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Thread: New..need help. what are the laws regarding oc in Ohio?

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    New..need help. what are the laws regarding oc in Ohio?

    Hi, I recently purchased my first handgun (tuarus pt709 9mil.) although i have owned rifles and operated handguns for a few years now. I would like to exercise my right to oc in Ohio and have been reading up on the current oc laws as best i can. However, i still have a few questions regarding the details.

    1. Is it lawful to oc a loaded hadgun? chambered or no?
    2. What are the requirements for holstering?
    3. Do I have to have the safety on?
    4. how do i store my firearm in my vehicle and how do i transition from vehicle to walking or vice versa without ccw? say i have a loaded clip.
    5. how do i keep ammo on my person lawfully? say in a clip

    Any comments or links or help in general would be much appriciated. Thank You.

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    Hello, welcome. Let's take those questions in order...


    1) Yes you can open carry with the firearm loaded; most all who do so carry with a round in the chamber.

    2) I'm not sure what you mean about requirements for holstering. I will say that if you are not licensed and are carrying openly, make sure the gun is visible at all times, outside the waistband rigs are probably a good idea in this regard.

    3) There is no leagl requirement to have the safety "on", however there are some designs that for very obvious reasons it's more than prudent to do so! You must understand the way YOUR carry gun operates, do not carry at all unless that is the case.

    4) Without a CHL (Ohio's or another that's recognized by Ohio) you cannot transport the gun while it's loaded. Be advised, Ohio's definition of "loaded" is quite restrictive: In short if you have ammo in any magazine or speedloader for that firearm, even if it's all separate from the gun, Ohio says that firearm is loaded!

    5) You need to clarify this question for me a little bit better. Meantime, review and understand what I stated above about Ohio's wacky definition of a "loaded" firearm!

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    Question Thank you Brian

    Thanks for the information Brian. It was very helpful, No, I do not keep a round chambered when carrying,and I always keep the safety on til im basicaly ready to fire, but i just like to know what i can and can't do just because i like being well informed especially when my life or freedom may depend on it hehe. Also I agree that one should know their particular firearm inside and out before operating. Whenever i make a new purchase i get on the web and watch videos and\or read the manual for that firearm. I,m a strong advocate for that.

    But to clarify my question about holstering........
    does my holster HAVE to have the strap that snaps over the grip to be lawful???

    I once heard that via heresay but havent been able to find any material to confirm or deny.

    also.... when i carry ammo seperate from my firearm. Say a loaded clip in my pocket and I am oc a handgun visible in belt holster. Is that legal without a conceald carry licsense? or do I have to have all loaded clips visible to oc legally? I know that sounds confusing lol

    Last question or well questions lol sorry :lol: Without haveing a CHL. If my car was parked in public place. How would i go from walking while oc'ing belt holsterd loaded handgun to storing that and transporting it in my vehicle legally. Like would I have to remove the handgun from its holster, remove clip, remove ammo from clip, then put ammo and clip say in console or on dash. Then put gun in glove box or trunk. Would it be illegal for me to remove the handgun from the holster in a public place. I mean is that brandishing. So in the dark here. I guess. how would u do it?:banghead:

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    1. I HIGHLY advise against carrying with an empty chamber. That's counting on a violent assailant to GIVE you enough time and opportunity to draw AND chamber a round. I wouldn't bet on that in a million years.
    2. If you do not have a CHL or valid equivalent, you MUST not have a loaded firearm in your vehicle, nor indeed ANY loaded magazines for it OR for ANY rifle. Your firearm AND any magazines OR speedloaders MUST be unloaded. Your best bet is to have it, unloaded in a case, in your trunk. There's also no reason why you cannot BOTH have a CHL AND carry openly. That removes all of the nonsense unlicensed car carry rules and makes you immune from any issues with your firearm inadvertently becoming covered, OR with games about whether a military flap holster "conceals" the gun.
    3. There is no requirement for extra magazines or speedloaders to be visible, only the firearm itself.
    Last edited by Deanimator; 04-03-2011 at 02:56 PM.

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    Another benefit to having a CHL is that licensees can legally be in a grocery store which has a class D6 or D8 license while that store is having a wine tasting. Non-licensees would be in violation.

    http://codes.ohio.gov/orc/2923.121

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    Accomplished Advocate color of law's Avatar
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    Your semi auto has a magazine or mag NOT a clip.

    2923.16(5)”Unloaded” means any of the following:

    (a) No ammunition is in the firearm in question, and no ammunition is loaded into a magazine or speed loader that may be used with the firearm in question and that is located anywhere within the vehicle in question, without regard to where ammunition otherwise is located within the vehicle in question. For the purposes of division (K)(5)(a) of this section, ammunition held in stripper-clips or in en-bloc clips is not considered ammunition that is loaded into a magazine or speed loader.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deanimator View Post
    1. I HIGHLY advise against carrying with an empty chamber. That's counting on a violent assailant to GIVE you enough time and opportunity to draw AND chamber a round. I wouldn't bet on that in a million years.
    I will definately take that into consideration.

    and it will take some reprogramming on my part to stop calling magazines "clips" lol

    also if anyone knows of any groups or events were i could meet some people interested in firearms i would def. be interested. As it is i don't really know anyone who is.
    Thanks again you have all been very helpful

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    just joined today 3/24/2012

    i have a question i feel went unanswered here i also am a first time hand gun owner and i'm on here reading the different questions and stuff and was wondering if my open holster is legal for OC in ohio. to clarify what i mean is when i put my gun in the holster its just in there, there is no flap or strap to go over it. am i legal to walk down my street with this holster? any help would be greatly appreciated.
    Last edited by John Michael Needham; 03-24-2012 at 06:06 PM.

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    also

    also what are these clips and are they available for my ruger ksr40? ammunition held in stripper-clips or in en-bloc clips is not considered ammunition that is loaded into a magazine or speed loader. last part originally posted by color of law.
    Last edited by John Michael Needham; 03-24-2012 at 06:12 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Michael Needham View Post
    i have a question i feel went unanswered here i also am a first time hand gun owner and i'm on here reading the different questions and stuff and was wondering if my open holster is legal for OC in ohio. to clarify what i mean is when i put my gun in the holster its just in there, there is no flap or strap to go over it. am i legal to walk down my street with this holster? any help would be greatly appreciated.
    There is no qualification or law that defines a holster. But, if the holster does not give an indication that it contains a firearm then it can be construed as concealing the firearm. A holster with a flap covering the entire firearm except for the butt of the gun could be legally determined to be concealed. And yes in Ohio this has happened. A good old fashioned cowboy holster is perfectly legal. Usually if the grip is visible it considered open carrying.

    I hope that answers your question.

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    Accomplished Advocate color of law's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Michael Needham View Post
    also what are these clips and are they available for my ruger ksr40? ammunition held in stripper-clips or in en-bloc clips is not considered ammunition that is loaded into a magazine or speed loader. last part originally posted by color of law.
    A mag holds the ammo in the gun feeding the tube/firing chamber. A clip loads the mag. GENERALLY, clips are not inserted into the gun, GENERALLY.

    I know of no handgun that uses clips.....
    Last edited by color of law; 03-24-2012 at 11:47 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by color of law View Post
    A mag holds the ammo in the gun feeding the tube/firing chamber. A clip loads the mag. GENERALLY, clips are not inserted into the gun, GENERALLY.

    I know of no handgun that uses clips.....
    [Thread drift] Broomhandle Mauser? Grendel .380? (The latter was a forerunner of today's Kel Tec .32/.380 pistols) [/Thread drift]

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Michael Needham View Post
    also what are these clips and are they available for my ruger ksr40? ammunition held in stripper-clips or in en-bloc clips is not considered ammunition that is loaded into a magazine or speed loader. last part originally posted by color of law.
    Unless you're carrying a Mauser Broomhandle or a Steyr Hahn M1912, stripper clips aren't likely to be relevant to any discussion of carry, open or concealed. Unless you're carrying a 6.5mm Bergmann, en bloc clips are about as irrelevant.

    Where stripper and en bloc clips come into play is in the matter of loading devices for RIFLES in AUTOMOBILES. It is illegal to have a loaded RIFLE MAGAZINE (AR15, Kalashnikov, etc.) in a vehicle. For the purposes of the law, stripper clips (SKS, Mauser 98, Mosin-Nagant, etc.) and en bloc clips (Garand, Commission M1888, Dutch Mannlicher, etc.) are exempted.

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Michael Needham View Post
    i have a question i feel went unanswered here i also am a first time hand gun owner and i'm on here reading the different questions and stuff and was wondering if my open holster is legal for OC in ohio. to clarify what i mean is when i put my gun in the holster its just in there, there is no flap or strap to go over it. am i legal to walk down my street with this holster? any help would be greatly appreciated.
    There are no laws governing what your holster must or must not have. The only ruling I can think of regarding holster was that a full flap holster (think the old 1900's - 1940's German type holsters) was considered "concealed carry" by an ignoramus judge once. You have no legal requirements to have retention, but it's a great idea to have it regardless.
    I'm what Willis was talking about.

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    Really glad I stumbled on this site today. First time gun owner as well and have owned it for about a month now. Trying to learn as much info I can whether I actually ever choose to OC or not. I have a couple questions.

    Is there any where specifically you cannot carry at any time for any reason?
    I tried looking this up in the Ohio Revised Code and the only things I could find was within 500ft of a school or in a courthouse. I'm not looking for anything too specific (like bars or alcohol stores) just mainly things I would run into by accident. Dont want to be walking down the street to find out I accidently walked too close to a school.

    Also is there anything about open carrying around county prisons? I live within a mile of the Licking County jail and thats part of the reason I bought the gun to begin with. Thanks for any help guys.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Batallo View Post
    Really glad I stumbled on this site today. First time gun owner as well and have owned it for about a month now. Trying to learn as much info I can whether I actually ever choose to OC or not. I have a couple questions.

    Is there any where specifically you cannot carry at any time for any reason?
    I tried looking this up in the Ohio Revised Code and the only things I could find was within 500ft of a school or in a courthouse. I'm not looking for anything too specific (like bars or alcohol stores) just mainly things I would run into by accident. Dont want to be walking down the street to find out I accidently walked too close to a school.

    Also is there anything about open carrying around county prisons? I live within a mile of the Licking County jail and thats part of the reason I bought the gun to begin with. Thanks for any help guys.
    Is there any where specifically you cannot carry at any time for any reason?
    It depends. Conceal carry is laid out in 2923.126 Duties of licensed individual. http://codes.ohio.gov/orc/2923.126
    Within 500 ft. of a school or courthouse is a new one on me.

    Open carry is a right. There are five places you cannot open carry.
    A police station that has a holding cell/jail.
    A jail.
    A place that serves liquor/beer.
    A school.
    A state run mental hospital.

    You can actually open carry in state run government buildings, not federal buildings.

    Some will tell you that federal law - 18 USC 922(q) disallows open carry in school zones. And the statute does say that.

    But, since Congress amended 18 USC 922(q) there has been two courts that I know of that has upheld Congresses changes See United States v. Dorsey, 418 F.3d 1038 (9th Cir. 2005); United States v. Danks, 221 F.3d 1037 (8th Cir. 1999). Both are contrary to Lopez.

    Hodel v. Virginia Surface Mining & Reclamation Assn., Inc., 452 U.S. 264 (1981), United States v. Lopez, 514 U. S. 549 (1995) and Gonzales v. Raich, 545 U.S. 1 (2005) all made it clear that under the Commerce Clause Congress is required to show a tangible link to commerce, not a mere conceivable rational relation. “[S]imply because Congress may conclude that a particular activity substantially affects interstate commerce does not necessarily make it so.” See Lopez, supra, at 557, n. 2 (quoting Hodel, supra, at 311 (Rehnquist, J., concurring in judgment).

    The Lopez Court made it clear that the Commerce Clause would not carry the day when it comes to carrying a gun in a school zone.

    The possession of a gun in a local school zone is in no sense an economic activity that might, through repetition elsewhere, substantially affect any sort of interstate commerce. Respondent was a local student at a local school; there is no indication that he had recently moved in interstate commerce, and there is no requirement that his possession of the firearm have any concrete tie to interstate commerce.

    To uphold the Government's contentions here, we would have to pile inference upon inference in a manner that would bid fair to convert congressional authority under the Commerce Clause to a general police power of the sort retained by the States. Admittedly, some of our prior cases have taken long steps down that road, giving great deference to congressional action. See supra, at 556-558. The broad language in these opinions has suggested the possibility of additional expansion, but we decline here to proceed any further. To do so would require us to conclude that the Constitution's enumeration of powers does not presuppose something not enumerated, cf. Gibbons v. Ogden, supra, at 195, and that there never will be a distinction between what is truly national and what is truly local, cf. Jones & Laughlin Steel, supra, at 30. This we are unwilling to do.
    I suggest you read Lopez yourself.

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    Awesome thanks for the info.

    I some how convinced myself I read not within 500ft on http://codes.ohio.gov/orc/2923.122 for schools but I went back and checked and don't see it anywhere in there.

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