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Thread: Important notice about AFP Tax-Payer tea party rally on Saturday April 16

  1. #1
    Wisconsin Carry, Inc. Wisconsin Carry, Inc. - Chairman's Avatar
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    Important notice about AFP Tax-Payer tea party rally on Saturday April 16

    At 11:00 this morning I received a troubling email with the following information regarding the Saturday AFP tea party rally on the Capitol Grounds:

    From: "Nancy Gmail" <nmistele53@gmail.com>
    Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 10:25:50 -0500
    To: ******************t>
    Cc: <teapartymadisonvolunteer@gmail.com>; *************************>
    Subject: Constitution Carry


    I don't believe we're acquainted but would ask, if you are in a position to spread the word to anyone who might need to hear it, there will be Absolutely NO OPEN CARRY at the tea party event on the capitol grounds Saturday April 16, 2011 between the hours of 7am and 4pm (includes set-up and tear-down.) It is our understanding that Open Carry will result in arrest on the Capitol Grounds.

    While we believe in a person's right to carry, it's important to pick our battles wisely and this tea party rally, co-mingled with a Farmers Market and likely protest from pro-union forces is not the time for that battle. Our rally is not the time or place to make a statement on Open Carry and if any one attempts this we will point them out to the Capitol Police.

    Thanks for any assistance you might provide to make this a family friendly and respectful event.


    Nancy Mistele
    The bold/underlined was as it came from the sender, Nancy Mistele.

    The red highlighting is my emphasis.

    As requested by Nancy Mistele, I am passing along this information to everyone who I think might need to hear it.

    Nancy Mistele has informed me that whomever "we" is (I assume her and other tea party organizers" intend to "point out anyone open-carrying to the police."

    I sent Nancy Mistele an email letting her know the following:

    Nancy,

    I find it truly offensive that you suggest you will "point out" people open carrying to the police.

    Why wouldn't you just politely approach them and warn them that the police have suggested they will arrest people (despite the fact that what they are doing is totally lawful)and suggest that they may wish to go put their gun away.

    Second, most people who open-carry do so every day. They are no more 'making a point' when they would open-carry to the tea-party rally than they would when they open-carry to the grocery store. They carry for self-defense like MILLIONS of people in this country do every single day. Are millions of people "making a point" every day?

    This is a critical point that I would expect someone who sides on the side of rights and freedoms to grasp. When people in other states conceal carry are they "making a point?". If our members were ALLOWED to conceal carry, the vast majority would. However, they carry for self-defense and open-carry is all Wisconsin allows.

    I will surely warn all of our 4000+ members that their rights will not be respected on Saturday. I don't want any of our members getting arrested. I'm VERY worried many will now show up without their sidearm but with a sign asking why the tea-party and AFP is behaving like the liberals?

    If the police have promised to arrest people for open-carry, I would NEVER fault you for wanting to warn people of this. But for you to not grasp why people carry, and go so far as to promise to POINT OUT people to the police. People who may not have ANY advanced warning of the potential unlawful behavior by the police and unsuspectingly carry into or near the rally. Not all people who carry in Wisconsin are members of Wisconsin Carry. Many will have NO warning of the police's supposed intent to arrest.

    Do them the courtesy of warning them instead of pointing them out to the Police.

    Nik Clark
    Chairman/President - Wisconsin Carry, Inc.

    The following is a portion of Wisconsin Carry's mission statement and reads as follows:

    Wisconsin Carry, Inc is a non-profit organization dedicated to the preservation and reclamation of the basic rights critical to a free society. Our organization believes in the founding principles of our country and our constitution: That all are created equal, that governments exist to protect the rights of individuals, and that governments derive their power from the consent of the governed.

    Wisconsin Carry believes that ALL rights are important. We support all rights, even those we may not choose to exercise because we believe that is needed if we expect others to support rights THEY may not choose to exercise.

    Its clear to me that Nancy Mistele believes that the Capitol grounds and "their" rally are not the place where people can exercise the rights they do every other day of the year.

    I find this very unfortunate.

    Over the past year and a half since our founding Wisconsin Carry has expended massive resources to defended the rights of law-abiding citizens who carry for self-defense in the ONLY way Wisconsin law allows.

    We would politely ask that instead of encouraging law enforcement to violate the rights of people who open carry "pointing them out to the police" Nancy Mistele and Americans for Prosperity would JOIN us in the effort to protect the rights of law-abiding citizens.

    Carry On,

    Nik Clark
    Chairman/President - Wisconsin Carry, Inc.

    Edited to add:

    I CANNOT confirm that the Capitol Police intend to hassle or arrest anyone for doing something that is completely legal. Nancy's email is my only source of information.

    I did not receive a response from her and due to the close proximity to the event and many of our member plans to attend I feel that we have an obligation to inform people that Nancy Mistele has promised to summon police if she or any of the other organizers see people doing something that is completely legal.

    I know many of our members prefer at all costs to avoid any and all interactions with police.

    WCI is not suggesting that members carry or not carry, rather that they be aware of Nancy Mistele and AFP's position.

    I will pass along more information if it becomes available. I do know that I personally would have a difficult time going to show support for AFP when they take such an unfortunate position on this issue.
    Last edited by Wisconsin Carry, Inc. - Chairman; 04-14-2011 at 10:09 PM.
    www.wisconsincarry.org Wisconsin Carry, Inc. is not affiliated with opencarry.org or these web forums. Questions about discussion forum policy or forum moderation should be directed to the owners of opencarry.org not Wisconsin Carry, Inc.

  2. #2
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    Will any members who do carry have help from WCI if needed?

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    Wisconsin Carry, Inc. Wisconsin Carry, Inc. - Chairman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mlutz View Post
    Will any members who do carry have help from WCI if needed?
    I cannot write a blank check like that Matt.

    I can say that Wisconsin Carry's mission is to protect people's right to carry and I think our actions over the past year have been a pretty good indication that we take that mission very seriously and are willing to put our money where our mouths are.

    That said:

    It is people's own individual responsibility to know and follow the law.

    Getting unlawfully arrested is a very unpleasant experience.

    Wisconsin Carry has VAST resources, but they are not unlimited. If anyone is unlawfully arrested exercising their legal right to carry anywhere in Wisconsin today, tomorrow, or any other day of the year, we will do everything we can up to the capacity of our resources to address the situation.
    www.wisconsincarry.org Wisconsin Carry, Inc. is not affiliated with opencarry.org or these web forums. Questions about discussion forum policy or forum moderation should be directed to the owners of opencarry.org not Wisconsin Carry, Inc.

  5. #5
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    With how many people will be there, it would be pretty hard to point out someone lawfully carrying.
    Last edited by protias; 04-14-2011 at 09:51 PM.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  6. #6
    Regular Member paul@paul-fisher.com's Avatar
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    Wow!

    I thought the Tea Party was on our side.

  7. #7
    Wisconsin Carry, Inc. Wisconsin Carry, Inc. - Chairman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paul@paul-fisher.com View Post
    Wow!

    I thought the Tea Party was on our side.
    There are hundreds of Tea Party groups in Wisconsin. Its unfortunate that one person in this one group has taken this position.

    I am still waiting for more information.

    At this point, we do not know if the police really threatened to make unlawful arrests.

    We only know that Nancy Mistele claims that whomever "we" is intends to point out law-abiding citizens to the police.
    www.wisconsincarry.org Wisconsin Carry, Inc. is not affiliated with opencarry.org or these web forums. Questions about discussion forum policy or forum moderation should be directed to the owners of opencarry.org not Wisconsin Carry, Inc.

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    Regular Member civilwarguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wisconsin Carry, Inc. - Chairman View Post
    At this point, we do not know if the police really threatened to make unlawful arrests.
    Maybe they will come up and shake out hands....... OK back to reality now

  9. #9
    Regular Member paul@paul-fisher.com's Avatar
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    I emailed the capital police earlier today asking them about this and reminding them of state law. I, as of yet, have not heard anything back.

    I just emailed Nancy and asked her to retract her 'threat' and remain neutral.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wisconsin Carry, Inc. - Chairman View Post
    There are hundreds of Tea Party groups in Wisconsin. Its unfortunate that one person in this one group has taken this position.

    I am still waiting for more information.

    At this point, we do not know if the police really threatened to make unlawful arrests.

    We only know that Nancy Mistele claims that whomever "we" is intends to point out law-abiding citizens to the police.
    A friend of mine will post later about his conversation with the cp, they said they wouldn't do anything.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by paul@paul-fisher.com View Post
    I emailed the capital police earlier today asking them about this and reminding them of state law. I, as of yet, have not heard anything back.

    I just emailed Nancy and asked her to retract her 'threat' and remain neutral.
    I think lots of people should email Nancy and inquire as to her comments.
    www.wisconsincarry.org Wisconsin Carry, Inc. is not affiliated with opencarry.org or these web forums. Questions about discussion forum policy or forum moderation should be directed to the owners of opencarry.org not Wisconsin Carry, Inc.

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    Contact with CP

    At approximately 7:10 this evening I spoke with Jeff Loud, who is a representative of Capital PD, over the phone. He assured me that their agency will NOT be targeting individuals legally OCing at the Tea Party Rally on Saturday. He did place emphasis on the fact that there is to be ABSOLUTELY no carrying in any government-owned buildings, but aside from that as long as laws are followed there will be no undue hassle. Those who wish to make contact with them may do so by calling (608) 266-8797.

    BrandonS


    "The average police response time is six minutes. The average response time of my .40 S&W is 1205 fps."

  13. #13
    Regular Member paul@paul-fisher.com's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrandonS View Post
    At approximately 7:10 this evening I spoke with Jeff Loud, who is a representative of Capital PD, over the phone. He assured me that their agency will NOT be targeting individuals legally OCing at the Tea Party Rally on Saturday. He did place emphasis on the fact that there is to be ABSOLUTELY no carrying in any government-owned buildings, but aside from that as long as laws are followed there will be no undue hassle. Those who wish to make contact with them may do so by calling (608) 266-8797.

    BrandonS


    "The average police response time is six minutes. The average response time of my .40 S&W is 1205 fps."
    I figured it wasn't their policy. They should know better.

  14. #14
    Wisconsin Carry, Inc. Wisconsin Carry, Inc. - Chairman's Avatar
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    Email sent to WCI membership:

    I received the following email this morning at 11:00am regarding the SATURDAY Tea Party Rally outside the capitol (note, this is different than the Friday lobby day INSIDE the capitol)
    -------------------------

    From: "Nancy Gmail" <nmistele53@gmail.com>
    Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 10:25:50 -0500
    To: *************************>
    Cc: teapartymadisonvolunteer@gmail.com>; ********************8
    Subject: Constitution Carry


    I don't believe we're acquainted but would ask, if you are in a position to spread the word to anyone who might need to hear it, there will be Absolutely NO OPEN CARRY at the tea party event on the capitol grounds Saturday April 16, 2011 between the hours of 7am and 4pm (includes set-up and tear-down.) It is our understanding that Open Carry will result in arrest on the Capitol Grounds.

    While we believe in a person's right to carry, it's important to pick our battles wisely and this tea party rally, co-mingled with a Farmers Market and likely protest from pro-union forces is not the time for that battle. Our rally is not the time or place to make a statement on Open Carry and if any one attempts this we will point them out to the Capitol Police.

    Thanks for any assistance you might provide to make this a family friendly and respectful event.

    Nancy Mistele
    --------------------
    Nancy Mistele is the organizer of this SATURDAY AFP tea-party rally.

    I emailed Nancy to clarify some of her comments, but have not received a response. Due to the close proximity of the date and many members making plans to attend despite wishing I could hear from Nancy first, Its been 8 hours and no response. I felt an obligation to honor Nancy's request and pass this information on to our 4000+ members in Wisconsin.

    Information you should know:

    In Wisconsin, firearms are prohibited INSIDE of government buildings. Open Carry is perfectly legal on the capitol grounds OUTSIDE the building.

    This evening, one of our members contacted Jeff Loud, who is a representative of Capital PD, over the phone. He assured us that their agency will NOT be targeting individuals legally OCing at the Tea Party Rally on Saturday. He did place emphasis on the fact that there is to be ABSOLUTELY no carrying IN any government-owned buildings, but aside from that as long as laws are followed there will be no undue hassle. Those who wish to make contact with the Capitol Police to verify may do so by calling (608) 266-8797.

    At this point all we know is that the organizers of this rally (Nancy Mistele) who we would expect would stand on the side of legal right to carry are indicating that THEY will summon police if they see anyone carrying for self-defense in the only manner the laws in Wisconsin allow.

    The purpose of this email is not to encourage nor discourage people from lawful carry or any other lawful activity, merely to make you aware of the threats of Nancy Mistele against law-abiding citizens.

    I have no other information regarding AFP's position on this situation nor why Nancy has threatened to summon police if she see's people legally carrying. I also do not know why Nancy thinks that people carrying would make it not a family friendly respectful event.

    I encourage anyone with questions to direct them to Nancy directly: nmistele53@gmail.com

    I also encourage people to ask the organizers of this event to support the right to carry in Wisconsin via the facebook event page for the saturday rally:

    http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=164799016908247

    Lastly I encourage people to contact Americans For Prosperity and let them know you can't support a rally that takes such an unfortunate view of the right to carry. Matt Seaholm is the Wisconsin state director of American's For Prosperity:
    1126 South 70th Street
    Suite S219A
    Milwaukee , WI 53214
    Phone: 414-476-7900
    Toll Free: 1-877-667-2975
    Fax: 414-476-2800
    email: infowi@afphq.org

    Carry On,

    Nik Clark
    Chairman/President - Wisconsin Carry, Inc.
    nik@wisconsincarry.org
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    www.youtube.com/wisconsincarry
    www.twitter.com/wisconsincarry
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    www.wisconsincarry.org Wisconsin Carry, Inc. is not affiliated with opencarry.org or these web forums. Questions about discussion forum policy or forum moderation should be directed to the owners of opencarry.org not Wisconsin Carry, Inc.

  15. #15
    Campaign Veteran Flipper's Avatar
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    She spent all afternoon on McKenna's show griping about Madison, then she acts soooo Madison.
    When in danger you can dial 911 and hope for the police to arrive a few minutes later armed with guns.
    Why do police carry guns?

    The Joyce Foundation funded firearm control empire:
    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...lFundingR1.png

    "Everything that we see is a shadow cast by that which we do not see." - Martin Luther King Jr.

  16. #16
    Regular Member Pyro01's Avatar
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    Man, I wish I could come to this, have fun everyone, and stay safe!
    Join Wisconsin Carry today, defend your rights!

    Wisconsin Carry member since March, 2011

    "The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man."
    - Thomas Jefferson

  17. #17
    Regular Member HandyHamlet's Avatar
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    So are all the people on facebook bashing and mocking OCers Tea Party members or just facebook trolls who happened to find that page?
    "Don't interfere with anything in the Constitution. That must be maintained, for it is the only safeguard of our liberties."
    Abraham Lincoln

    "Some time ago, a bunch of lefties defied the law by dancing at the Jefferson Memorial, resulting in their arrests. Last week, a bunch of them pulled the same stunt and - using patented Lefist techniques - provoked the Park Police into having to use force to arrest them."
    Alexcabbie

  18. #18
    Regular Member XDFDE45's Avatar
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    What a load of !!!!!



    Quote Originally Posted by Flipper View Post
    She spent all afternoon on McKenna's show griping about Madison, then she acts soooo Madison.
    Wisconsin Carry Member
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    Don't wish ill upon your enemy......plan it.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by HandyHamlet View Post
    So are all the people on facebook bashing and mocking OCers Tea Party members or just facebook trolls who happened to find that page?
    Most of those posts are not from Tea-Party members, if you check their profiles they seem to lean so far left I don't know what keeps them upright.

  20. #20
    Regular Member XDFDE45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason in WI View Post
    they seem to lean so far left I don't know what keeps them upright.
    Wisconsin Carry Member
    My Castle Doctrine Law

    Don't wish ill upon your enemy......plan it.

  21. #21
    Regular Member HandyHamlet's Avatar
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    Thanks Jason. Checked in again and it (facebook page) has degraded into the typical internet name calling by obvious 2nd Amendment haters.
    "Don't interfere with anything in the Constitution. That must be maintained, for it is the only safeguard of our liberties."
    Abraham Lincoln

    "Some time ago, a bunch of lefties defied the law by dancing at the Jefferson Memorial, resulting in their arrests. Last week, a bunch of them pulled the same stunt and - using patented Lefist techniques - provoked the Park Police into having to use force to arrest them."
    Alexcabbie

  22. #22
    Regular Member GlockRDH's Avatar
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    Its my guess that Nancy is clueless about what is actually legal...and that its not really a statement for most/some of us... Point us out ot LE is a laughable concept.

  23. #23
    Regular Member IcrewUH60's Avatar
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    they have changed their statement regarding OC

    https://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=164799016908247
    "In a court trial half the lawyers are wrong." - Captain Nemo

    "[There is] a duty in refusing to cooperate in any undertaking that violates the Constitutional rights of the individual. This holds in particular for all inquisitions that are concerned with the private life and the political affiliations of the citizens." - Albert Einstein

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  24. #24
    McX
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    in keeping with my avitar; gentlemen, i believe we are being set upon by Confederate spies, seeking to disrupt the lawful assembly of armed citizens!

  25. #25
    Regular Member paul@paul-fisher.com's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IcrewUH60 View Post
    they have changed their statement regarding OC

    https://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=164799016908247
    Much better. Neutral. Follow the law.

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