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Thread: Two Questions: Public Transportation and a Guide

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    Regular Member eBratt's Avatar
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    Two Questions: Public Transportation and a Guide

    I was a near daily OCer back in Washington but due to my employment until recently I was unable to OC in the small community in which I was living. Now that I am back in civilization (Loveland) and working for a reasonable employer, I am looking to start OCing again.

    First, in browsing the FAQs at RMGO, I came across this tidbit:
    18-9-118. Firearms, explosives, or incendiary devices in facilities of public transportation.

    A person commits a class 6 felony if, without legal authority, he has any loaded firearm or explosive or incendiary device, as defined in section 9-7-103, C.R.S., in his possession in, or carries, brings, or causes to be carried or brought any of such items into, any facility of public transportation, as defined in section 18-9-115 (4).

    18-9-115. Endangering public transportation.
    (4) "Facility of public transportation" includes a public conveyance and any area, structure, or device which is designed, adapted, and used to support, guide, control, permit, or facilitate the movement, starting, stopping, takeoff, landing, or servicing of a public conveyance or the loading or unloading of passengers or goods.
    I'm looking for some guidance here. Does that mean that you can't take a bus? What about the Park and Go shuttle in the Rocky Mountain National Park?

    Second question, up in Washington a great carry advocate named Dave Workman write a fantastic guide called Washington State Gun Rights and Responsibilities. (http://www.danddgunleather.com/pages...gun_rights.htm) It was an easy to read and very straightforward booklet on how to legally carry. Is there an equivalent here in CO?

    Much thanks to all who read and respond.

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    Here's the definition of public conveyance from 18-9-115 (3):

    "Public conveyance" includes a train, airplane, bus, truck, car, boat, tramway, gondola, lift, elevator, escalator, or other device intended, designed, adapted, and used for the public carriage of persons or property.

    I've always wondered if anyone's been charged for carrying on an escalator.

    You can find the Colorado Revised Statutes at http://www.michie.com/colorado/lpext...main-h.htm&cp=

    I'm not aware of a source other than RMGO's website, but there's a lot of information on this forum if you read a few old threads. Colorado's one of the best states for open carry, if you ignore the City & County of Denver.

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    Regular Member eBratt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamite Rabbit View Post
    Here's the definition of public conveyance from 18-9-115 (3):

    "Public conveyance" includes a train, airplane, bus, truck, car, boat, tramway, gondola, lift, elevator, escalator, or other device intended, designed, adapted, and used for the public carriage of persons or property.
    Wow, that is a huge problem with the law. Essentially, if you are lawfully carrying openly (or concealed for that matter), you are barred from using any public transportation. It would appear that this would also cover shuttles such as the one inside the RMNP. We were up in Estes Park last fall and took a gondola ride on private property up one of the mountains. It would appear that it would have been a felony had I been carrying at all.

    That is very concerning. I was looking at OCing up into RMNP but we will most likely be taking a park shuttle (so apparently I couldn't carry with a permit+concealed or without+open.

    And was the "can I use the bathroom while carrying" question ever resolved?

    Colorado's one of the best states for open carry, if you ignore the City & County of Denver.
    It would appear it is better than most. I probably was just spoiled in Washington as carry was not a criminal offense on college campuses (schools could expel/ban you) and public transportation was 100% fine to carry on open or concealed, with or without a permit.

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    Concealed carry is OK. You could also unload your weapon and be fine. I'm not sure what "legal authority" encompasses, but I don't think this law is applied often.

    As far as I know the Park Service ruled that buildings with Park Service employees working are off-limits to firearms. Separate bathrooms are fine. Posting is required.

    Concealed carry is fine on college campuses in Colorado. I don't remember about open carry.
    Last edited by Dynamite Rabbit; 03-19-2011 at 09:15 AM.

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    Regular Member entartet17's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamite Rabbit View Post
    Concealed carry is fine on college campuses in Colorado. I don't remember about open carry.
    No OC on college campuses. Like you said, CC is fine though most schools ban firearms as a matter of school policy. I know the UCD/MSCD policy was to ask anyone known to be CCing to leave campus or face trespassing charges. Any student caught CCing was subject to disciplinary measures including suspension or expulsion.
    "There are those who still think they are holding the pass against a revolution that may be coming up the road. But they are gazing in the wrong direction. The revolution is behind them. It went by in the Night of Depression, singing songs of freedom" -- Garet Garrett, The Revolution Was (1938)

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    Regular Member JamesB's Avatar
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    To the original question, in regards to 18-9-118:

    In recent memory this statute has only been used once that I am aware of. It was a case of someone impersonating police/security at the Broadway lightrail station. Don't get me wrong I wouldn't test it.
    If you look closely though I believe a concealed permit is an exception to this charge. Meaning that it's not a crime if concealed with valid permit. It has been awhile since I looked that one up though so don't quote me.

    Hopefully, HB 1205 passes and this will soon no longer be an issue we have to deal with.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dynamite Rabbit View Post
    Concealed carry is fine on college campuses in Colorado. I don't remember about open carry.
    What's the latest about CU Boulder?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mahkagari View Post
    What's the latest about CU Boulder?
    CU in general (Boulder, Denver, CS) all basically prohibit, even though the Court of Appeals ruled against them. It is still set to be heard by the Colorado Supreme. I had hoped that 1205 would pass and render that judgement moot, but apparently that's the route that needs to be taken first.

    Meanwhile I suggest enrolling at CSU in Ft. Collins or going to school in Greely. Both of those universities allow concealed with permit without question. (at least thats the last I heard)

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    Quote Originally Posted by JamesB View Post
    Meanwhile I suggest enrolling at CSU in Ft. Collins or going to school in Greely. Both of those universities allow concealed with permit without question. (at least thats the last I heard)
    I'm a bit passed college days, but I have personal business that takes me to Norlin, the UMC, and elsewhere on, through, or near campus enough that it's relevant.

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    It looks like the only thing they can do to a visitor on campus is ban him from the property. And there's a two-part process as well--which they can't even start unless they find out that you're carrying.

    FURTHER RESOLVED that the individual found guilty via a due process procedure of the unauthorized possession of firearms, explosives, or other dangerous or illegal weapons, and who is found to have intentionally or recklessly used or possessed such weapons in a way that would intimidate, harass, injure or otherwise interfere with the learning and working environment of the University, shall be banned from the University campus, leased building, or other area under the control of University campus police. In the case of the University of Colorado at Denver, officials shall make every effort to work with the Auraria Higher Education Commission officials to obtain such ban. This section is not intended to limit the discretion of the University to institute summary suspension proceedings.
    https://www.cu.edu/regents/Policies/Policy14I.htm

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    This was covered sometime in the last twelve months. What I recall is that CC is a defense under the statutes. I never wrote down the reference, though.

    Anyone?
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. Together, they protect the rest of our Bill of Rights and our United States Constitution, and help We the People protect ourselves in the spirit of our Declaration of Independence.

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    Regular Member Half Live's Avatar
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    The only places you can't CC is in CRS 18-12-214


    18-12-214. Authority granted by permit - carrying restrictions.


    (1) (a) A permit to carry a concealed handgun authorizes the permittee to carry a concealed handgun in all areas of the state, except as specifically limited in this section. A permit does not authorize the permittee to use a handgun in a manner that would violate a provision of state law. A local government does not have authority to adopt or enforce an ordinance or resolution that would conflict with any provision of this part 2.

    (b) A peace officer may temporarily disarm a permittee, incident to a lawful stop of the permittee. The peace officer shall return the handgun to the permittee prior to discharging the permittee from the scene.

    (2) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun into a place where the carrying of firearms is prohibited by federal law.

    (3) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun onto the real property, or into any improvements erected thereon, of a public elementary, middle, junior high, or high school; except that:

    (a) A permittee may have a handgun on the real property of the public school so long as the handgun remains in his or her vehicle and, if the permittee is not in the vehicle, the handgun is in a compartment within the vehicle and the vehicle is locked;

    (b) A permittee who is employed or retained by contract by a school district as a school security officer may carry a concealed handgun onto the real property, or into any improvement erected thereon, of a public elementary, middle, junior high, or high school while the permittee is on duty;

    (c) A permittee may carry a concealed handgun on undeveloped real property owned by a school district that is used for hunting or other shooting sports.

    (4) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun into a public building at which:

    (a) Security personnel and electronic weapons screening devices are permanently in place at each entrance to the building;

    (b) Security personnel electronically screen each person who enters the building to determine whether the person is carrying a weapon of any kind; and

    (c) Security personnel require each person who is carrying a weapon of any kind to leave the weapon in possession of security personnel while the person is in the building.

    (5) Nothing in this part 2 shall be construed to limit, restrict, or prohibit in any manner the existing rights of a private property owner, private tenant, private employer, or private business entity.

    (6) The provisions of this section apply to temporary emergency permits issued pursuant to section 18-12-209.
    Last edited by Half Live; 03-28-2011 at 12:51 AM.

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