Us old guys can only see old signs, but we do understand the Big words.
Mit pictures, yes?
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Mariners' Museum in Newport News
- Thread starter t33j
- Start date
Us old guys can only see old signs, but we do understand the Big words.
Mit pictures, yes?
MSC 45ACP
Regular Member
Monday Visit to Mariners'
Today was Monday... If I can figure out how to attach photos to this thing,
I will include the photo of the front door that includes the information about hours of operation:
Wednesday through Saturday, 10-5 and Sunday 12 to 5.
The sign nearest the parking lot I use has no mention of "no weapons". If I were able to post it here, it would say
"Mariners Museum Parking Lots are Private Property and Parking is reserved for museum members (of which I am one), and visitors to the Museum, Park, PFAC and Noland Trail"
I did find another sign closer to the entrance. My photo of that sign is unreadable, but it is the same sign that someone else photographed with better results and includes verbage that "weapons are prohibited in the park and trails".
I've OC'd many times inside the museum and never been approached. Maybe I've just been lucky? I wear a faded Dept. of Homeland Security baseball cap most of the time (which I earned amd am entitled to wear), but those that have met me would not mistake me for an active duty LEO. My hair far exceeds grooming standards; more silver than brown and am 100 lbs heavier than I was when I retired 6 years ago.
Today was Monday... If I can figure out how to attach photos to this thing,
I will include the photo of the front door that includes the information about hours of operation:
Wednesday through Saturday, 10-5 and Sunday 12 to 5.
The sign nearest the parking lot I use has no mention of "no weapons". If I were able to post it here, it would say
"Mariners Museum Parking Lots are Private Property and Parking is reserved for museum members (of which I am one), and visitors to the Museum, Park, PFAC and Noland Trail"
I did find another sign closer to the entrance. My photo of that sign is unreadable, but it is the same sign that someone else photographed with better results and includes verbage that "weapons are prohibited in the park and trails".
I've OC'd many times inside the museum and never been approached. Maybe I've just been lucky? I wear a faded Dept. of Homeland Security baseball cap most of the time (which I earned amd am entitled to wear), but those that have met me would not mistake me for an active duty LEO. My hair far exceeds grooming standards; more silver than brown and am 100 lbs heavier than I was when I retired 6 years ago.
MSC 45ACP
Regular Member
MSC 45ACP
Regular Member
simplyflockingamazing...
Thanks for going to the trouble of getting the Pics.
It'll be interesting to see how this plays out.
t33j
Regular Member
Got a response from the Arts Commission and I'll include it for completeness.
The Mariners' Museum (Project): $6,500
which is about 4% of all the grant money spent this year.
The Mariners' Museum (Project): $6,500
which is about 4% of all the grant money spent this year.
Presume the above is the only pertinent reference.
What does that tell you - public grant, private grant?
t33j
Regular Member
Not sure I know what you're asking. I'll attach the whole document for your interest.
Appreciate it.
As I understand the effect of public grants being received by private entities is that such causes the entity (Mariners Museum in this case) to be treated much like a public, municipal operation.
In this case it is still not clear - is the Newport News Arts Commission publicly or privately funded?
Yaah, found the answer: Public money!
http://www.nngov.com/arts-commission/resources/grants
IMO - having accepted the grant the Mariners Museum can do no more than the City of Newport News regarding firearms.
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+15.2-915
t33j
Regular Member
I sent an email to the museum a while back but have yet to receive a response.
I have also spoken with an internal source who said the shipyard has nothing to do with the ownership or operation of the buildings and grounds. At one time the president of the shipyard did have a role as an individual.
What I found more interesting was that UVA would somehow inherit the museum if it were to become derelict. Don't really have details about this.
Most of the money for museum operations comes from return on foundation investments. Apparently the museum has been in a poor financial state for years. Still not sure about what to make of or do about the grant money.
I have also spoken with an internal source who said the shipyard has nothing to do with the ownership or operation of the buildings and grounds. At one time the president of the shipyard did have a role as an individual.
What I found more interesting was that UVA would somehow inherit the museum if it were to become derelict. Don't really have details about this.
Most of the money for museum operations comes from return on foundation investments. Apparently the museum has been in a poor financial state for years. Still not sure about what to make of or do about the grant money.
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wylde007
Regular Member
I received this response
From one Chris Leahy:
From one Chris Leahy:
My follow-up email has not elicited a reply.
It appears that someone is being less than candid.
Ask specifically about the Newport News Arts Commission giving them grants.
http://www.nngov.com/arts-commission/resources/grants
2a4all
Regular Member
Entire Mariner's Museum Park is No Carry.
I OC'd while the wife and I attended the free Thursday night outdoor concert (Crazy Ex's played). While we were seated on our lawn chairs, one of the armed security guards walked by. As it looked like it might rain, I asked him if he had any updates on the weather. When he leaned over to talk, he saw my weapon. He asked my if I knew I wasn't supposed to carry on the premises. I said I didn't, and as far as I knew, the only posting applied to the Noland Trail. He replied, no, it applies to the entire facility, as it's private property. I asked if he was sure if that was the policy, and if he wasn't who would know. He asked me my name, which I gave him, and if I had a CHP, to which I replied in the affirmative, He advised me to be careful, and left.
Shortly thereafter, the band took a break, so we decided to leave. As we were walking to the parking lot, another security officer hailed me and asked of he could talk to me. I said "OK", and continued to walk to the car. He asked me to stop and talk to him right there. In retrospect, I guess I was detained. He was accompanied by the Director, Department of Protection Services (aka the Chief of Police for the park), who spoke with me.
He said, "I see you're carrying a weapon." I adimitted that, and indicated that I always do, and have done so every time I've come to the facility. I also said that any prohibitions weren't posted except for a sign that, AFAIK, only pertained to the Noland Trail. He responded that the Park Rules on the sign at the entrance applied to the entire facility, and that because the MM is private property the prohibition is valid.
We talked about the discussions on this forum, and how several people didn't think that the sign applied to the museum, and that there is no other notice available anywhere else, including fliers, web site, etc. I explained that if "No Carry" is in fact the policy that they want their guests to follow, it should be more clearly stated. He responded that their Legal Eagles have told them that "All you need to do is ask them to leave." And I replied, "That's correct. And if they don't, you can only charge them with trespass, because they have committed no other crime." He agreed. He also said that people assume that new State and Federal Park rules apply to the MM, but don't realize that the MM is private property.
I told him that I would post this conversation on this forum. He gave me his card, we shook hands, and parted company.
I OC'd while the wife and I attended the free Thursday night outdoor concert (Crazy Ex's played). While we were seated on our lawn chairs, one of the armed security guards walked by. As it looked like it might rain, I asked him if he had any updates on the weather. When he leaned over to talk, he saw my weapon. He asked my if I knew I wasn't supposed to carry on the premises. I said I didn't, and as far as I knew, the only posting applied to the Noland Trail. He replied, no, it applies to the entire facility, as it's private property. I asked if he was sure if that was the policy, and if he wasn't who would know. He asked me my name, which I gave him, and if I had a CHP, to which I replied in the affirmative, He advised me to be careful, and left.
Shortly thereafter, the band took a break, so we decided to leave. As we were walking to the parking lot, another security officer hailed me and asked of he could talk to me. I said "OK", and continued to walk to the car. He asked me to stop and talk to him right there. In retrospect, I guess I was detained. He was accompanied by the Director, Department of Protection Services (aka the Chief of Police for the park), who spoke with me.
He said, "I see you're carrying a weapon." I adimitted that, and indicated that I always do, and have done so every time I've come to the facility. I also said that any prohibitions weren't posted except for a sign that, AFAIK, only pertained to the Noland Trail. He responded that the Park Rules on the sign at the entrance applied to the entire facility, and that because the MM is private property the prohibition is valid.
We talked about the discussions on this forum, and how several people didn't think that the sign applied to the museum, and that there is no other notice available anywhere else, including fliers, web site, etc. I explained that if "No Carry" is in fact the policy that they want their guests to follow, it should be more clearly stated. He responded that their Legal Eagles have told them that "All you need to do is ask them to leave." And I replied, "That's correct. And if they don't, you can only charge them with trespass, because they have committed no other crime." He agreed. He also said that people assume that new State and Federal Park rules apply to the MM, but don't realize that the MM is private property.
I told him that I would post this conversation on this forum. He gave me his card, we shook hands, and parted company.
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paramedic70002
Regular Member
Unfortunate. Perhaps a coordinated letter writing campaign to the "powers" would be in order?
2a4all
Regular Member
Ironically, I received my invitation to renew my membership in yesterday's mail.
I have attended several of the lectures hosted at the museum given by book authors, which I found entertaining and informative. What I found strange, or even unsettling, was the presence of uniformed, armed security personnel at these functions (mostly attended by senior citizens) trying to act like ushers.
Like the AG, I have to question the wisdom and the implementation of their policy, which of course begs the question of what to do about renewal.
paramedic70002
Regular Member
This comes under the heading, "Hit 'em in the pocketbook." I know what I would do.
Checking their "Contact Me" page, none of the Board members have listed emails, and the best general email I am assuming is: membership@MarinersMuseum.org . If you want to talk to someone: (757) 591-7715.
Here's the email I just sent:
Checking their "Contact Me" page, none of the Board members have listed emails, and the best general email I am assuming is: membership@MarinersMuseum.org . If you want to talk to someone: (757) 591-7715.
Here's the email I just sent:
2a4all
Regular Member
That should get their attention.
TFred
Regular Member
Good letter!
My only very small suggestion would be to tweak the wording about your son's school:
"I will speak against my sons' schools from planning any field trips there."
I would say something a little stronger (especially since I would suspect that school field trips are very important to this kind of museum):
"I will strongly lobby to the best of my ability against ANY visit to the museum by my child's schools."
Just a slight tweak...
ETA: One follow-up... as we have seen with countless instances of where gun carry laws have been relaxed... it is nearly certain that if they do eliminate their prohibition, the end result will be essentially no change. The concealed carriers are never seen, and the Open Carriers are simply not prevalent enough to make a notable difference (unless we decide to have a field trip or something!)
I would add to a closing, something to the effect of: "As we have seen over the years in Virginia, in countless instances of relaxing restrictions on the legal carrying of firearms by law-abiding citizens, the only thing worth noting has been the fact that there have been NO incidents worth noting. A year ago the ban on carrying concealed guns in restaurants that serve alcohol was rescinded, and despite the cries that there would be "blood in the streets", nothing has happened. I strongly suspect that the day after you drop your gun ban policy, you will not notice any difference whatsoever, and yet you, your staff, and your visitors will be inherently safer, because any potential criminals will know that they just might not be free to murder at will."
TFred
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Fantastic letter - hope it generates the response it so richly deserves.
Mindflayer
New member
My ex would sometimes run/walk in that park without me when we lived in Newport News. She ran into flashers and a couple of creepy guys several times. I'd think carrying there and in NN Park would be a Good Thing.™