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Thread: see this....

  1. #1
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    see this....


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    Regular Member Recoil88's Avatar
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    I see one thing the shooter did wrong according to the man who taught my cpl class. Which is if you feel threatened to where you have to defend your life with deadly force you shoot to kill not wound. Because according to him the way the law would look at it is, your life was not in immediate danger of being taken or severley harmed if you felt you just had to wound the assailant.I would like to know your guys' opinions on this.
    In a situation when seconds count-The police will be there in minutes.

  3. #3
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    wow, that's sad. i hope i never end up in wayne county court. that guy did nothing wrong.
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Recoil88 View Post
    I see one thing the shooter did wrong according to the man who taught my cpl class. Which is if you feel threatened to where you have to defend your life with deadly force you shoot to kill not wound. Because according to him the way the law would look at it is, your life was not in immediate danger of being taken or severley harmed if you felt you just had to wound the assailant.I would like to know your guys' opinions on this.
    This has been much discussed and dissected here many times.

    The preferred/recommended terminology is to shoot to stop the threat. This is taught in most academies now too. Shooting to stop may involve many things, but these words will help you in court or the avoidance of indictment more than than other choices.

    The purpose is to define a defensive need w/o casting the individual as having a predisposition or desire to kill anyone. Shooting to wound has a long litany of problems associated with it, which I will not go into here.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  5. #5
    Regular Member Tucker6900's Avatar
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    I believe the shooter was in the right. However, the shooter and the media dont understand that a CCW(CPL) is not required when on your own property. This story leans too far toward blaming the CPL than it does for lack of justification.

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    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    Unhappy Sad, very sad.

    Everybody lost in this story .

    Well the dirtbag neighbor did get to keep the money they loaned him.
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Angry

    OMG! What he was convicted of he didn't do:
    750.227b Carrying or possessing firearm when committing or attempting to commit felony
    That judge & prosecutor need to be disbarred - convicting someone of a felony for self-defense!?!??!
    And on the steps of his own home, even?!?!?!?

    Along with everything else, the attacker tampered with the scene of the crime (had his daughter pick up the knife). I wonder what would have happened if one of the Gorees had put a foot on it until the police got there?

    And they sent him 600 miles away, to the western end of the UP, while his home & wife are in Detroit.

    To contact the victim, Mr. Goree, here's how to write him:
    Goree 788531
    Ojibway Correctional Facility
    N 5705 Ojibway Rd.
    Marenisco, MI
    49947-9771

    The prison website:
    http://www.michigan.gov/corrections/...5327--,00.html
    It's just east of Duluth.

    And I've set up a FB group, hoping to act similar to the "Free Brian Aitken" and "We Support Gerald Ung" pages:
    http://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=...21681924574068
    I also found & posted the address to write the judge.
    Last edited by MKEgal; 04-01-2011 at 03:52 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Proverbs 27:12
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    The simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences.
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  8. #8
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    Where did the author find this.. proximity? certain firearms?


    Concealed carry, or CCW (carrying a concealed weapon), refers to the practice of carrying a handgun or other weapon in public in a concealed manner, either on one's person or in proximity.

    While there is no federal law specifically addressing the issuance of concealed carry permits, 48 states have passed laws allowing citizens to carry certain concealed firearms in public, either without a permit or after obtaining a permit from state or local law enforcement.[1] The states give different terms for licenses or permits to carry a concealed firearm, such as a Concealed Handgun License/Permit (CHL/CHP), Concealed (Defensive/Deadly) Weapon Permit/License (CDWL/CWP/CWL), Concealed Carry Permit/License (CCP/CCL), License To Carry (Firearms) (LTC/LTCF), Carry of Concealed Deadly Weapon license (CCDW), Concealed Pistol License (CPL), etc. Thirteen states use a single permit to regulate the practices of both concealed and open carry of a handgun.

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    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
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    Well you have to be alive to be convicted and go to jail, I hope this doesn't discourage people from getting CPLs.
    Last edited by xmanhockey7; 04-01-2011 at 10:05 PM.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

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    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  10. #10
    Michigan Moderator Big Gay Al's Avatar
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    That guy needs to appeal. Problem is, appeals are not cheap.
    Big Gay Al
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    Fabrique Nationale d'Herstal FNX-45 .45ACP 16 rounds of hurt.

  11. #11
    Regular Member Ruger95's Avatar
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    I tried to access the Freep story and its no longer available. WTF? When did it appear in the paper? Don't they want anyone to read it?

  12. #12
    Regular Member StingMP9's Avatar
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    Yes the story appeared March 31st and was linked here Friday. Now the Freep has taken it down, probably to limit our free access to the story.

    This story hits close to home as it highlights what could one day go wrong between my neighbor and I having had loud confrontations in the past beginning last spring. I avoid all contact with them knowing what may occur if it ever gets heated again. Avoidance is the policy I prescribe to and many say the best policy.
    "Reason can never be popular. Passions and feelings can become popular, but reason will always remain the sole property of a few eminent individuals."
    Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

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    If anybody can link to this story somewhere I would like to read it. When did this occur ?
    Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
    Benjamin Franklin

    When seconds count, the Police are just minutes away !!

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    Just read the article. Someone posted a link on the FB group page. What a travesty of justice. The author stated that " Whoever pulls a gun on someone should expect to get shot at, too."
    Apparently ones life can only be in danger if the bad guy has a gun. This man is being punished for " defending himself and his loved ones".
    Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
    Benjamin Franklin

    When seconds count, the Police are just minutes away !!

  15. #15
    Regular Member Golden Eagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FS23 View Post
    If anybody can link to this story somewhere I would like to read it. When did this occur ?
    http://www.freep.com/article/2011033...7/1068/opinion

    On a Sunday evening, August 2010, at about 7 p.m., Nathaniel Goree's life changed forever.

    After Goree told Buckner to get off his porch, Buckner reached in his back pocket, according to Goree, and said: "I got something for you, too, (m----- f-----)." As Buckner's hand came up from his back pocket, Goree pulled his gun and shot Buckner once in the arm, sending Buckner to Detroit Receiving Hospital for three days.
    The news media plays politics more than the politicians do.

  16. #16
    Michigan Moderator Big Gay Al's Avatar
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    Can someone explain to me, how you can be charged with felony firearm if you have a CPL, your pistol is registered as required by Michigan law, and you've not committed any other crime?
    Big Gay Al
    Coordinator, Michigan Pink Pistols
    Big Gay Al's Big Gay (Gun) Blog
    Fabrique Nationale d'Herstal FNX-45 .45ACP 16 rounds of hurt.

  17. #17
    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    apparently the judge didn't properly instruct the jury, or maybe he did and they were too dumb to understand
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
    http://www.graystatemovie.com/

  18. #18
    Regular Member Tucker6900's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xmanhockey7 View Post
    Well you have to be alive to be convicted and go to jail, I hope this doesn't discourage people from getting CPLs.
    That was kind of my point from my ealier post. People need to know that to carry a firearm on your property DOES NOT REQUIRE A CPL! And even if you dont have a CPL, it does not take away your rights to defend yourself with deadly force in your own home, or while OC'ing.

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