Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 62

Thread: Do Americans actually think..

  1. #1
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Northville, Michigan
    Posts
    591

    Angry Do Americans actually think..

    Do some people on here actually think that guns are banned in Canada? Ive heard a lot of talk about gun prohibition in the "great white north" and ever since I moved from Canada, back to Michigan, a lot of people seem to assume that they are. Even in MICHIGAN! Which is 5 minutes from the Canadian border, people still ask me all the time if us Canadians are legally allowed to own handguns yet?
    Molon Labe

    [+=] Eleftheria i thanatos [+=]

  2. #2
    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    in front of my computer, WI
    Posts
    4,426
    From all I've read, I think the status of gun ownership in Canada is something like the worst of California, New Jersey, & Chicago mixed together.

    I know they have a registration scheme, and it's been used to steal property from people.

    How 'bout you tell us how it really is, since you've lived through it?
    Quote Originally Posted by MLK, Jr
    The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort & convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge & controversy.
    Quote Originally Posted by MSG Laigaie
    Citizenship is a verb.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proverbs 27:12
    A prudent person foresees the danger ahead and takes precautions.
    The simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proverbs 31:17
    She dresses herself with strength and makes her arms strong.

  3. #3
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    America
    Posts
    2,226
    I thought citizens were banned from keeping arms in any useful manner.

  4. #4
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Northville, Michigan
    Posts
    591
    Canadians can own firearms, rifles and handguns. They can even open carry rifles & shotguns (to and from home/the range). You do need to take a small short class to be able to own a handgun though, and after that you can keep as many guns as you want, in a safe (unloaded) with the ammunition in another locked area around your house.

    You can defend yourself no problem, as long as the gun wasnt loaded before the incident. A man in Quebec shot 2 cops in self defense when they illegally executed a no-knock warrant on his home at 3am, with his 2 kids and wife in the house. He shot the one cop in the head, and the heart, with a 357 at point blank range, and was found innocent of murder charges.

    The gun laws here are not THAT bad, and people can even own, and buy machine guns (If they owned one before the 80's and the machine guns were made before then)

    Occasionally, you may get a conceal carry permit, if you can prove your life is in danger, they will give you a temporary one until you have reason enough to believe you're safe.

    All in all, the gun laws are not horrible, and years ago you could carry anything and own anything no problem, it's just recently that Canada passed some stupid laws about guns, but recently many people have been working hard to get these laws gone, so Canadians can start carrying and keeping loaded guns in the house.

    Plus, with a HUGE amount of our country mostly Forrest and other things, there is a very high amount of hunters here, and many people own rifles, handguns, crossbows, etc.

    People often think we have no guns, because, Canada actually has an extremely low rate of guns used in crimes. (Except Toronto, which is like the Canadian Detroit)
    Molon Labe

    [+=] Eleftheria i thanatos [+=]

  5. #5
    Regular Member Archangel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    OTP, Georgia, USA
    Posts
    231
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixalis View Post
    People often think we have no guns, because, Canada actually has an extremely low rate of guns used in crimes. (Except Toronto, which is like the Canadian Detroit)
    I thought it was just because of the tunnel monster....

    Last edited by Archangel; 03-31-2011 at 01:32 PM. Reason: Added picture

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,797
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixalis View Post
    Canadians can own firearms, rifles and handguns. They can even open carry rifles & shotguns (to and from home/the range). You do need to take a small short class to be able to own a handgun though, and after that you can keep as many guns as you want, in a safe (unloaded) with the ammunition in another locked area around your house.

    You can defend yourself no problem, as long as the gun wasnt loaded before the incident. A man in Quebec shot 2 cops in self defense when they illegally executed a no-knock warrant on his home at 3am, with his 2 kids and wife in the house. He shot the one cop in the head, and the heart, with a 357 at point blank range, and was found innocent of murder charges.

    The gun laws here are not THAT bad, and people can even own, and buy machine guns (If they owned one before the 80's and the machine guns were made before then)

    Occasionally, you may get a conceal carry permit, if you can prove your life is in danger, they will give you a temporary one until you have reason enough to believe you're safe.

    All in all, the gun laws are not horrible, and years ago you could carry anything and own anything no problem, it's just recently that Canada passed some stupid laws about guns, but recently many people have been working hard to get these laws gone, so Canadians can start carrying and keeping loaded guns in the house.

    Plus, with a HUGE amount of our country mostly Forrest and other things, there is a very high amount of hunters here, and many people own rifles, handguns, crossbows, etc.

    People often think we have no guns, because, Canada actually has an extremely low rate of guns used in crimes. (Except Toronto, which is like the Canadian Detroit)
    Uhh that is pretty horrible. Having to keep the ammo locked in a seperate safe than the one that your guns in is stupid. Having to keep your guns unloaded in your house is stupid. These two things basically do their best to make guns useless for home defense without actually banning guns or defending yourself. The fact that a man was able to retrieve his gun from a locked safe, get ammo from a different locked safe, and load the gun all before the cops got to him makes me wonder what the cops were doing.

    And then there's the fact that you're unable to carry a weapon for self-defense. While I know that crime is amazingly low in Canada (compared to places like the US), that doesn't mean one should be outlawed from having the ability to defend theirselves should they be one of the few who are targeted by crime.

    From what I've seen and from what you've posted, Canada is as close to having guns banned and making the use of a gun for self defense prohibited/unreasonable, without actually passing any laws "banning" it. Sure you "can" own them, but you have to jump through several hoops and their lawful use in self defense is even more burdensome.

  7. #7
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    North Chesterfield, Va.
    Posts
    34,627
    IMHO - Canada's gun laws are overly restrictive, outdated and effectively leave the citizenry unable to protect themselves.

    Considering the extreme short time that the average armed confrontation takes, let me know how running to your safe, getting and loading a gun works out for you when faced with an immediate threat ........... especially if you are 15 miles from home.

    I have a number of friends living in Canada - they confirm that condition.

    Please don't waste your time and mine trying to sell taking a long gun to the range as OCing - it isn't and never has been. No amount of spin will change that.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  8. #8
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Northville, Michigan
    Posts
    591
    Yes, I realize the gun laws in Canada are horrible compared to Michigan, and pretty much everywhere else in the US (Except places like Cali and NY) Which is exactly why I moved back to Michigan to join the army and go to the police academy after.

    I would hate to be a Canadian cop or soldier, who wasn't allowed to defend himself or carry a weapon off duty, doesn't sound too fun.
    Molon Labe

    [+=] Eleftheria i thanatos [+=]

  9. #9
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Granite State of Mind
    Posts
    4,510
    Canada's gun laws are probably most like Hawaii's, when it comes to registration, storage, and transport: suckier than most of the U.S., but better than most of Europe.

    The best part of Canadian gun laws is that they're widely ignored, even by police, other than in Montreal, Toronto, Windsor, and Vancouver.

    One of the worst parts is the prohibition on handguns with a barrel shorter than 4.2 inches.

  10. #10
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Northville, Michigan
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by KBCraig View Post
    Canada's gun laws are probably most like Hawaii's, when it comes to registration, storage, and transport: suckier than most of the U.S., but better than most of Europe.

    The best part of Canadian gun laws is that they're widely ignored, even by police, other than in Montreal, Toronto, Windsor, and Vancouver.

    One of the worst parts is the prohibition on handguns with a barrel shorter than 4.2 inches.

    Yes, only people who owned prohibited weapons (machine guns, prohibited handguns) before the ban, may own them now. They can also only trade/buy/sell between eachother. But since they are all older people, every day the amount gets smaller and smaller, and when they all die the weapons will all be destroyed by the police.

    Sucks, I know a guy who has a full auto Thompson and a few handguns with short barrels, unless he sells them all before he ties (Or the canadians change their laws ) they'll be seized and destroyed.
    Molon Labe

    [+=] Eleftheria i thanatos [+=]

  11. #11
    Regular Member Samopal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Northville, MI
    Posts
    66
    Quote Originally Posted by Aknazer View Post
    Uhh that is pretty horrible. Having to keep the ammo locked in a seperate safe than the one that your guns in is stupid.
    Actually that's incorrect. If a firearm is stored in a safe you can store ammunition and loaded magazines next to it, same goes for storage in cabinets.

    Separate storage of ammunition only applies if you keep a rifle or shotgun trigger/cable locked and not in a locking container. So long as they're disabled with said locks you can just store them under your bed, but ammo needs to be in another room or in a locked container.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mixalis View Post
    Yes, I realize the gun laws in Canada are horrible compared to Michigan, and pretty much everywhere else in the US (Except places like Cali and NY)
    Hey, upstate NY's laws aren't bad at all. It's just NYC you need to watch out for.
    Last edited by Samopal; 03-31-2011 at 01:25 AM.

  12. #12
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Northville, Michigan
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by Samopal View Post
    Actually that's incorrect. If a firearm is stored in a safe you can store ammunition and loaded magazines next to it, same goes for storage in cabinets.

    Separate storage of ammunition only applies if you keep a rifle or shotgun trigger/cable locked and not in a locking container. So long as they're disabled with said locks you can just store them under your bed, but ammo needs to be in another room or in a locked container.



    Hey, upstate NY's laws aren't bad at all. It's just NYC you need to watch out for.
    ^ Thank my brother for correcting me. Yeah, upstate NY isn't bad, but everybody in New York City hates their gun laws.
    Molon Labe

    [+=] Eleftheria i thanatos [+=]

  13. #13
    Regular Member protect our rights's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Fort Wayne, Indiana
    Posts
    290
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixalis View Post
    Canadians can own firearms, rifles and handguns. They can even open carry rifles & shotguns (to and from home/the range). You do need to take a small short class to be able to own a handgun though, and after that you can keep as many guns as you want, in a safe (unloaded) with the ammunition in another locked area around your house.

    You can defend yourself no problem, as long as the gun wasnt loaded before the incident. A man in Quebec shot 2 cops in self defense when they illegally executed a no-knock warrant on his home at 3am, with his 2 kids and wife in the house. He shot the one cop in the head, and the heart, with a 357 at point blank range, and was found innocent of murder charges.

    The gun laws here are not THAT bad, and people can even own, and buy machine guns (If they owned one before the 80's and the machine guns were made before then)

    Occasionally, you may get a conceal carry permit, if you can prove your life is in danger, they will give you a temporary one until you have reason enough to believe you're safe.

    All in all, the gun laws are not horrible, and years ago you could carry anything and own anything no problem, it's just recently that Canada passed some stupid laws about guns, but recently many people have been working hard to get these laws gone, so Canadians can start carrying and keeping loaded guns in the house.

    Plus, with a HUGE amount of our country mostly Forrest and other things, there is a very high amount of hunters here, and many people own rifles, handguns, crossbows, etc.

    People often think we have no guns, because, Canada actually has an extremely low rate of guns used in crimes. (Except Toronto, which is like the Canadian Detroit)
    All I can say is THANK GOD you live in America now. A place where people can actually exercise rights. (the ones we have left) I guess you are just soo used to those procedures that you don't realize how impeding they are to the right to protect yourselves. I can't believe that in basically one sentence you said "It's not that bad!... you can keep handguns (in a safe) and the ammunition in another part of the house... Wow. Thanks for reminding us why we fight everyday to keep our rights so we don't end up like our neighbors to the north.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the American people's liberty teeth and keystone under independence ... From the hour the Pilgrims landed, to the present day, events, occurrences, and tendencies prove that to insure peace, security and happiness, the rifle and pistol are equally indispensable . . . The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that is good" - George Washington

  14. #14
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Northville, Michigan
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by protect our rights View Post
    All I can say is THANK GOD you live in America now. A place where people can actually exercise rights. (the ones we have left) I guess you are just soo used to those procedures that you don't realize how impeding they are to the right to protect yourselves. I can't believe that in basically one sentence you said "It's not that bad!... you can keep handguns (in a safe) and the ammunition in another part of the house... Wow. Thanks for reminding us why we fight everyday to keep our rights so we don't end up like our neighbors to the north.
    True, every day that I read about Michigan's gun laws or the laws of other states, I realize how retarded a lot of the Canadian laws are. Apparently there is actually a law in Canada saying that if somebody comes into your home, armed or unarmed, you're legally supposed to attempt to retreat. I don't think anybody has been arrested for not complying with that yet, but then again we don't have many self defense shootings here.
    Molon Labe

    [+=] Eleftheria i thanatos [+=]

  15. #15
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Nashville, Tennessee, United States
    Posts
    592
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixalis View Post
    Yes, I realize the gun laws in Canada are horrible compared to Michigan, and pretty much everywhere else in the US (Except places like Cali and NY) Which is exactly why I moved back to Michigan to join the army and go to the police academy after.

    I would hate to be a Canadian cop or soldier, who wasn't allowed to defend himself or carry a weapon off duty, doesn't sound too fun.
    Unless something has drastically changed in the last 20 years, American soldiers are denied the right of self defense, if they are single, due to onerous restrictions.

    No personal firearms in the barracks, must store firearms in the armory, can't get access to firearm with out the armorer (in my case the armorer was almost never around), had to get permission from the 1st Sgt to obtain firearm, had to return the firearm to the armory on the schedule of the armorer, and on and on.

    I ended up keeping a .22 plinking rifle at a married soldier's off post residence, instead of dealing with the BS.

  16. #16
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Northville, Michigan
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by WCrawford View Post
    Unless something has drastically changed in the last 20 years, American soldiers are denied the right of self defense, if they are single, due to onerous restrictions.

    No personal firearms in the barracks, must store firearms in the armory, can't get access to firearm with out the armorer (in my case the armorer was almost never around), had to get permission from the 1st Sgt to obtain firearm, had to return the firearm to the armory on the schedule of the armorer, and on and on.

    I ended up keeping a .22 plinking rifle at a married soldier's off post residence, instead of dealing with the BS.
    I heard you can get a carry permit to carry on base? I wont be reserves, so I'll most likely live on base. Unless, can you get an apartment off base if you're single? (I know that you get free lodging on base but I'm not sure if living off base is an option)
    Molon Labe

    [+=] Eleftheria i thanatos [+=]

  17. #17
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    64

    Furthermore....

    Some more facts on Canada's draconian gun laws....1. Fully automatic machine guns were outlawed in 1977 (but you could own it if bought before then) 2. Handguns with barrels under 105mm and/or .32 or .25 caliber were outlawed ,IMO, because of that comp. in California that was able to make semi-autos in the $100 range ( Davis Industries I believe ). This comp. was also a favorite scapegoat of the left-liberal media in the U.S. for a brief time. 3. The worst aspect of Canada's gun laws is that you need your spouses written consent when obtaining a gun license.

  18. #18
    Regular Member oldbanger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    beckofbeyond - Idaho
    Posts
    476
    Cop project aims to disarm city
    400 guns seized in bid to keep them out of criminal hands

    They used to be legal firearms, but now they're either unregistered or outright banned, and they're wanted by police before there's a chance burglars put them in Toronto's underground and underworld markets.

    http://www.torontosun.com/news/toron...66131-sun.html

  19. #19
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    America
    Posts
    2,226
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixalis View Post
    Yes, only people who owned prohibited weapons (machine guns, prohibited handguns) before the ban, may own them now. They can also only trade/buy/sell between eachother. But since they are all older people, every day the amount gets smaller and smaller, and when they all die the weapons will all be destroyed by the police.

    Sucks, I know a guy who has a full auto Thompson and a few handguns with short barrels, unless he sells them all before he ties (Or the canadians change their laws ) they'll be seized and destroyed.
    so the arms can not be passed on through a will when someone dies?!

  20. #20
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Northville, Michigan
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by Daylen View Post
    so the arms can not be passed on through a will when someone dies?!
    There are a few prohibited weapons that can be passed down (only some handguns) and not any rifles or machine guns that are prohibited. They can only be passed to family, and that family member will get a Prohibited License for possession ONLY, so they can not buy, sell, or trade those weapons.

    Any prohibited rifles, machine guns, or handguns that can't be passed down, are destroyed or deactivated.
    Molon Labe

    [+=] Eleftheria i thanatos [+=]

  21. #21
    Regular Member protect our rights's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Fort Wayne, Indiana
    Posts
    290
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixalis View Post
    There are a few prohibited weapons that can be passed down (only some handguns) and not any rifles or machine guns that are prohibited. They can only be passed to family, and that family member will get a Prohibited License for possession ONLY, so they can not buy, sell, or trade those weapons.

    Any prohibited rifles, machine guns, or handguns that can't be passed down, are destroyed or deactivated.
    I heard crime is on the rise in urban area up there..... Huh. Wonder why? (scratching head)
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the American people's liberty teeth and keystone under independence ... From the hour the Pilgrims landed, to the present day, events, occurrences, and tendencies prove that to insure peace, security and happiness, the rifle and pistol are equally indispensable . . . The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that is good" - George Washington

  22. #22
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    America
    Posts
    2,226
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixalis View Post
    There are a few prohibited weapons that can be passed down (only some handguns) and not any rifles or machine guns that are prohibited. They can only be passed to family, and that family member will get a Prohibited License for possession ONLY, so they can not buy, sell, or trade those weapons.

    Any prohibited rifles, machine guns, or handguns that can't be passed down, are destroyed or deactivated.
    So do people ever bring them across the boarder and sell it in the US? or do they simply let the arms be destroyed?

  23. #23
    Regular Member protect our rights's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Fort Wayne, Indiana
    Posts
    290
    Quote Originally Posted by Daylen View Post
    So do people ever bring them across the boarder and sell it in the US? or do they simply let the arms be destroyed?
    That would technically be illegal.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the American people's liberty teeth and keystone under independence ... From the hour the Pilgrims landed, to the present day, events, occurrences, and tendencies prove that to insure peace, security and happiness, the rifle and pistol are equally indispensable . . . The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that is good" - George Washington

  24. #24
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Northville, Michigan
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by Daylen View Post
    So do people ever bring them across the boarder and sell it in the US? or do they simply let the arms be destroyed?
    Somebody I went to high school with smuggled over 200 guns across the border with his sister. They're both in prison.

    Legally, if you have the right paperwork you can transfer guns to the USA (not 100% sure). But, I don't think you can transfer prohibited weapons to the USA, and I know you can't bring them into Canada.

    Everything is registered, especially prohibited, and legally the cops can come into your house ANYTIME they want, without notice, to check and make sure your weapons are locked up and not loaded. So..If you did sell a gun to somebody in the USA, I doubt they would just let go of the fact one of your prohibited firearms were missing.
    Molon Labe

    [+=] Eleftheria i thanatos [+=]

  25. #25
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,797
    Quote Originally Posted by Samopal View Post
    Actually that's incorrect. If a firearm is stored in a safe you can store ammunition and loaded magazines next to it, same goes for storage in cabinets.

    Separate storage of ammunition only applies if you keep a rifle or shotgun trigger/cable locked and not in a locking container. So long as they're disabled with said locks you can just store them under your bed, but ammo needs to be in another room or in a locked container.
    Ahh, that would allow one to more quickly respond, but still requires them to keep their safe in their room and still prevents them from being able to defend theirself when not at home (or should someone break in when they aren't close to the safe). And to me that would still be pretty bad as it still greatly restricts one's ability to defend theirself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mixalis View Post
    I heard you can get a carry permit to carry on base? I wont be reserves, so I'll most likely live on base. Unless, can you get an apartment off base if you're single? (I know that you get free lodging on base but I'm not sure if living off base is an option)
    You can't get a carry permit to carry on base. Even security forces and OSI can't carry while on base unless they are on duty and the gun was issued to them from the armory (at which point they have to turn in the gun once their shift ends).

    As for storage, it depends on your service. I've heard of Army/Marine barracks having their own mini-armory at the actual barracks for weapons (dunno if all of them have this though), while in the AF (and I would assume the Navy as well) you have to use the base armory. Firearms are not allowed to be stored in the barracks or at the base hotel (I had the cops called on me for that one when I simply asked the hotel manager their policy, but that's another story...). If you live in actual base housing then you can store the weapons at your house, but there's requirements for doing so. In addition, any weapon stored on base (whether at the armory or in on-base housing) requires paperwork. I can't speak for other services (though I assume it's very similar if not the same), but in the AF the paperwork has various info about the weapons and must be signed by your commander specially stating where the weapons are being stored.

    For your final question. Each base and service is different in regards to when one can move out of the dorms. You would need to get to your base and ask the question to your leadership, but in the AF you generally have to be at least a Senior Airman (E-4) before being able to move off base when single (or married, but don't get married to move off base as people do get kicked out for doing that). Oh and once you get to the point to be able to move out of the dorms know that if you decide you want to try and live in base housing there's generally a waiting list (but again this is base dependent and the length of the list varies from each base).

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •