• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

Somebody add this today in Senate?

ixtow

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2006
Messages
5,038
Location
Suwannee County, FL
Is it being butt-hammered again? this looks like something we saw already...

This concerns me deeply.
 
Last edited:

~*'Phoenix'*~

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2011
Messages
538
Location
Florida

~*'Phoenix'*~

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2011
Messages
538
Location
Florida
Read closely. That is an addition to 790.053 (Open Carry Prohibition), referencing the new OC provision in 790.06. A little housekeeping.

It wouldn't do well to have one statute say you can open carry, and another say you can't.

That's what I figured. Actually I figured it was an add-on to make the "I just don't want to worry about 'flashing' my CC" folks happy; making sure anyone can OC or CC with impunity and not have to worry about accidental exposure on CC or accidental concealment with OC, etc.

How about this as an amendment "Delete all other FL state laws concerning weapons; any U.S. citizen or legal resident alien who has not been convicted of a felony/adjudicated mentally incompetant may carry any federally-legal weapon in any safe, non-threatening manner of his or her choosing, at any time, in or outside of any vehicle or conveyance, in any location not otherwise prohibited by federal law" ?
 
Last edited:

77zach

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2007
Messages
2,913
Location
Marion County, FL
From what I can tell it's only adding an "accidental exposure" clause before our OC amendment is even addressed. Says nothing about deleting/changing the OC provisions. Still, anything worries me.

It appears to be a good amendment to protect transitioning from concealed to open carry. I'm concerned however that it says "by Bogdanoff". She wasn't too hot about OC in the beginning. Unless I'm missing something nothing in this amendment deletes the open carry provisions of SB 234.
 
Last edited:

10x

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2011
Messages
134
Location
FL
What is definition of open carry? i don't see definition anywhere in those statutes, so i guess i could carry my rifle in my hand down the street

It shall not be a violation
12 of this section for a person who is licensed to carry a
13 concealed firearm, and who is lawfully carrying it in a
14 concealed manner, to accidentally or inadvertently display the
15 firearm to the ordinary sight of another person so long as the
16 firearm is not displayed in a rude, angry, or threatening
17 manner.
Rude, angry or threatening manner
Who is going to be the judge of that?
 

~*'Phoenix'*~

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2011
Messages
538
Location
Florida
What is definition of open carry? i don't see definition anywhere in those statutes, so i guess i could carry my rifle in my hand down the street

According to the current version of sb234, well... slung over your shoulder, yes. In your hand, probably not, I think 234 would still leave that as a probable "rude and threatening display."
HB517 however was amended to specify "handgun only," so it'll depend on how they're both amended to match when they hit the floors.
 

~*'Phoenix'*~

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2011
Messages
538
Location
Florida
Rude, angry or threatening manner
Who is going to be the judge of that?

The responding officer?
Odds are noone will notice a brief "accidental exposure" but if you're a CC'er, just thank us who'll OC and get people used to the sight of law-abiding guns so they won't feel a need to panic at CC 'flashing' :) lol
Once this passes and people start getting used to the sight of guns, I think officers will get it ok. If someone calls "guy with a gun" on you they'll probably check your CWL, maybe ask you to leave whereever it was, and that'll probably be the end of it.
 

~*'Phoenix'*~

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2011
Messages
538
Location
Florida
Time to start emailing them to get this removed

It's theoretically just restating another part of the 760 statutes. It's already illegal to 'display a weapon in a rude, careless, or threatening manner,' in those exact words. Whether a CC "flash" is considered such has basically been up to responder interpretation. I think she's just trying to make a definite statement that accidental exposure is is not a crime, unless it's done with threatening or rude intentions. We're still left with something ill-defined, but it's more or less just an attempt to cover the ***es of CC'ers with accidental exposure fears. It shouldn't affect OC as 234/517 go.
 

77zach

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2007
Messages
2,913
Location
Marion County, FL

I knew my denial would not make the truth go away. Alas, OC in Fl too good to be true.

There will be a follow up amendment to "delete everything" in lines such and such removing the OC language from the bill. Neocons. This is what you want, this is what you get. This is what you want......blah blah blah. Evers and Hammer will be amenable. This was their main goal anyhow.

Email sent regardless.
 

77zach

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2007
Messages
2,913
Location
Marion County, FL
How many people have been fined or arrested for accidentaly having their conceal weapon show?

Few. This was mostly an excuse to help the bill along. To trick them into getting closer to respecting the right to OC. It didn't work, but I fully expected that. Oh well, no sense in being mad at this whore. It was the people who put her in, and every other neocon up there.
 

Rick H

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 9, 2011
Messages
323
Location
Hoover, Alabama
Correct me if I am wrong....

790.053 Open carrying of weapons.—
8 (1) Except as otherwise provided by law and in subsection
9 (2), it is unlawful for any person to openly carry on or about
10 his or her person any firearm or electric weapon or device,

This does NOT state that she want Opencarry removed, she just added the accidental part to it. And the Bold writing above in sub section 8.(1) just make the rules that you must be Licensed and follow the rules in the rest of SB234 from my perspective.
Correct me if I am wrong.
 

ixtow

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2006
Messages
5,038
Location
Suwannee County, FL
Or, I may be wrong and we are over-reacting:

Florida Senate - 2011 COMMITTEE AMENDMENT
Bill No. CS for SB 234






Barcode 348370

LEGISLATIVE ACTION
Senate . House
.
.
.
.
.
—————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————




—————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————
The Committee on Judiciary (Bogdanoff) recommended the
following:

1 Senate Amendment (with title amendment)
2
3 Between lines 164 and 165
4 insert:

5 Section 4. Subsection (1) of section 790.053, Florida
6 Statutes, is amended to read:
7 790.053 Open carrying of weapons.—
8 (1) Except as otherwise provided by law and in subsection
9 (2), it is unlawful for any person to openly carry on or about
10 his or her person any firearm or electric weapon or device,
11 except as provided in s. 790.06(1).
It shall not be a violation
12 of this section for a person who is licensed to carry a
13 concealed firearm, and who is lawfully carrying it in a
14 concealed manner, to accidentally or inadvertently display the
15 firearm to the ordinary sight of another person so long as the
16 firearm is not displayed in a rude, angry, or threatening
17 manner.
18
19 ================= T I T L E A M E N D M E N T ================
20 And the title is amended as follows:
21 Delete line 16
22 and insert:
23 place in another state. amending s. 790.053, F.S.;
24 providing that person in compliance with the terms of
25 a concealed carry license is not in violation of s.
26 790.053(1), F.S. when the concealed firearm is
27 accidentally or inadvertently displayed to the
28 ordinary sight of another person; providing an
29 effective date.

This is confusing.

It doesn't look like it erases anything, actually... I bolded the important parts... I'm going to bed, you figure it out. :p

As written, It is illegal to carry on or about your person... Any electric weapon OR DEVICE. Did they just make cell phones, digital cameras, voice recorders, etc., all illegal without a CWP?

This part also contradicts the hunting/fishing/camping provisions....

Why can't they just stop screwing with it? This is retarded. Boggie seems to have screwed the pooch, this doesn't work or make sense.
 
Last edited:

77zach

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2007
Messages
2,913
Location
Marion County, FL
I wouldnt worry to much about it people... I believe its going to pass



It scares me that she would even attempt to kill it though. Why expend the political capital to reveal yourself as an anti if she thought it had a good chance of passing regardless. She could have done what Dean did and just vote against it if it gets to the floor.
 
Last edited:

rvrctyrngr

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 29, 2008
Messages
363
Location
SE of DiSOrDEr, ,
It scares me that she would even attempt to kill it though. Why expend the political capital to reveal yourself as an anti if she thought it had a good chance of passing regardless. She could have done what Dean did and just vote against it if it gets to the floor.

Doing it this way, she (they?) don't have to go on record as voting AGAINST it. They can vote FOR it.

Reagan said it best (paraphrase) "Politics is the world's second-oldest profession, and I've come to learn that it bears a striking resemblance to the first."

Keep the emails and phone calls flowing....
 
Top