Chesterfield Man arrested for open carrying NEAR a school

SicSemperTyrannis · Mar 18, 2011

WWBT-12 just had a confusing story about a Chesterfield man arrested today for open carrying a handgun near a school. The charge was carrying on school property, but the story clearly stated he was "near" the school while walking near his house and that the police said "he was close enough that we could charge him". What does that mean? I have no idea what to make of this. The story did state that Chesterfield police said there was no malicious intent and no one was ever in any danger. His sister-in-law was interviewed and she was quite calm and articulate. As soon as I find a link to the actual story, I'll post it. I'm sure there is more to this and I'm not claiming to have any facts other than the few (confusing) facts in the story.

doug23838 · Mar 18, 2011

I saw that story and thought " What the..."
Arrested NEAR a school and he was "close enough they could charge him with possession ON school property"

We need more details and the public needs to be desensitized to OC.

Tess · Mar 18, 2011

QUESTION ONLY --

Is it possible he was within 1000' and not in possession of a concealed handgun permit?

Shoddy reporting, but the only circumstance I can think of that would generate a report like this.

SicSemperTyrannis · Mar 18, 2011

Yes

Tess said:
QUESTION ONLY --

Is it possible he was within 1000' and not in possession of a concealed handgun permit?

Shoddy reporting, but the only circumstance I can think of that would generate a report like this.

YES - they said said he was very near the school and his sister-in-law said he had taken a concealed handgun class and had applied for his permit but did not yet have a CHP issued.

t33j · Mar 18, 2011

Well maybe we'll see version 2 of the GFSZA tested. Doubt it though.

I'd be interested in the specifics. I open carry on a sidewalk bordering an elementary school nearly every day. The last 3 places at which I've resided have been within 1000' feet of a school.

johnfenter · Mar 18, 2011

Has to be a Federal charge...

If he wasn't on school property, then he didn't violate 18.2-308.1. There's no other Virginia statute about this, so the ONLY thing he could have been jacked up for was the Federal GFSZA. Does the story say he was turned over to the Feds for processing?

MSC 45ACP · Mar 18, 2011

To be charged with the GFSZA, Does he have to be charged by a FED LEO or just brought before a FED magistrate by a local or state LEO?

skidmark · Mar 18, 2011

MSC 45ACP said:
To be charged with the GFSZA, Does he have to be charged by a FED LEO or just brought before a FED magistrate by a local or state LEO?

Generally speaking, local LEA does not have jurisdiction to enforce federal law, although they can/may detain one and then turn them over to the feds. The reason this can be a cloudy issue is because so many LEAs have so many cooperative agreements and mutual task force memberships with the feds in which they are "authorized" to act on laws at multiple levels.

Unfortunately, unless someone does the legwork to dig out the paperwork we may never know the status of his arrest charge (local, state, or federal violation).

stay safe.

Thundar · Mar 18, 2011

Calling VCDL, Calling VCDL

Well, if the news report is accurate, somebody is about to get an education. It would be great low hanging fruit for SAF if there was an actual federal charge brought for being within 1000' of a school. No Commonwealth crime if not at school.

Something interesting to watch.

TraumaRN · Mar 18, 2011

http://www.nbc12.com/Global/story.asp?S=14280804

Hope one of the 2A lawyers gets to him and helps him out, maybe look into whether his ethnicity played into it as well.

curtiswr · Mar 18, 2011

Is this the first (known) incident of someone not already in the commission of another crime being charged for being within 1000' of a school while carrying, without the 'protection' of a CHP in the state?

Grapeshot · Mar 18, 2011

TraumaRN said:
http://www.nbc12.com/Global/story.asp?S=14280804

WTF - amending/making up laws as they go along?

"Police say Alkabily was not on the school campus but close enough to the school that the department could charge him with possessing a firearm while on school property."

Grapeshot · Mar 18, 2011

Curtis said:
Is this the first (known) incident of someone not already in the commission of another crime being charged for being within 1000' of a school while carrying, without the 'protection' of a CHP in the state?

Nope - we have a twofer - both the same date.

http://www.thefranklinnewspost.com/article.cfm?ID=18635

Riana · Mar 19, 2011

Grapeshot said:
WTF - amending/making up laws as they go along?

"Police say Alkabily was not on the school campus but close enough to the school that the department could charge him with possessing a firearm while on school property."

I was thinking the same thing - they intend to charge him for doing something they admit he's not doing? I'd like to see how that works.

That said, this is exactly why when walking the neighborhood, I don't walk on the sidewalk directly in front of the school - I cross the street.

jmelvin · Mar 19, 2011

With this old timer and the youngster across from the school if the feds do not press the issue (and for the sake of these folks I hope they don't) it will become even more apparent that the only purpose of the GFSZA is to provide a big threat against those who want to follow the law while meaning nothing to those who willingly break it with intent to cause harm.

VCDL President · Mar 19, 2011

I'm passing this thread on to John Fenter. He's heading up VCDL's efforts to fix or repeal the GFSZA.

Dreamer · Mar 19, 2011

So if a cop sees me smoking a hand-rolled tobacco cigarette, can he arrest me for possession of marijuana--because it was "close enough" to looking like a joint?

WTF?

skidmark · Mar 19, 2011

Dreamer said:
So if a cop sees me smoking a hand-rolled tobacco cigarette, can he arrest me for possession of marijuana--because it was "close enough" to looking like a joint?

WTF?

Well, actually, yes he can. Looking like a joint is RAS enough for the arrest.

The better question is: can you be convicted because it was "close enough"?

The cops who arrested the young man who was not on school property but "close enough" ought to be found not to have had RAS -- but the probability of that may be slim.

stay safe.

Mike · Mar 19, 2011

skidmark said:
Well, actually, yes he can. Looking like a joint is RAS enough for the arrest.

Reasonable articulable suspicion is the standard to temproarily seize a person, not to arrest her.

paramedic70002 · Mar 19, 2011

Riana said:
I was thinking the same thing - they intend to charge him for doing something they admit he's not doing? I'd like to see how that works.

That said, this is exactly why when walking the neighborhood, I don't walk on the sidewalk directly in front of the school - I cross the street.

They will have a revelation of memory that they actually saw him on school property and their reports will be 'amended' - unless there were cameras rolling.

Chesterfield Man arrested for open carrying NEAR a school

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