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Thread: Reno homeowner shot, and killed man who was attempting to rob him

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    Regular Member john-in-reno's Avatar
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    Reno homeowner shot, and killed man who was attempting to rob him

    Police: Reno homeowner shot, and killed man who was attempting to rob him

    Reno police said a 32-year-old homeowner Wednesday night shot and killed a 19-year-old man who drove up to his home and confronted him with a gun while demanding his property.
    http://washoecountygunrights.blogspot.com/

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    Regular Member Badger Johnson's Avatar
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    I'd be tempted to charge the 'victim' in this case. He was IN his house and went back outside off his property and confronted the alleged perps in their truck WITH his gun.

    It may have printed or he may have said he had a gun, and that might have prompted the alleged perp to pull his pellet gun.

    Not sure what the charge should be but he had no business going back outside and confronting them, IMO. At least improper discharge of a firearm near an occupied dwelling - a slap on the wrist and reminder not to do that kind of thing again.

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    Regular Member john-in-reno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger Johnson View Post
    I'd be tempted to charge the 'victim' in this case. He was IN his house and went back outside off his property and confronted the alleged perps in their truck WITH his gun.

    It may have printed or he may have said he had a gun, and that might have prompted the alleged perp to pull his pellet gun.

    Not sure what the charge should be but he had no business going back outside and confronting them, IMO. At least improper discharge of a firearm near an occupied dwelling - a slap on the wrist and reminder not to do that kind of thing again.
    I have to agree with the NOT going back outside, if it was me I would have just called the police and stay in the house until they arrived, and if the punk came and busted down the door then it would be the right time to protect myself.
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    Regular Member Badger Johnson's Avatar
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    Some people are too eager to "shoot and hope". IMO, you should NEVER shoot if there's an alternative where nobody is hurt, even if there's loss of property.

    Imagine if you saved your life and your family's life in a righteous shoot by felons who were planning to murder you. Do you care about the post-fall-out? You can't, you're alive.

    Now imagine you ran out in the street and confronted some dangerous young thugs. You didn't HAVE to do that to save life. Now you're confronted with 'you shot my baby boy who only had a pellet gun and who saw you had a big gun - he tried to defend himself'.

    It's a ridiculous risk he took and now he has to wait and hope the person's buddies don't come back and vandalize and torment him.

    Basing your defense on hearsay like 'I thought he was racking the slide' is stunningly bad idea and sounds like an 'excuse' to get around the fact he ran up to them and had a gun out in the street. There's no Castle Doctrine in the US which justifies this.

    Just my opinion. Most probably agree you don't go 'hunting' and expect to call it SD.

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    After reading the article it's hard for me to say. The victim could obviously tell that there "might" be trouble, but I don't think he truely expected any. He went out to write down a license plate number, and generally doing that will cause people to drive off. Hell my dad regularly goes out and scares off young punks that smoke weed inside of their cars (they park on the side of the road right next to his house). I also don't agree that one should flee or otherwise idly do nothing while someome is about to commit a crime and just hope that the cops take care of it. Remember all of the cases that have shown the cops don't have a responsibility to the individual and so they might not have shown up for some time, if at all.

    So I see nothing wrong with the man going out there to try and drive off the punks as he didn't come out brandishing his weapon and who knows how long it would have taken for the cops to show up (if at all) had he simply called it in. No, he was a big boy and didn't need the cops to take care of his neighborhood, and the punk was stupid for trying to intimedate the man rather than simply leaving.

    Now there could be additional information that wasn't in the story, and I can understand why people say he should have stayed inside and just called the cops. I just don't agree with that given that the perps didn't display a weapon until after exiting the vehicle. And so I would have to side with the man that was basically just filling the role of the neighborhood watch and trying to drive off some suspicious people. Remember his gun was concealed and so it wasn't like he went out there trying to threaten them. If the perps had shown a gun while in their vehicle, then I would agree with those saying the victim shouldn't have gone outside and should have simply called the cops. But then again I think a MWAG call would have greatly increased the odds of a timely response compared to a suspicious truck/person call.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger Johnson View Post
    Some people are too eager to "shoot and hope". IMO, you should NEVER shoot if there's an alternative where nobody is hurt, even if there's loss of property.

    Imagine if you saved your life and your family's life in a righteous shoot by felons who were planning to murder you. Do you care about the post-fall-out? You can't, you're alive.

    Now imagine you ran out in the street and confronted some dangerous young thugs. You didn't HAVE to do that to save life. Now you're confronted with 'you shot my baby boy who only had a pellet gun and who saw you had a big gun - he tried to defend himself'.

    It's a ridiculous risk he took and now he has to wait and hope the person's buddies don't come back and vandalize and torment him.

    Basing your defense on hearsay like 'I thought he was racking the slide' is stunningly bad idea and sounds like an 'excuse' to get around the fact he ran up to them and had a gun out in the street. There's no Castle Doctrine in the US which justifies this.

    Just my opinion. Most probably agree you don't go 'hunting' and expect to call it SD.
    The article says the victim tucked his 9mm into his sweatshirt pocket. So the thug wouldn't of seen his gun and that completely kills the mom being able to say that her son saw your gun. Also the full statement was that he saw a gun, thought he was racking the slide, and FEARED FOR HIS LIFE. That caps part is the most important. The "racking the slide" part simply helps show why he feared for his life, but it was seeing a lethal weapon and fearing for one's life that is his defense. The fact that it turned out to be an air soft gun doesn't matter as they are made to look like the real thing (the orange tip on some can be easily removed) and brandishing a fake gun can get you in as much trouble as brandishing a real gun.

    As for the comment about how he shouldn't of confronted them, it depends on where he lives. If it was in the ghetto then I can see how they would be more likely to be truely dangerous. But then again if it was in a worse part of town who knows how long it could have taken for the cops to respond and the fact that the people could have hurt another family if not confronted. If it was in a more affluent part of town then one might not have expected them to do anything but drive off once confronted (aka what my dad regularly causes young punks to do).

    EDIT: Don't take my two posts as that I condone going out and confronting people who are likely to be violent. Simply that I don't believe one should run away rather than doing the right thing simply because there "might" be a problem.
    Last edited by Aknazer; 04-07-2011 at 07:49 PM.

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    What would calling the police have accomplished? Up to that point it was only a suspicious vehicle. What are the cops going to do? It's not a high priority call.

    In my neighborhood if a suspicious vehicle pulls up in front of my house, they are literally 10 feet away from my kitchen window. So, yep I'm gonna try to determine what they are up to, and maybe even take down a plate #. I'd probably grab my Browning 12 gauge though. A hand gun is useful for distracting the perp while getting to your long guns.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger Johnson View Post
    Basing your defense on hearsay like 'I thought he was racking the slide' is stunningly bad idea and sounds like an 'excuse' to get around the fact he ran up to them and had a gun out in the street. There's no Castle Doctrine in the US which justifies this.
    Research 'Joe Horn'....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger Johnson View Post
    Now imagine you ran out in the street and confronted some dangerous young thugs. You didn't HAVE to do that to save life. Now you're confronted with 'you shot my baby boy who only had a pellet gun and who saw you had a big gun - he tried to defend himself'.
    If he's carrying a gun-shaped object without a orange tip at the end, I will assume that if it looks like a gun, it is a gun. Pellet guns don't have orange tips because they fire a projectile propelled by high-pressure gas. Airsoft guns don't have orange tips because they too fire a projectile.

    Quote Originally Posted by Badger Johnson View Post
    Basing your defense on hearsay like 'I thought he was racking the slide' is stunningly bad idea and sounds like an 'excuse' to get around the fact he ran up to them and had a gun out in the street. There's no Castle Doctrine in the US which justifies this.
    I thought he was racking the slide? That sounds like an opportunity to put crosshairs on a target. Either way, this joker brought a pellet gun to a gunfight. Yes, Alabama would also rule this was self-defense.

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    Regular Member KansasMustang's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by john-in-reno View Post
    I have to agree with the NOT going back outside, if it was me I would have just called the police and stay in the house until they arrived, and if the punk came and busted down the door then it would be the right time to protect myself.
    In the state of Kansas, as a landowner I have the right to tell someone to leave my property and if they don't I then have the right to shoot them. If my memory of KS laws serve me correctly. Which I think it does.
    ‘‘Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.’’ Thomas Jefferson

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    If such a situation ever arises, I sure hope that your memory served you correctly. "But...but...but...I thought I remembered that the law said..." is not a recognized defense in a court of law!

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    Regular Member OngoingFreedom's Avatar
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    I think I would have done exactly as was done here. 'Cept I would have Smart Carry'd.

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    I don't totally agree with how the homeowner dealt with the problem but the punk certainly got what was coming to him in the end, doing several drive bys a person home. Then when confronted you pull a gun on the already concerned homeowner. Then your friends just "drop" you off at the hospital , yea sounds like they where just out on the town.
    Last edited by zack991; 04-23-2011 at 09:01 PM.
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