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Thread: Project gun runner now being investigated by Congress?

  1. #1
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Project gun runner now being investigated by Congress?

    Posted: March 17, 2011
    6:25 pm Eastern

    By Michael Carl
    © 2011 WorldNetDaily


    U.S. Rep. Darrell Issa, R-Calif., says he has assigned four investigators to look into the escapade of the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives that has become known as "Project Gunrunner."

    Issa made the statement in a live broadcast interview with talk-radio host Roger Hedgecock. The case centers on allegations of a flow of guns into Mexico orchestrated by the federal agency, including a weapon that later was used to kill a U.S. Border Patrol agent.

    Investigators will examine allegations that the ATF encouraged gun shops to sell guns to questionable customers so it could track the weapons as they were smuggled into Mexico.

    The answers to all your questions about guns, safety and guarding your family are found in "SAFE: How to Protect Yourself, Your Family and Your Home"

    House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform spokesman Seamus Kraft says Issa's committee is launching the investigation because of the people's right to know what their government is doing.

    "Americans have a right to know who let this program happen and why. Our investigation seeks to deliver the facts so taxpayers can decide who should be held accountable," Kraft explained.

    In the Hedgecock interview, committee chairman Issa said he intends to find out who lied about the firearms smuggling operation.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GrBbt6yxvFE

    "The gun shops are often vilified for being the source, but in this case they did the right thing. They contacted the agency and were told to go ahead," Issa said. "As we get to the truth, we're going to hold those who lied to us early on accountable."

    Issa is also determined to break through the agency's efforts to stonewall the investigation.

    Kraft said Issa also supports plans for an inquiry by Sen. Charles Grassley, R-Iowa.

    "ATF and DOJ denied the existence of the program and stonewalled the senator's requests, relying on a policy of not disclosing information relating to an 'open investigation,'" Kraft explained.

    "Chairman Issa strongly supports Sen. Grassley's efforts, and he has launched an investigation to obtain the relevant information necessary to get to the bottom of this matter," Kraft added.

    A spokesman for Grassley, the Senate Judiciary Committee's ranking member, said the senator is pleased by the news about Issa's investigation.

    "Senator Grassley is pleased that Mr. Issa has joined him in getting to the bottom of the ATF's policy on letting guns walk, and he plans to coordinate and share information with Mr. Issa as the investigation continues," Grassley spokeswoman Beth Levine said.

    Kraft would not comment on plans by the Mexican government for hearings on the allegations, but Issa said in the Hedgecock interview he finally sees a Mexican government that is willing to cooperate.

    The operation went public in a number of reports, including one by CBS News correspondent Sharyl Attkisson, who said several agents had been ordered to "stand down" instead of intercepting the guns.

    WND reported recently that at least one of the gun shops that cooperated with the ATF operation became a target for a federal investigation for "illegal gun sales."

    That shop was Houston-based Carter's Country, whose managers were notified by Houston's U.S. attorney that they were the subjects of an investigation.

    Houston defense attorney Dick DeGuerin said that it took several court appearances and a mediation session to clear Carter's Country of any charges of wrongdoing.

    Kraft says Issa's committee hasn't made any decisions on reparations for legal fees.

    "At this point, we haven't reached any conclusion on the level of cooperation between FFLs and the ATF," Kraft stated.

    Read more: 'Gunrunner' escapade to be reviewed by Congress http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=276413#ixzz1GyUxbUWq
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  2. #2
    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    Thanks for the post Bailenforcer. Its nice to see you around here every once in awhile. Even though its only to start treads. Your threads are always informative, and very interesting, and always help us to better understand what is going on in this country, and what is happing in the world. I wish you would start posting in other threads again. I know and understand your reasons though. God Bless ya man. Nice to see you around sir!
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
    Luke 22:36
    God Bless

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    Regular Member pmcqueen37's Avatar
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    live every day like its your last cause one day you will be right

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    With due respect to honest people at the ATF, and full disrespect to all the sleaze bags I hope are about to get nailed,
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

  6. #6
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    The story grows!

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/03/09...candal-border/


    ATF, DOJ Launch Damage Control Effort Over Growing Project Gunrunner Scandal

    By William Lajeunesse

    Published March 09, 2011

    | FoxNews.com


    A major scandal is developing around a signature U.S. effort to track and stop the flow of illicit weapons to Mexico, as officials at the Department of Justice close ranks, hoping to cover up an investigation critics say is responsible for an untold number of dead.

    The investigation was known as Project Gunrunner -- a joint task force headed by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, and the Department of Justice -- that took place in 2010.

    It was conceived after the bureau was criticized for not conducting more complex investigations on straw buyers -- people who were allowed to purchase guns legally in the U.S.-- who illegally transport guns into Mexico and sell them to cartels.

    So rather than just take down low-level straw buyers here and there, the agency hoped by ‘letting the guns walk’ the sales would lead investigators to cartel members higher up in the organization.

    However, whistle-blowers say that never happened.

    Already we know the weapons used to kill Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry were being tracked by Gunrunner, but new documents reveal a much bigger problem.

    The questions this morning in Washington are how high does this go and will Congress call for a formal investigation of its own.

    "I'm still asking questions and we're getting the runaround from the Justice Department," Sen. Charles Grassley told Fox News.

    "They're stonewalling. And the longer the wait, the more they fight, the more egg that they're going to have on their face."

    Grassley and others say Gunrunner was a dismal and deadly failure, with ATF intentionally allowing thousands of weapons to be illegally trafficked to Mexico.

    Here is how sources say it worked: Arizona gun stores sold weapons to suspected straw buyers -- in some cases - 10 - 20 - 30 - AK-47s to the same person over just a few months.

    ATF could have said no, or later seized the guns in an arrest. Instead, owners were urged to sell, even though agents often knew the buyer was a straw for the Mexican cartels.

    Records show Gunrunner was aware of more than 1,000 weapons sold from 10 Arizona gun stores to roughly 50 straw buyers. More than two-thirds of those guns have already been recovered at crime scenes in the U.S. and Mexico.

    "What people don't understand is how long we will be dealing with this," ATF agent and whistle-blower John Dodson said Tuesday.

    "Those guns are gone -- gone. You can't just give the order and get them back. There is no telling how many previous crimes will be committed before we get to them."

    Privately, ATF agents say Gunrunner “was out of control” and deserved to be shut down. But the mistakes made were not intentional and they say there are no limits to the number of long guns (as opposed to pistols or revolvers) a person is allowed to buy.

    Therefore, while gun stores had the freedom to sell as many guns as they wanted to any single buyer, at no time did agents tell owners to ‘break the law.’

    Already sources say those guns can be traced to hundreds of robberies, rapes and murders. Critics say ATF knowingly allowed those sales to take place and failed to make arrests of known smugglers, thereby intercepting the guns before they crossed the border.

    "They would tell us -- we would say -- 'do you want us to stop selling?…is there something we should do here? and they would say "No, no, no -- continue selling -- just tell us after the fact," said Brad Desaye, owner of J & G Gun Sales in Prescott, Ariz.

    J&G sold 60 guns to alleged straw buyers. ATF agents told him on the phone and in person to let the sales happen.

    Dodson, one of seven agents on the Gunrunner task force, confirms that ATF knowingly allowed the sales and did not actively track the weapons, as in a traditional investigation. Instead, it allowed the guns to go south, where they were used in crimes or seized by Mexican police during raids.

    Until now, administration officials blamed Mexico's drug violence on Arizona and border state gun shops, repeatedly making the false claim that 90% of the guns recovered in Mexico were sold in the U.S.

    Now Desaye, paraphrasing Second Amendment activist Jeff Knox, says, "the truth is coming out. It's becoming obvious the largest supplier to Mexican gun violence is ATF, not the dealers. And they are using us as scapegoats."

    Carolyn Terry, the stepmother of murdered Border Agent Brian Terry also blames the ATF.

    "I think they put those guns out there and they lost them and now one of our own has got killed with one and they have made a big mistake and the government hates to make mistakes," says Terry. "You would think such a murder and killing would make an impact and that they would revise their policy or at least review their policy and we have no indication that is the situation."

    Sen. Grassley says ATF isn't the only guilty agency. He says Department of Justice lawyers and agents from Homeland Security also watched this debacle unfold, often hand in hand with ATF.

    Grassley has lengthy correspondence and numerous documents he wants to post on the Senate Judiciary website, but sources on the Hill say Judiciary Chairman Pat Leahy won't allow it, refusing to call for an independent congressional investigation.

    "The only reason this is going to be fair, the only way the Terry family is going to get the explanation that is owed to them is if there are independent hearings," says Dodson.

    "I'm not satisfied with the inspector general there doing the investigation; to me it looks like a fox guarding the hen house," echoes Grassley.

    As the scandal began to draw more media attention, the chief of Public Affairs at the ATF in Washington issued this memo February 28 to media relations staff throughout the agency. Critics say it's evidence the agency is trying to hide, or at least distract the media, from reporting on Project Gunrunner.

    "ATF needs to proactively push positive stories this week in an effort to preempt some negative reporting, or at a minimum lessen the coverage of (Project Gunrunner) in the news cycle by replacing them with good stories about the ATF."

    On Wednesday, the National Rifle Association also called for expedited congressional hearings on firearms trafficking enforcement tactics used by the ATF. In a letter to Grassley and Sen. Patrick Leahy it stressed the need for investigation into the responses by the ATF and DOJ about the Gunrunner program.



    Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/03/09...#ixzz1H6bn79YU
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  7. #7
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Mexico is upset about project gun runner.

    http://tucsoncitizen.com/view-from-b...unner-program/


    Mexico questions ATF’s Gunrunner program
    by Hugh Holub on Mar. 07, 2011, under atf, mexico, politics, project gunrunner

    CBS News reported Sunday March 6th that the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Mexico is questioning ATF’s “Fast and Furious” program under Project Gunrunner…where US agents let hundreds of guns “walk” into Mexico which are being found next to the ded bodies of Mexican citizens.

    Mexico requests info from U.S. on gun-running

    Mexico’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs is asking the U.S. government for details about ATF’s “Fast and Furious” operations.

    As our CBS News Investigation has revealed, “Fast and Furious” was a secret program under which, sources say, ATF purposely allowed thousands of assault rifles and other weapons from the U.S. into the hands of drug cartels in Mexico. Insiders call it letting the guns “walk.”…

    ….

    Documents show that ATF-walked guns began turning up at many violent crime scenes in Mexico from the start. Two of them – AK-47 variant semi-automatic assault rifles – were found at the murder scene of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry on December 14, 2010….

    More….

    Here is the announcement from Mexico:

    Posición ante reportes sobre la operación denominada “Fast and Furious” de la ATF

    Sábado 05 de Marzo | Comunicado # 065 | México, D.F.

    En relación con la información dada a conocer por diversos medios de comunicación estadounidenses y mexicanos sobre una operación denominada Fast and Furious conducida por la Oficina de control de Alcohol, Tabaco, Armas y Explosivos (ATF) del Departamento de Justicia de Estados Unidos, la Secretaría de Relaciones Exteriores manifiesta lo siguiente:

    1. Se ha procedido a solicitar información detallada sobre este asunto a las autoridades estadounidenses.

    2. El Gobierno de México seguirá con especial interés las investigaciones anunciadas tanto por ATF como por el Departamento de Justicia.

    3. El objetivo de los gobiernos de México y de Estados Unidos es detener el tráfico de armas sobre la base del principio de responsabilidad compartida y ambos trabajan para fortalecer la cooperación bilateral en la materia. Dicha prioridad fue ratificada por los Presidentes de México y Estados Unidos el pasado 3 de marzo, en Washington.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  8. #8
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Last edited by Bailenforcer; 03-19-2011 at 10:16 PM.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  9. #9
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    Why would they want an AK 47 from the states that costs over a thousand dollars, when they can get them for 10% of that cost from sources outside the US?

  10. #10
    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Why would they want an AK 47 from the states that costs over a thousand dollars, when they can get them for 10% of that cost from sources outside the US?
    That way the Brady Campaign and .gov can blame the US for Mexico's problems!
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
    Luke 22:36
    God Bless

  11. #11
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Congressman Issa says ongoing investigation!

    http://drscoundrels.com/2011/03/21/i...ect-gunrunner/


    Appearing on the Roger Hedgecock show lately, Darrell Issa talks about going after BATFE about the guns being purchased in the United States and being moved into Mexico, then being used back against our own Border Patrol agents.

    These are guns purchased and taken illegally across the border and used to kill Border Patrol agents on both sides of the border as well as being used by drug cartels to create open warfare in Mexico. This is something that has been followed by Mr. Hedgecock in San Diego quite carefully, and his interview with Congressman Issa let us know information about solutions that are forthcoming on our side of the border.

    According to Congressman Issa, there is an ongoing investigation where no less than 4 of Mr. Issa’s investigators are indeed looking into the matter.

    As Mr. Hedgecock states, we haven’t seen any of that in the media – and is that a surprise?

    According to what has been in the media, the BATFE has come out with the idea that they don’t have enough money or manpower to follow the guns to the source, they simply didn’t have what it took to stop the flow. And yet, as Mr. Issa states, yes they will have less budget due to the government being broke (my wording), but that means less inefficiency – not less agents.

    Frankly, as Mr. Issa indicates, the BATFE was allowing buys to happen to follow them and sting the buyers, but then they weren’t following the buys with anyone. The gun shops contacted BATFE, were given clearance to sell the weapons, then the BATFE failed in THEIR job.

    But, in the media – of course – the story appears to be exactly opposite – that it’s the evil gun dealers at shows and shops not giving a crap about people on both sides of the border, that they just wanted the quick buck.

    Personally, I wouldn’t want to be the people who didn’t tell the truth in the investigation to start – as Rep. Issa said,

    “As we get to the truth, we’re going to hold those who lied to us early on in the investigation accountable.”

    Not words you want to hear from the “policeman” of the House Oversight committee.

    Mr. Issa goes on to say that when this story first started with Republican Senators, that they were stonewalled, but that he has been given cooperation through the front door, that they have the power to make certain requests, that they are making sure they know what CBS knew when they broke the story and the Oversight investigators are looking for information provided by whistleblowers as well as their request they made to the administration officials.

    The investigation wasn’t really made public until Mr. Hedgecock broke this on his show with Mr. Issa.

    Kudos Mr. Hedgecock and thank you Mr. Issa for doing the right thing and going after these folks!

    Here is the video with the entirety of the interview:


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VavVkskU190



    It's heating up CALL CONGRESS and the Senate and make them investigate this!


    Gun owners have been blamed for the guns entering Mexico for several years now. if you value your gun rights it's time to walk the walk as opposed to talking.
    Last edited by Bailenforcer; 03-22-2011 at 05:50 PM.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  12. #12
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    G.O.A. calls for investigations

    http://www.sofmag.com/project-gunrun...gation-expands


    http://gunowners.org/projectgunrunner.htm

    GOA Calls for House Investigation into “Project Gunrunner” as Sen. Reid Drags his Feet

    (February 23, 2011)

    “Two months after the shooting death of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry, the FBI and the U.S. Attorney's Office remain silent. But family members, and others, are speaking out.”
    -- William Lajeunesse, “America’s Third War: Agent Brian Terry, A Policy of Silence?,” Fox News (February 22, 2011) at http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/02/22...olicy-silence/

    Summary

    According to recent press reports -- such as Fox News -- the ATF has enabled gun smuggling by telling gun dealers in the southwest to sell weapons to known straw purchasers (people who buy guns for others). Even worse, one of those guns became the murder weapon in a tragic case where a Border Patrol agent, Brian Terry, was gunned down on December 14th, 2010.

    This ATF operation is called Project Gunrunner and its purpose was to monitor illicit gun sales in the southwest in order to track down the smuggling rings delivering guns to the drug cartels.

    But, now, it’s beginning to look like the biggest arms supplier is the ATF itself for having allowed more than 3000 weapons to be smuggled under its Gunrunner program.

    While Senator Charles Grassley (R-IA) has demanded answers from the ATF, he has been blown off -- not only by agency superiors, but by officials as high up as Attorney General Eric Holder.

    Given the fact that Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid is likely to drag his feet in order to protect Attorney General Eric Holder, we believe that hearings should begin in the U.S. House of Representatives.

    Thus, Gun Owners of America is now calling for both the Judiciary Committee and the Committee on Oversight and Reform in the U.S. House of Representatives to initiate hearings into Project Gunrunner -- and presents the following information to help in their investigations.

    History

    “The gun used to kill Agent Brian Terry has been sourced, not to Mexico, but to a gun store in Phoenix that was actually part -- and cooperating -- with a federal investigation into arms trafficking. However, US agents did not stop the sale or the transfer of that gun to the cartels that killed Terry.”
    -- William Lajeunesse, Fox News broadcast (February 22, 2011)

    Around 11:00 pm on the night of December 14, 2010, Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry was shot and mortally wounded near Peck Canyon, Rio Rico, north of Nogales in Santa Cruz County, Arizona, approximately 10 miles north of the U.S.-Mexican border. Agent Terry, aged 40, a Marine Corps veteran and a “cop’s cop,” died shortly afterward. Four suspects were taken into custody, including one who was shot and transported to the hospital.

    Two months after the murder, the U.S. Attorney’s office in Phoenix announced that three of the four, Jesus Soria-Ruiz, Jose Angel-Camacho, and Francisco Rosario Camacho-Alameda would be deported to Mexico after pleading guilty to charges of illegal entry. As of this writing (February 23, 2011), they have been released for deportation.

    Despite being arrested at the scene, it was announced that no evidence tied the three to the shooting of Agent Terry. This is amazing. Should not these illegal aliens be kept in custody as witnesses? At best, they are material witnesses … at worst, they are perpetrators who assisted in the murder of Agent Terry.

    To date no one has been charged with the murder and the FBI has been uncharacteristically tight-lipped about the investigation, except to assure that Terry was not killed by friendly fire from fellow agents. (It is the opinion of many -- not only those here at GOA, but also the whistleblowers -- that because these Mexican citizens have potential knowledge as material witnesses in the case, they should not be deported and, instead, should be kept in protective custody until they can be made available to independent Congressional investigators.)

    Two semi-automatic Kalashnikov-pattern rifles were found at the scene. When traced, it was discovered that these had been purchased from an American gun shop which had been cooperating with agents of the Phoenix office of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (commonly referred to as the ATF) in an investigation of gun smuggling known as Project Gunrunner. It was also learned that these weapons had been traced by the ATF at least once before, and that the agency had extensive knowledge of the person who bought them.

    Almost immediately, rumors began to circulate within the agency that the Phoenix office of ATF had botched the oversight and execution of Project Gunrunner, and that the death of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry was an unintended but foreseeable consequence of poor planning, sloppy field craft and even sloppier management. Such a tragedy, it was said, had even been predicted by some agents beforehand.

    Worse, both street agents and responsible supervisors within the agency had tried to prevent such an outcome and were overruled by higher management. In the case of one, Darren Gil, the ATF attaché in Mexico City who went over the head of Phoenix Special Agent in Charge, William Newell, to ATF headquarters, such fidelity to duty was a career-ending act. Gil was forced into early retirement on December 31, 2010, two and a half weeks after the murder of Brian Terry.

    Gil was removed, at least in part, because he insisted that pursuant to treaty and established protocol, the Mexican government should be notified of the operation. It was not. The decision to remove Darren Gil and keep the Mexican government in the dark was approved, it is said, at least at the highest levels of the Justice Department.

    There are now five separate but connected accusations leveled by current or former employees of the ATF against ATF and DOJ officials in what has been dubbed the “Project Gunwalker“ Scandal:

    First, that they intentionally allowed perhaps as many as 3,000 firearms to "walk" across the U.S. border into Mexico with the purpose of boosting the statistics of seized firearms with American commercial provenance from Mexican crime scenes.

    Second, that they instructed U.S. gun dealers to proceed with questionable and illegal sales of firearms to suspected gunrunners.

    Third, that they intentionally withheld information about U.S.-sanctioned gun smuggling from the Mexican government.

    Fourth, that one of the rifles ATF allowed to be smuggled into Mexico was involved in the death of CBP Agent Brian Terry. (See the link to Grassley’s February 9 letter in the footnotes below.)

    Fifth, that high-level managers of ATF and DOJ are now, in tandem with the FBI, involved in covering up ATF and DOJ culpability in items One through Four, by various means including the unlawful threatening of current-serving ATF agents with personal knowledge of the case.

    Eventually, these charges came to the attention of U.S. Senators Jeff Sessions of Alabama and Chuck Grassley of Iowa through the new media which learned of the existence of potential whistleblowers from its own sources within ATF. The Senators then got in touch with the whistleblowers, so that they could be afforded some protection from the threats of their managers and so that the truth of the circumstances of the death of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry could be discovered.

    The story is starting to get out. As stated on February 22 by William Lajeunesse of Fox News: “The slug that killed Terry came from an AK-47 dropped at the scene. The weapon was traced to a Phoenix gun store, which had reported the sale to ATF's ‘Project Gunrunner.’”

    At present, many other revelations are expected.

    This study will present a background, narrative, condensed timeline and document sources to help Senators and Members of the House of Representatives understand where this scandal came from, what the evidentiary sources are and what legislative remedies may be taken to fully develop the truth, help target oversight and to prevent such a tragedy from happening again. It has been written with input derived from the whistleblowers themselves.

    Background, Narrative and Condensed Timeline

    For many months throughout 2010, the ATF's "Project Gunrunner" initiative was under fire for poor management, exaggerated statistics, etc. The agency was floundering to carry out an agenda that wasn't entirely covered by the law and its managers were stung by poor publicity and especially by an Inspector General's report which Michael Isikoff first reported leaks on last September 21, presaging the official report which was finally made public in November. Isikoff’s story said in part:

    "A major Justice Department program aimed at intercepting the flow of U.S. weapons to Mexico’s drug cartels is misfiring due to bureaucratic turf battles and a failure to share critical intelligence about illegal firearms purchases, according to an internal department report."

    The IG report excoriated ATF’s Project Gunrunner performance. It is now alleged by ATF's own agents that sometime in late 2009 or early 2010, the Phoenix office of ATF began to implement a policy of "walking" semi-automatic rifles south of the border -- at first with a wink and a nod, later, according to one agent:

    “The agency was not only looking the other way but actually facilitating trafficking, threatening and punishing agents who voiced objections, covering up trace information, the truth about the gun that killed BPA Terry, what I.C.E. knew, it goes on and on."

    “Walking” is a time tested way of making a case against a known criminal figure. For example, let’s say that Evil Bad Guy “B” is known to have provided contraband to Criminal Enterprise “C.” Law enforcement then uses a confidential informant or perhaps just a petty criminal known to them and arranges that they convey the contraband from Point “A” to Evil Bad Guy “B,” who then transports it to “C.” “Walking” involves the surveillance by law enforcement of the contraband from “A” all the way through to “C” -- either by eyes on or electronics -- thus establishing a chain of custody and when it arrives, the agents swoop down and roll up the entire ring. The agents literally “walk” the contraband from “A” to “C.”

    In these cases, however, the end destination -- the Point “C” -- was across the border into Mexico, where ATF cannot normally go, and certainly not without the assistance of Mexican law enforcement.

    During this time, it is alleged by an experienced ATF street agent, the ATF deliberately did not inform the Mexican authorities that this was going on:

    "Darren Gil, former attaché to Mexico is an honest and honorable guy. He was forcefully removed from Mexico without warning in November in large part because he wouldn't sit silent on these matters. He will tell the truth if asked by competent authority. He retired Dec 31 because of all this."

    Also during this time, gun stores along the border were calling ATF and reporting multiple sales, only to be told to allow the sales to go through, and in some cases, follow the purchasers out into the parking lot to get license numbers. There are firearms dealers who are willing to come forward and detail their similar experiences to the Congress if asked under oath. They are reluctant to do so without Congressional protection because their livelihoods are at the mercy of ATF regulators, who are known to conduct hostile "inspections" designed to characterize the dealer as a criminal or danger to the community.

    All of this, it is alleged, was done in order to boost the numbers of seized semi-automatic "assault weapons" in Mexico to justify continued, or expanded, Project Gunrunner funding.

    With the death of Agent Terry, the private resistance of the street agents of the ATF in the Phoenix office and elsewhere broke out into the open. An unknown but significant number of ATF agents with personal knowledge and documents of this scandal became willing to tell their story to any Senator who asked them. The first mention of these rumors in a public venue came out in postings by disaffected ATF street agents writing comments at their own website, CleanUpATF.org. The story broke on December 28, 2010.

    Over the next month, Senator Grassley’s office contacted these agents who were willing to speak out, not the other way around as has been reported.

    The contacts with the whistleblowers led to Senator Grassley’s first letter to ATF Acting Director Kenneth Melson on January 27, 2011, laying out the whistleblower‘s allegation and requesting information.

    “On Tuesday, according to press reports, the ATF arrested 17 suspects in a Project Gunrunner bust. William Newell, the Special Agent in Charge of the ATF's Phoenix Field Office was quoted as saying, ‘We strongly believe we took down the entire organization from top to bottom that operated out of the Phoenix area.’ However, if the 17 individuals were merely straw purchasers of whom the ATF had been previously aware before Agent Terry's death, then that raises a host of serious questions that the ATF needs to address immediately.”

    On January 31, 2011, pursuant to reports that the Phoenix ATF management was threatening reprisals against agents who talked about the Terry case, Senator Grassley sent another letter to Acting Director Melson, reminding him strongly of the whistleblower protection laws and that the Congress would decline to appropriate money to pay the salaries of any federal employees who tried to so retaliate.

    On February 4, Assistant Attorney General Ronald Weich sent a reply to Senator Grassley which was both preemptory and insulting to his character. On February 7, an ATF agent writing on CleanUpATF.org proposed a witness list and questions for Senator Grassley.

    In retrospect, the Justice Department surely considered the February 4 letter ill-advised, because on February 9 Senator Grassley fired back a blistering three-page salvo directly to Attorney General Holder with attached documents he obviously obtained from whistleblowers that strongly supported their allegations. Senator Grassley concluded this letter:

    “The Terry family deserves answers. The whistleblowers have expressed a desire to honor Agent Terry’s memory by disclosing this information. The Justice Department should work to do the same. The best way to honor his memory is to come clean.”

    The Senator in his letter again suggested a meeting with ATF. That meeting happened on February 10, and according to an internal ATF source, the briefing was done by James E. McDermond, Assistant Director of ATF’s Office of Strategic Intelligence and Information. McDermond was quoted as saying he thought the meeting went well.

    On February 16, Senator Grassley disabused the ATF, the FBI, Customs and Border Patrol and the Department of Justice of that optimistic notion with a detailed, two-page demand to AG Eric Holder for specific documents in the “Project Gunwalker” Scandal.

    It has been over two months since Agent Terry’s death and the complete outline of this scandal has yet to be discovered. What we do not know, and what should be a priority of legislative inquiry, is what happened to the rest of the alleged three thousand “walked” firearms? The ATF whistleblowers have said that there already have been other casualties, including the deaths of Mexican government officials and citizens, who have been identified. The ATF should be compelled by the Congress to disclose who they are so that we may know the entire scope of this scandal, and determine how to help prevent such flawed law enforcement operations in future.


    Government Accountability Office (GAO)

    The relevant committee(s) taking up the inquiry into the “Project Gunwalker” scandal need to request two reports, one from GAO, the other from CRS. The GAO report request should ask for a report on the firearms tracing system; how firearms trace data are collected, indexed, called up/retrieved, reported, what the data represent, how the data can be used, the extent (if any) to which ATF has validated the data, and how ATF has been using or misusing the data. Of course the GAO (like CRS) is not an investigative agency per se but rather does program audits and evaluations, to explain how a program and/or policy is working or not. An objective evaluation of the ATF's firearms tracing system would be relevant to this case, and provide legislative guidance for any changes in the system that may be advisable.

    Congressional Research Service (CRS)

    The Congress routinely relies upon CRS reports to obtain legislative and policy information, and to prepare materials in support of Congressional hearings. CRS previously did a report entitled "Gun Trafficking and the Southwest Border" by Vivian S. Chu, CRS Legislative Attorney and William J. Krouse, dated July 29, 2009.

    Importantly, in November of last year the U.S. Department of Justice Office of the Inspector General Evaluation and Inspections Division released a report titled “Review of ATF’s Project Gunrunner, Evaluation and Inspections Report I-2011-001, November 2010,” which was extremely critical of ATF's performance.

    The November 2010 report determined:

    “ATF has not provided Mexican law enforcement with intelligence it requested on firearms trafficking patterns and trends, including trafficking routes and distribution points where guns are crossing into Mexico.”

    This, of course, is one of the most important allegations of the ATF whistleblowers.

    The Congress should request CRS to update the July 29, 2009 report on Project Gunrunner, which include (1) the major criticisms of Project Gunrunner identified by the Department of Justice Inspector General, as well as the appropriateness of remedies suggested in that report to address shortcomings in Project Gunrunner, and (2) an analysis of the legislative issues which are suggested by Project Gunrunner, such as tracking the multiple sales of rifles by federally licensed firearms dealers.

    Both of these Congressional agencies have a history of providing helpful information in response to Congressional inquiries. Even so, investigative hearings of the immediate “Project Gunwalker” allegations should not be postponed waiting on these GAO and CRS reports.

    Immediate Investigative Hearings

    There is a pressing public need to know what actually happened with Project Gunrunner and the circumstances which led to the death of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry. It may be concluded from Senator Grassley’s letters that they are well-informed by documents and informal testimony from whistleblower witnesses within the agency. The only way that the public can be informed as to the truth is for these agency whistleblowers, other witnesses such as cooperating gun store owners, the accused senior managers and other such persons having knowledge to be called before the Congress and questioned under oath.

    The ATF agent’s list above is a good start, but the following persons may also be profitably questioned to develop a complete understanding of what went wrong with Project Gunrunner, what decisions were taken after the murder of Brian Terry, and what the effects have been of the “walked” firearms on the Mexican side of the border:

    * Adam R. Price and Jeffrey B. Stirling, program managers for Gunrunner at ATF headquarters.

    * Lanny Breuer, Assistant Attorney General of the DOJ Criminal Investigations Division.

    * Eric Holder, Attorney General of the United States

    * Robert Mueller, Director of the FBI

    * Hillary Clinton, Secretary of State

    * Janet Napolitano, Department of Homeland Security

    -----------------------------------------------

    ATF Oversight Hearings

    "We got to figure out a way between you and me. We got to figure out a better way so that we don't take this argument to the Internet or all over the place. . . to Senators and Congressmen, who don't know anything about what we are talking about." -- Sterling Nixon, Chief of Firearms Technology Branch, ATF, to firearms designer and manufacturer Len Savage, Historic Arms, LLC, Franklin, GA, transcript of taped telephone call, on file with DOJ Office of Professional Responsibility.

    For a later date in this Congress, there are several subjects raised by the scandal that should be explored by both the Senate and the House in their oversight capacity.

    The ATF has not had truly serious, critical oversight hearings since 1982. This unaccountability throughout administrations of both parties has led to an arrogance that permeates management at all levels, according to the whistleblowers. They allege that this scandal could have been averted entirely if the ATF senior executive service was not riddled with cronyism, toleration of incompetence, lack of accountability, lack of transparency, failure to adhere to written policies, retaliation against agents trying to do the right thing, and so on.

    In addition, both the street agents and outside observers identify the Chief Counsel’s Office as the center of many of the agency’s problems. The CCO has used its considerable powers to retaliate against dissident agents and citizen critics alike. It has, according to the agents, misused the EEOC enforcement process against what the CCO views as “malcontents.” Outside the agency, the CCO is alleged (with considerable evidence) to have pursued “economic Wacos” (an internal ATF term) against those within the ATF’s regulatory power such as FFL holders, firearm designers, etc., who anger someone in the agency.

    Inter-Agency and Foreign Relations Implications

    Hearings exploring the diplomatic implications of American federal law enforcement agency misconduct as exemplified by “Project Gunwalker” and how the various agencies interact to help or harm the safety of citizens of both countries on each side of the border could become a stepping stone to fix some of those problems. Gunwalker brings into prominence the problems when one agency decides to make its own foreign policy, independent of and contrary to, the will of the Senate, the House and the people.

    The extent to which the ATF and DOJ executives in the Gunwalker scandal broke American and Mexican laws -- as well as diplomatic accords and even treaties by unilaterally deciding to abrogate them -- could provide guidance for stronger laws, better training, and for effective inter-agency and international communication.

    Conclusion

    The members of Gun Owners of America -- and the whistleblowers who first risked all to get the story of this scandal out -- believe that there is a pressing public need to know what actually happened with Project Gunrunner and the circumstances which led to the death of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry. We believe that there should be immediate investigative hearings in both Senate and House followed by oversight hearings to shine a bright light on the endemic problems of the ATF which led to this scandal.

    However, since Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid is likely to assist in the cover-up, rather than embarrass Attorney General Eric Holder, we believe that hearings should begin in the U.S. House of Representatives.

    We also believe with Senator Grassley that the best way to honor Brian Terry’s memory is for the ATF and the Department of Justice “to come clean.” We believe that this will only happen when all the parties involved are put under oath in a hearing room on Capitol Hill.

    -----------------------------------------------



    Important Source Documents for “Project Gunwalker”


    David Codrea’s Comprehensive Guide to “Project Gunwalker”

    Can be found here: http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-i...ject-gunwalker


    Background:

    Michael Isikoff’s story of 21 September 2010 can be found here: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39282887...me_and_courts/

    The November 2010 U.S. Department of Justice Office of Inspector General report, "Review of ATF's Project Gunrunner" which excoriates ATF performance can be found here: http://www.justice.gov/oig/reports/ATF/e1101.pdf


    Sources of Mexican crime trace weapons and the “90 Percent Myth”

    Mexico's Gun Supply and the 90 Percent Myth by Scott Stewart, Stratfor Intelligence Report, http://www.stratfor.com/weekly/20110...0-percent-myth

    Wikileaks cables on military ordnance in cartel hands in Mexico: http://www.wikileaks.ch/cable/2009/0...TERREY100.html


    Carter’s Country as example of ATF requests to gun dealers:

    The 12 December Washington Post article is here: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...121202663.html

    The 13 December Post follow-up with some of Deguerin’s remarks is here: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...121305395.html

    Also on 13 December the local Houston FOX affiliate ran video with more Deguerin quotes: http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/news...an-gun-runners


    Fast and Furious Indictments referred to in the Open Source Analysis

    US v. Avila et al.:
    http://www.justice.gov/usao/az/press...Indictment.pdf

    US v. Flores et al.: http://www.justice.gov/usao/az/press...Indictment.pdf

    US v. Broome et al.:
    http://www.justice.gov/usao/az/press...Indictment.pdf

    US v. Aguilar:
    http://www.justice.gov/usao/az/press...Indictment.pdf

    US v. Abarca
    http://www.justice.gov/usao/az/press...Indictment.pdf

    Map of Firearms Recovered in Avilas Investigation
    http://www.justice.gov/usao/az/press...us_Map_ATF.pdf


    Grassley/ATF/DOJ Letters:

    27 December, Grassley to Melson: http://www.scribd.com/doc/47909152/ATF1-1
    31 December, Grassley to Melson: http://www.scribd.com/doc/47909228/ATF2
    4 February, Weich to Grassley: http://www.scribd.com/doc/48448953/atf-2
    9 February, Grassley to Holder: http://www.scribd.com/doc/48549160/RosettaStone
    16 February, Grassley to Holder, et.al.: http://judiciary.senate.gov/resource...eyToHolder.pdf



    Materials Sent To Capitol Hill
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  13. #13
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    NRA wants an investigation.

    More and more hunting and gun rights groups are demanding action on project gun runner.

    http://www.fieldandstream.com/forums...drags-his-feet

    http://www.sofmag.com/nra-ila-execut...gative-tactics

    NRA-ILA Executive Director Chris W. Cox Calls for Expedited Hearings into BATFE Investigative Tactics
    By SOF Editor
    Created 03/12/2011 - 15:52
    By SOF Editor on Sat, 03/12/2011 - 3:52pm

    * Gun Rights [1]

    On March 9, NRA-ILA Executive Director Chris W. Cox sent letters to key leaders in Congress calling for hearings to examine the firearms trafficking investigations tactics employed by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives. Those tactics have allegedly allowed firearms to fall into the hands of Mexican criminal organizations, with the knowledge of the BATFE.

    In the letters sent to House Judiciary Committee Chairman Lamar Smith (R-Texas) and Ranking Member John Conyers (D-Mich.) and their counterparts in the U.S. Senate, Chairman Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.) and Ranking Member Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa), Cox wrote that the BATFE project “reportedly allowed over 2,000 firearms to be sold to individuals already linked to Mexican drug cartels. Many of those transactions were reported as suspicious by the licensed firearms dealers themselves, but BATFE reportedly encouraged them to proceed with these sales, which the dealers would otherwise have turned down.”
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  14. #14
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Mexico requests info from U.S. on BATF gun-running

    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_16...05-503543.html


    Last Updated 3:41 p.m. ET

    Mexico's Ministry of Foreign Affairs is asking the U.S. government for details about ATF's "Fast and Furious" operations.

    As our CBS News Investigation has revealed, "Fast and Furious" was a secret program under which, sources say, ATF purposely allowed thousands of assault rifles and other weapons from the U.S. into the hands of drug cartels in Mexico. Insiders call it letting the guns "walk."

    The idea was to supposedly see where the guns ended up and use the information to take down a major cartel.

    ATF sources tell CBS News that Mexican officials were intentionally kept in the dark for fear that they would jeopardize the controversial program. The strategy drew fierce criticism from federal agents ordered to employ it, including John Dodson. Dodson told CBS News that that letting guns "walk" endangered too many lives.

    Now, according to the statement, posted online by Mexico's Ministry of Foreign Affairs (in Spanish), the Mexican government has requested detailed information about the "Fast and Furious" operation being conducted by the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF), and the U.S. Department of Justice.

    The statement also reinforced the bilateral efforts of the United States and Mexico to stop arms smuggling, as endorsed by President Felipe Calderon and President Barack Obama on Thursday during Calderon's visit to Washington, D.C.

    Documents show that ATF-walked guns began turning up at many violent crime scenes in Mexico from the start. Two of them - AK-47 variant semi-automatic assault rifles - were found at the murder scene of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry on December 14, 2010.

    After CBS News reported on the alleged gun walking, ATF announced it will review its anti-trafficking strategies. The Department of Justice has asked its Inspector General to look into the matter.

    The controversy has hit headlines in Mexico and in Europe.

    Despite the international nature of the controversy, White House Chief of Staff William Daley today told us he wasn't really familiar with it. "To be honest with you, I didn't see the report, so I'll have to say no comment until I get some understanding on that. I don't have any information on that," he said.

    Agent: I was ordered to let U.S. guns into Mexico
    ATF memo after CBS report: We need positive press
    "Gun runner" scandal allegedly connected to agent's death (Video)
    ATF agent explains why he let guns "walk" (Video)
    Gunrunning scandal uncovered at the ATF
    Copy of indictment (PDF)

    http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/AV...in;contentBody
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  15. #15
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    http://www.ccrkba.org/?p=2515

    CCRKBA URGES INQUIRY INTO ATF’S ‘PROJECT GUNRUNNER’
    Friday, February 11th, 2011

    BELLEVUE, WA – The Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms is urging its members to contact the Senate and demand a full and open inquiry into a controversial gun trafficking sting operation by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives that may be linked to the December slaying of a federal peace officer.

    After Customs and Border Protection Agent Brian Terry was killed in a shootout two months ago, two of the guns recovered at the crime scene were traced to a sale that was part of the ATF’s “Project Gunrunner” investigation. U.S. Sen. Charles Grassley (R-IA), ranking Republican on the Senate Judiciary Committee, has asked the ATF about this case, and has been met by bureau stonewalling. In a letter to Attorney General Eric Holder this week, Sen. Grassley said it is time to “come clean” about this operation.

    “For two years,” said CCRKBA Chairman Alan Gottlieb, “we’ve been hearing from Holder and others in the Obama administration about a so-called ‘iron pipeline’ of American guns across the border. Only after the recent arrests in Arizona did we learn, through court documents, that hundreds of guns were allowed to be purchased by alleged straw buyers, while ATF conducted its investigation. Now, according to various news reports, two of those guns showed up at a crime scene where a federal officer lost his life. What is going on here?

    “CCRKBA applauds Sen. Grassley’s persistence in trying to get at the truth,” he continued. “We are asking our members to call their Senators and encourage them to support Grassley’s inquiry effort, and press for a full Senate investigation.

    “We also want to know if ATF officials tried to retaliate against agency whistleblowers who have cooperated with Grassley’s office,” Gottlieb added, “and we are delighted that the senator is pushing forward.”

    “Wouldn’t it be ironic,” he observed, “to learn that while the Obama administration was blaming our gun rights for the drug war violence in Mexico, its own gun sting operation was a major source of illicit firearms?”

    Call the U.S. Capitol Switchboard at (202) 224-3121.

    With more than 650,000 members and supporters nationwide, the Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms is one of the nation’s premier gun rights organizations. As a non-profit organization, the Citizens Committee is dedicated to preserving firearms freedoms through active lobbying of elected officials and facilitating grass-roots organization of gun rights activists in local communities throughout the United States. The Citizens Committee can be reached by phone at (425) 454-4911, on the Internet at www.ccrkba.org or by email to InformationRequest@ccrkba.org.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  16. #16
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    With due respect to honest people at the ATF, and full disrespect to all the sleaze bags I hope are about to get nailed,
    i respect no one who works for that useless agency that exists solely to trample on the constitution. the ATF needs to be shut down.
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  17. #17
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    imo: both the BATFE and the FBI should both be disbanded, along with
    Personal Income Tax Division of the IRS
    National Endowment for the Arts (Can't sell your art privately?)
    National Wild Horse and Burro Program (Huh?)
    Dept. of Education
    Dept of Energy
    FEMA (a corrupt organization if there ever was one--leave it to charities)
    FDIC (a sham program with only a fraction of funds needed to save banks)
    Freddy Mac & Fannie Mae (helped cause present economic conditions)
    Administration on Aging (AoA)
    Administration for Children and Families (ACF)
    Administration on Developmental Disabilities (ADD)
    Administration for Native Americans (ANA)
    Children's Bureau (CB)
    Family and Youth Services Bureau (FYSB)
    Head Start Bureau (HSB)
    Healthy Marriage Initiative (HMI)
    Low Income Home Energy Assistance Program (LIHEAP)
    Office of Child Support Enforcement (OCSE)
    Office of Community Services Block Grant (OCS)
    Office of Family Assistance (OFA)
    Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF)
    Office of Refugee Resettlement (ORR)
    President's Committee for People with Intellectual Disabilities (PCPID)
    Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality (AHRQ)
    Agency for Toxic Substances and Disease Registry (ATSDR)
    Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services (CMS)
    Health Resources and Services Administration (HRSA)
    Indian Health Service (IHS)
    National Institutes of Health (NIH)
    Office for Civil Rights (OCR)
    Office of Minority Health (OMH)
    Program Support Center (PSC)
    Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Admin.(SAMHSA)
    Office of the National Coordinator for Health Information Technology (ONCHIT)
    Center for Faith-Based and Community Initiatives (CFBCI)
    Employees' Compensation Appeals Board (ECAB)
    Employment Standards Administration (ESA)
    The Office of Labor-Management Standards (OLMS)
    Office of Workers' Compensation Programs (OWCP)
    Wage and Hour Division (WHD)
    Employment and Training Administration (ETA)
    Employee Benefits Security Administration (EBSA)
    Women's Bureau (WB)
    Job Corps
    Bureau of East Asian and Pacific Affairs
    Bureau of Economic and Business Affairs
    Bureau of Educational and Cultural Affairs
    Internet Access and Training Program
    Bureau of European and Eurasian Affairs
    Bureau of Human Resources
    Bureau of Information Resource Management
    Bureau of Intelligence and Research
    Bureau for International Narcotics and Law Enforcement Affairs
    Bureau of International Organization Affairs
    Bureau of International Security and Nonproliferation
    Bureau of Legislative Affairs
    Bureau of Near Eastern Affairs
    Bureau of Oceans and International Environmental and Scientific Affairs
    Bureau of Overseas Buildings Operations
    Bureau of Political-Military Affairs
    Bureau of Population, Refugees, and Migration
    Bureau of Public Affairs
    Bureau of Resource Management
    Bureau of South Asian Affairs
    Bureau of Verification, Compliance, and Implementation
    Bureau of Western Hemisphere Affairs
    Counterterrorism Office (which produces the Patterns of Global Terrorism report)
    National Foreign Affairs Training Center (former Foreign Service Institute)
    Office of International Information Programs
    Office of the Legal Adviser
    Office of Management Policy
    Office of Protocol
    Office of the Science and Technology Adviser
    Office to Monitor and Combat Trafficking in Persons
    Office of War Crimes Issues (They blew the Bush war crimes)
    Car Allowance Rebate System (Cash for Clunkers)
    Cash for Appliances Program
    Bureau of the Public Debt
    Community Development Financial Institution Fund (CDFI)
    FHA
    HUD
    National health and insurance system
    African Development Foundation
    Advisory Council on Historic Preservation (ACHP)
    Agency for International Development (USAID)
    American Battle Monuments Commission (ABMC)
    Appalachian Regional Commission (ARC)
    U.S. Arctic Research Commission (USARC)
    Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) (EVIL WAR-MONGERS)
    US Commission on Civil Rights (USCCR)
    Commission on Security and Cooperation in Europe (CSCE)
    Corporation for National and Community Service (CNCS)
    Court Services and Offender Supervision Agency (CSOSA)
    Delaware River Basin Commission (DRBC)
    Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC)
    Export-Import Bank of the United States (ExIm)
    Farm Credit Administration (FCA)
    Federal Communications Commission (FCC)
    Federal Election Commission (FEC)
    Federal Maritime Commission
    Federal Mine Safety & Health Review Commission (FMSHRC)
    Federal Reserve System (a pseudo government, semi-private organization)
    Federal Retirement Thrift Investment Board
    Federal Trade Commission (FTC)
    Foreign Claims Settlement Commission of the United States (FCSC)
    General Services Administration (GSA)
    Institute of Museum and Library Services (IMLS)
    Inter-American Foundation (IAF)
    International Trade Commission (ITC)
    Learn and Serve America (LSA)
    National Capital Planning Commission (NCPC)
    National Credit Union Administration (NCUA)
    National Endowment for the Humanities (NEH)
    National Ice Center (NIC)
    National Labor Relations Board (NLRB)
    National Railroad Passenger Corporation (Amtrak) (NRPC)
    National Science Foundation (NSF)
    National Transportation Research Center (NTRC)
    Office of Government Ethics (OGE)(LOT OF GOOD THEY DO)
    Office of Personnel Management (OPM)
    Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation (PBGC)
    Selective Service System (SSS)
    Senior Corps
    Small Business Administration (SBA)
    Susquehanna River Basin Commission (SRBC)
    Tennessee Valley Authority (TVA)
    United States Trade and Development Agency (TDA)
    Financial crisis inquiry commission
    Administrative Committee of the Federal Register
    American Battle Monuments Commission
    Appalachian Regional Commission
    Architectural and Transportation Barriers Compliance Board (Access Board)
    Arctic Research Commission
    Arthritis and Musculoskeletal Interagency Coordinating Committee
    Barry M. Goldwater Scholarship and Excellence in Education Foundation
    Broadcasting Board of Governors
    Chemical Safety and Hazard Investigation Board
    Chief Acquisition Officers Council
    Chief Financial Officers Council
    Chief Human Capital Officers Council
    Chief Information Officers Council
    Citizens' Stamp Advisory Committee
    Commission of Fine Arts
    Commission on International Religious Freedom
    Commission on Security and Cooperation in Europe (Helsinki Commission)
    Commission on the Intelligence Capabilities of the United States
    Commission on the Intelligence Capabilities of the United States Regarding Weapons of Mass Destruction
    Committee for Purchase from People Who Are Blind or Severely Disabled
    Committee for the Implementation of Textile Agreements
    Committee on Foreign Investments in the United States
    Coordinating Council on Juvenile Justice and Delinquency Prevention
    Delaware River Basin Commission
    Denali Commission
    Endangered Species Committee
    Federal Accounting Standards Advisory Board
    Federal Advisory Committees
    Federal Executive Boards
    Federal Financial Institutions Examination Council
    Federal Financing Bank
    Federal Geographic Data Committee
    Federal Interagency Committee for the Management of Noxious and Exotic Weeds (GOTTA LOVE THAT ONE!)
    Federal Interagency Committee on Education
    Federal Interagency Council on Statistical Policy
    Federal Laboratory Consortium for Technology Transfer
    Federal Library and Information Center Committee
    Harry S. Truman Scholarship Foundation
    Illinois and Michigan Canal National Heritage Corridor Commission
    Indian Arts and Crafts Board
    Interagency Alternative Dispute Resolution Working Group
    Interagency Council on Homelessness
    Interstate Commission on the Potomac River Basin
    J. William Fulbright Foreign Scholarship Board
    James Madison Memorial Fellowship Foundation
    Japan-United States Friendship Commission
    Joint Board for the Enrollment of Actuaries
    Joint Fire Science Program
    Marine Mammal Commission
    Migratory Bird Conservation Commission
    Millennium Challenge Corporation
    Mississippi River Commission
    Morris K. Udall Foundation: Scholarship and Excellence in National Environmental Policy
    National Bipartisan Commission on the Future of Medicare
    National Indian Gaming Commission
    National Park Foundation
    Northwest Power Planning Council
    Nuclear Regulatory Commission
    Nuclear Waste Technical Review Board
    Presidio Trust
    Regulatory Information Service Center
    Social Security Advisory Board
    Susquehanna River Basin Commission
    Taxpayer Advocacy Panel
    United States Holocaust Memorial Museum
    Veterans Day National Committee
    Vietnam Educational Foundation
    White House Commission on Presidential Scholars – "Presidential Scholars Program"
    White House Commission on the National Moment of Remembrance

    SOCIAL SECURITY SYSTEM (Pay back-with interest to all who want to opt out, but continue to fund those in or near retirement). THIS COULD BE DONE WITH MONEY PRESENTLY USED TO INVADE AND OCCUPY FOREIGN LANDS.

    AGAIN...ANY WONDER WHY WE'RE BROKE???
    Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.
    --George Washington

    first rule of open carry, know your laws. second rule of open carry, never ask permission. third rule of open carry, rule number one supersedes rule number two

  18. #18
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    hehe, nice list. looks like someone has been reading the 10th amendment.
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  19. #19
    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smellslikemichigan View Post
    i respect no one who works for that useless agency that exists solely to trample on the constitution. the ATF needs to be shut down.
    Come on now you can't blame an individual if he personally feels that he wants to fallow a career in law enforcement. Then decides that he wants to focus in on, enforcement on Tobacco, or Alcohol, or Explosives/bombs. And the best way to further your career, make the most money, to get the best benefits, to have better hours, so on and so on and so on. Is to go up the chain, so that usually ends with a job in the ATF. So if someone wants this kind of career and the best kind of life for himself and his family, he deserves no respect? Even if he has nothing to do with the firearm aspect of the agency, or even if he has no part of making any policy. He is just doing a job, to support his family, doing something that is his passion, and he personally is doing nothing wrong, but because his employer is the BATFE, (which is were he will make the most), he deserves no respect?

    We are all open to our own opinions, I am just having a hard time wrapping my head around this. Its okay though. God Bless.
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
    Luke 22:36
    God Bless

  20. #20
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    I have to agree with that. Personally though, no disrespect to its employees, the BATFE should be dissolved. There is no reason to regulate alcohol, tobacco, firearms, or explosives.

  21. #21
    Regular Member HandyHamlet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eastmeyers View Post
    So if someone wants this kind of career and the best kind of life for himself and his family, he deserves no respect?
    Not if they get in bed with the devil to do it.
    "Don't interfere with anything in the Constitution. That must be maintained, for it is the only safeguard of our liberties."
    Abraham Lincoln

    "Some time ago, a bunch of lefties defied the law by dancing at the Jefferson Memorial, resulting in their arrests. Last week, a bunch of them pulled the same stunt and - using patented Lefist techniques - provoked the Park Police into having to use force to arrest them."
    Alexcabbie

  22. #22
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    Is Obama signaling that someone will be tossed under the bus?



    In an interview last night with reporter Jorge Ramos of Mexico’s Univision network, President Barack Obama not only denied prior knowledge of “Project Gunrunner,” he also indicated that someone will be “held accountable” for what has turned into a major scandal that is already producing collateral diplomatic damage.


    http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-i...-under-the-bus

  23. #23
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HandyHamlet View Post
    Not if they get in bed with the devil to do it.
    you got that right, it seems ridiculous to say, "i may be a thug enforcing the will of tyrants on an unwilling people, but at least i'm payed well." that goes doubly for the TSA too.
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  24. #24
    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    For those who have worked or still work in Law Enforcement it is well known and well discussed that the BATFE is the lowest of the low in Law Enforcement. Over the last 30 plus years I have heard many conversations and comments from Law Enforcement about the low life working in the ATF/BATFE and jack booted thugs is only one of the many earned names the BATFE has been called, lest we forget NAZI's that so many in Law Enforcement call them. No this is rarely said in public to avoid one being persecuted by the upper brass on the behalf of the FEDS, but trust this even as late as this week it has been discussed.

    Many who can NOT make the grade in local state or other Federal agencies get swooped up by the BATFE .

    The ATF/BATFE has a long rich history of abuses that NO other Law Enforcement agency can match. I will never call the ATF/BATFE a Law Enforcement agency or professional as they prove otherwise on a daily basis.

    http://www.atfabuse.com/

    http://armedandsafe.blogspot.com/200...continues.html

    http://www.firearmscoalition.org/ind...newest&lang=en


    Quote Originally Posted by eastmeyers View Post
    Come on now you can't blame an individual if he personally feels that he wants to fallow a career in law enforcement. Then decides that he wants to focus in on, enforcement on Tobacco, or Alcohol, or Explosives/bombs. And the best way to further your career, make the most money, to get the best benefits, to have better hours, so on and so on and so on. Is to go up the chain, so that usually ends with a job in the ATF. So if someone wants this kind of career and the best kind of life for himself and his family, he deserves no respect? Even if he has nothing to do with the firearm aspect of the agency, or even if he has no part of making any policy. He is just doing a job, to support his family, doing something that is his passion, and he personally is doing nothing wrong, but because his employer is the BATFE, (which is were he will make the most), he deserves no respect?

    We are all open to our own opinions, I am just having a hard time wrapping my head around this. Its okay though. God Bless.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by smellslikemichigan View Post
    hehe, nice list. looks like someone has been reading the 10th amendment.
    what can i say i love the constitution, and getting rid of all of those agencies is just step one in restoring our republic.
    Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.
    --George Washington

    first rule of open carry, know your laws. second rule of open carry, never ask permission. third rule of open carry, rule number one supersedes rule number two

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