mspgunner
Regular Member
Right, it would not....
-
We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
-
If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
-
Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.
Second time open carrying- ARRESTED!!!
- Thread starter lancers
- Start date
Right, it would not....
mspgunner
Regular Member
Ditto. There is a big difference.
Tony4310
Regular Member
I came to the same after listening as well.
sohighlyunlikely
Regular Member
You have to remember the original detention is a separate issue than the warrant, and that detention was illegal. Several cities in several states have had to pay out settlements for just that. The usual Settlement taken for an illegal detention caused from open carry is around 20K. Now the other wrongfully warrant stuff is outside of my studies and I am not sure of the case law for it.
Doc
Tony4310
Regular Member
The wrongful warrant falls on the issuing city/county in this case. They would be responsible for that,not Maplewood, unless MW knew it was wrongful and did it anyways . Now as far as detention on the gun issue. That it self could win against Maplewood.
lancers
Regular Member
Yeah, I just wanted to clear it up.
They never really said, you are under arrest for so and so, but they all told me it's illegal to open carry and then you can hear them say, "He has a valid CCW, but he can't just open carry on his hip like that" And again, the warrant was never confirmed until we were on our way to jail. That is not normally what happens. They confirm it and then you go to jail. It was only after we got to jail, and the officer made phone calls did he say I wasn't going to be charged in relation to the gun.
Well, the good news is that you should not have been checked for warrants w/o RAS. And, since their RAS was anything but, you might have some action against Maplewood. But, the bad news is I believe the MOSC has been pretty flexible about that.
To me, the most interesting part was that you had a vmail from the City Manager, and the police were completely uninterested. I don't know that it makes any difference in court, but it certainly makes them look like amateurs. I imagine the Chief of Police and City Manager will have a nice visit on Monday. I doubt the City Manager has any authority over the Police Dept, but it would be interesting to be a fly on the wall.
What is the rationale for them keeping your firearm and CCW license? That doesn't sound right either, certainly grounds for illegal seizure.
BTW, I just read what happened to the St. George PD. It's quite interesting. I grew up in STL, and I vaguely remember the story. But, I'd say that it's probably not helpful to antagonize the PD like that. That's what the courts are for.
To me, the most interesting part was that you had a vmail from the City Manager, and the police were completely uninterested. I don't know that it makes any difference in court, but it certainly makes them look like amateurs. I imagine the Chief of Police and City Manager will have a nice visit on Monday. I doubt the City Manager has any authority over the Police Dept, but it would be interesting to be a fly on the wall.
What is the rationale for them keeping your firearm and CCW license? That doesn't sound right either, certainly grounds for illegal seizure.
BTW, I just read what happened to the St. George PD. It's quite interesting. I grew up in STL, and I vaguely remember the story. But, I'd say that it's probably not helpful to antagonize the PD like that. That's what the courts are for.
usamarshal
Regular Member
Definitely keep us posted
Bummer on the warrant, it gives them a little break and they do not deserve it.
Suggestion, talk less, takes away the "agitated state" claim they can make weak but they do not need a lot.
"Why am I being detained, I have broken no laws, am I free to go, I consent to no searches what so ever and I am invoking my right to remain silent."
Ain't saying you did a bad job, just sayin they will twist what ever you did say into something it never was at all.
I know we have had a few discussion in the past, but I never live there, and I support you being active against these jokers.
Suggestion, talk less, takes away the "agitated state" claim they can make weak but they do not need a lot.
"Why am I being detained, I have broken no laws, am I free to go, I consent to no searches what so ever and I am invoking my right to remain silent."
Ain't saying you did a bad job, just sayin they will twist what ever you did say into something it never was at all.
I know we have had a few discussion in the past, but I never live there, and I support you being active against these jokers.
lancers
Regular Member
Yeah, they basically didn't care that I had a recording of the city manager, not like it mattered. Also, if I had not had a CCW, I know I would have had a weapons charge. Which is wrong, wrong, wrong.
I have no idea why they thought I should keep all of my stuff. The sgt. I spoke with last night said it was locked up in the evidence room and I would have to make an appointment with detectives on Monday to go get it. He "didn't have a key". Yeah right.
I know, I was acting a little cocky, but I was so pissed, I couldn't believe it their screws. Well actually I could. I just couldn't believe I was in the middle of two huge screws up by separate departments at the same time. Then again, this is St. Louis.
M
McX
Guest
every dirty trick they know, every way they can. nail their hides to the wall!
usamarshal
Regular Member
You get your stuff back?
Festus_Hagen
Regular Member
I've never had a problem OC'ing in the JC/ Columbia/ California area. But I wouldn't OC in SL or KC for sure.
Why be afraid of your God given right, reiterated by the Constitution?
SL City/County proper is definitely out. Most of the suburbs are fine. I'd say more, but I'm not that well read on that part of the state. In this case, the OP was carrying properly, Maplewood is perfectly legal for OC . But, you probably shouldn't hold the actions of a few uneducated LEO's against the entire region.
KCMO is perfectly safe for OC, and the police force has been well trained. Some of the suburbs don't allow it. Up north, it's Gladstone and NKC. Everywhere else appears to be fine. I OC'ed into a local gas station that had a KCMO policeman there (not the best part of town.) The policeman didn't even bat an eye on the Glock 17 on my hip, other than to ask me what rounds I had in it. Then he complimented me on my choice.
Let me say publicly that I'm absolutely proud of the people that are willing to take a drop down to the city jail to teach the police what they should already know. I'm a widower with 2 small kids, otherwise I'd be right beside them. But, instead I tend to play it safe, rather than to traumatize my kids (Mom's dead, now Daddy's going to jail, not healthy for 3 and 5 year olds.)
mspgunner, Tony, you think an armed protest wouldn't go over well? What do you think would happen?
I thought maybe a Maplewood OC event would be great, but I certainly don't wanna get popped over some BS.
I hope the city of Maplewood loses a bunch of money on this.
I thought maybe a Maplewood OC event would be great, but I certainly don't wanna get popped over some BS.
I hope the city of Maplewood loses a bunch of money on this.
Honesty, I don't think they're ready for an armed protest, depending on the meaning of protest of course. But, I think with the education they got on Saturday (lancers wasn't accused of any weapons violations), it might be time to have a OC lunch and city tour, with extra video/audio support once the OC training trickles up and back down again. I'd go with you, but the 4 hour commute would be killer.
Protesting while armed does not mean an armed protest.
I'd attend this if I had reliable transportation.
Protesting while armed does not mean an armed protest.
I'd attend this if I had reliable transportation.
I'm just using the words of the post I replied to, but I can explain a little better. Evidently, this town just got a schooling in OC being legal (or is about to.) The OP should not have been run for warrants, but was. In any event, they are new to this, and any type of behavior that is out of the ordinary, coupled with people that are open carrying, could cause a significant overreaction. If not by the police, then in the media.
Since there is a bill before the Missouri House to preempt local laws on OC for CCW endorsement holders, it's not a good time to antagonize unnecessarily. Note that I'm in favor of being seen OC, just not of protesting. So, eat dinner, and get your oil changed, and do everything else, but don't go protest.