally Posted by gogodawgs View Post
    Ask yourself a basic question.

    Are your fundamental rights worth this one person, your current girlfriend?

    I can not answer that question with a yes, and can not imagine how another would answer in the affirmative either. While it may be a difficult decission, the decission is the correct one and I would suspect that you know that is the correct answer as well.

    (Would you also give up your right to free speach? Would you give up your right to be free against unreasonable searches?)
    Without answering the question, say I go through with this and this person comes into MY house to inspect. Before that point I have removed all the guns from my residence but what is left is evidence of a lifestyle with guns i.e. gun safes, pictures with guns, pictures with dead animals, animal mounts, reloading room, on and on.
    I’m not liking this!
    Last edited by Stat; 03-04-2011 at 01:01 PM.

  10. #10
    Regular Member SpyderTattoo's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Kent, Washington, USA
    Posts
    1,018
    I think you just answered your own questions...

    (Agreeing with Deros and Gogo)
    Certified Glock Armorer

    "A government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any particular individual citizen..." -- Warren v. District of Columbia, 444 A.2d 1 (D.C. App.181)

    A 1911 that works properly is as rare as a Glock that doesn't.

  11. #11
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Nampa, Idaho, USA
    Posts
    1,096
    I just went thru this possession thing as jury in a local trial.

    this is a link to the legal definition of "Possession".

    http://www.lectlaw.com/def2/p057.htm

    IMHO, I believe that if all firearms are located within the safe, she does not know the combination or have access to it or a key and expressly knows she is forbidden,by you as well as law, there is no intent so possession would not be a factor. Legally. However you cannot control anothers first impressions or bias. At least that's how I would have voted. I am not a lawyer, however.
    Last edited by carracer; 03-04-2011 at 12:42 PM. Reason: Additions.

  12. #12
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    North of Seattle, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,953
    Quote Originally Posted by carracer View Post
    I just went thru this possession thing as jury in a local trial.

    this is a link to the legal definition of "Possession".

    http://www.lectlaw.com/def2/p057.htm

    IMHO, I believe that if all firearms are located within the safe, she does not know the combination or have access to it or a key and expressly knows she is forbidden,by you as well as law, there is no intent so possession would not be a factor. Legally. However you cannot control anothers first impressions or bias. At least that's how I would have voted. I am not a lawyer, however.
    This phrase could be an issue

    A person who is not in actual possession, but who has both the power and the intention to later take control over something either alone or together with someone else, is in constructive possession of it.
    Women have, since the beginning, convincing men to do things they know they shouldn't be doing.

    This is a minefield that you will be negotiating as long as this woman is in your house. It isn't totally what WE think here that matters, it's what the people from DSHS think and some of them are ill equipped for the task. In the end it will end up a choice between her and risking your right to own firearms. Unless she gets HER rights restored YOUR's will always be at risk.

    Old saying. "God gave man a brain and a penis but only enough blood to run one or the other. Not enough to run both at the same time?"
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

  13. #13
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Wa, ,
    Posts
    2,769
    The House is yours, all the firearms are in a locked safe that can only be opened by YOU, You do not have to open the safe for the "investigator" absence a warrant.
    The impression the "investigator" would get from reloading room, animal mounts,etc. cannot create a problem for you. However, the girlfriend is the one who will be impacted by the acts of the investigator.
    Suggested solutions:
    1.Get new girl friend
    2.Have girl friend relocate
    3.Get new girl friend
    4.Sell all guns
    5.Get new girl friend.
    Some of these suggestions have more merit than others.

  14. #14
    Opt-Out Members BigDave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Yakima, Washington, USA
    Posts
    3,463
    Seems clear you are not wanting to drop the girlfriend which by all means is your choice, so what is left?
    Secure your firearms and conceal during a visit, if the chips do not fall in place for her, it is not your fault but a price people play for committing crimes or losing custody of their children.

    All in all, she lost her rights on possession, you did not.
    And I agree with those who spoke of, it may not matter what the law is but the impression it leaves with the guardian at Litem.
    Granted if a negative view is taken by them, it is not right but do you really want to fight that battle.

    Something to consider?
    length of time knowing her?
    length of time in this relationship?
    was this a major point of topic when the relationship began?

    People or in this case, women have been known to have alternative motives to accomplish such tasked.

    Good Luck
    • Being prepared is to prepare, this is our responsibility.
    • I am not your Mommy or Daddy and do not sugar coat it but I will tell you simply as how I see it, it is up to you on how you will or will not use it.
    • IANAL, all information I present is for your review, do your own homework.

  15. #15
    Regular Member Dave_pro2a's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    2,227
    FYI;

    I asked someone who works 'in the industry' of child welfare stuff.

    Her automatic response was "no way, she won't get her kids back in that scenario. And if she's deceptive about anything, things will be way worse in the long term."

    Take it with a grain of salt. Maybe talk to an attorney who specializes in child custody/child welfare type issues.

  16. #16
    Regular Member HK_dave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Puyallup, WA
    Posts
    144
    Quote Originally Posted by carracer View Post
    However you cannot control anothers first impressions or bias.
    and they WILL be biased. a friend went thru this.

    remember - court appointed guardian of the child. that is who they represent.

    these people are not your friends. they are looking to f*ck you over any way they can.

    OMG guns! think of the children!
    US Constitution - void where prohibited by law.

  17. #17
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Washington
    Posts
    2,546
    If you insist on keeping the girlfriend, she better get started on trying to get her rights restored.
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

  18. #18
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Olympia
    Posts
    539
    Quote Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
    If you insist on keeping the girlfriend, she better get started on trying to get her rights restored.

    I was going to say the same thing...but its a pretty expensive process fom what I understand.

  19. #19
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    North of Seattle, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,953
    Quote Originally Posted by BigDave View Post

    People or in this case, women have been known to have alternative motives
    I can remember a couple from back in my "single days". A they were motivated by a place to live and someone to support them.
    Last edited by amlevin; 03-04-2011 at 06:16 PM.
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

  20. #20
    Regular Member Haz.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    I come from a land downunder.
    Posts
    1,227
    Amliven wrote;

    "Women have, since the beginning, convincing men to do things they know they shouldn't be doing."
    .

    I agree. If you love her she would get the key or combination out of you eventually!

    "And Delilah said to Samson, Tell me, I pray thee, wherein thy great strength lieth, and wherewith thou mightest be bound to afflict thee." (Judges 16:6).

    "And it came to pass, when she pressed him daily with her words, and urged him, so that his soul was vexed unto death;" (Judges 16:16).

    "That he told her all his heart, and said unto her, There hath not come a razor upon mine head; for I have been a Nazarite unto God from my mother's womb: if I be shaven, then my strength will go from me, and I shall become weak, and be like any other man." (Judges 16:17).

    "But the Philistines took him, and put out his eyes, and brought him down to Gaza, and bound him with fetters of brass; and he did grind in the prison house." (Judges 16:21).

    Get yourself another girlfriend mate! Haz.

  21. #21
    Regular Member Stretch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Pasco, WA, ,
    Posts
    489
    From experience: Guns of yours will affect the possession of her children almost every, single time. The guardian will be prejudice, expect nothing less.

  22. #22
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Bellingham, Wa
    Posts
    20
    Speaking from experience with guardian at litem, the two that I have had experience with did not care that we had firearms in the house. I don't remember the exact rule, but it's something to the effect of "All firearms must be in a locked safe".

    As for what to do about the felony, I like what BigDave said.

  23. #23
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Tumwater
    Posts
    35
    Thank you for the input everyone.

    Talked to my lawyer. She said not to count on the Guardian at Litem knowing the law. It is legal for me to have guns in a safe or one on my person, this would be actual possession. As long as a felon that has residency at my home does not have access to them.
    Constructive possession is a gun in a closet or trunk with a resident felon having access to the house or car.
    Either way I’m not breaking the law I’m just setting up one hell of a breakup.
    She has never had access to my safes and never will, no interest in them at all.
    The only thing I have decided at this point is not to opencarry around her for now.
    I knew most of this going into it but the litem thing is a B.
    Last edited by Stat; 03-04-2011 at 07:56 PM.

  24. #24
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    57
    Quote Originally Posted by gogodawgs View Post
    I am going to make a short, curt and striking point.

    You need to get a new girlfriend, plain and simple.
    +1

    Shooters before hooters.

  25. #25
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    North of Seattle, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,953
    Quote Originally Posted by Stat View Post
    Thank you for the input everyone.

    Talked to my lawyer. She said not to count on the Guardian at Litem knowing the law. It is legal for me to have guns in a safe or one on my person, this would be actual possession. As long as a felon that has residency at my home does not have access to them.
    Constructive possession is a gun in a closet or trunk with a resident felon having access to the house or car.
    Either way I’m not breaking the law I’m just setting up one hell of a breakup.
    She has never had access to my safes and never will, no interest in them at all.
    The only thing I have decided at this point is not to opencarry around her for now.
    I knew most of this going into it but the litem thing is a B.

    In 2009, 50.7% of the people in the US were women. 74% of them were over 18. Eliminate 25% as "too old" and that still leaves a "Pool" of 75 million or so women. Not all are felons. If you have to choose again, go for a non-felon. Out of a pool that large there ought to be one or two to catch your eye.
    Last edited by amlevin; 03-04-2011 at 09:00 PM.
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •