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Thread: VA AG will appeal $55,000 fine against Virginia Tech

  1. #1
    Regular Member Repeater's Avatar
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    VA AG will appeal $55,000 fine against Virginia Tech

    The Attorney General seems very angry with the Federal DOE, yet has nothing to say about the fact that Tech banned campus carry, thereby making self-protection a policy violation.

    Va Tech appealing fines from shooting
    Virginia Tech will appeal $55,000 in federal fines levied against the school for failing to quickly alert the campus during the 2007 mass shooting that killed 32 students and faculty members, the state announced Wednesday.

    State Attorney General Kenneth Cuccinelli made the announcement two days before the deadline to file an administrative appeal of the finding that the school violated federal law. He called the findings by the U.S. Department of Education "absolutely appalling," adding that an appeal was necessary to ensure Virginia Tech was treated fairly.
    Ken's official statement is here:
    My office will work closely with Virginia Tech, not only on this very well-grounded appeal, but to hold the federal Department of Education to basic standards of accountability, due process, fair dealing, and obedience to the law.

    Additionally, I want to touch on one more thing. I previously mentioned the civil litigation against Virginia Tech. In the complaint from the lawyers suing the school and its officers, page after page is devoted to the outrageous allegation that Virginia Tech was more concerned with its public image and fundraising than with the safety of students. They even said the decision-makers at Virginia Tech that day were divided into two camps—the “image group” and the “safety group”—and the image group prevailed.
    Outrageous allegation? Remember what Larry Hincker said:
    Gun bill gets shot down by panel
    HB 1572, which would have allowed handguns on college campuses, died in subcommittee.

    A bill that would have given college students and employees the right to carry handguns on campus died with nary a shot being fired in the General Assembly.

    House Bill 1572 didn't get through the House Committee on Militia, Police and Public Safety.

    The bill was proposed by Del. Todd Gilbert, R-Shenandoah County, on behalf of the Virginia Citizens Defense League.

    Virginia Tech spokesman Larry Hincker was happy to hear the bill was defeated. "I'm sure the university community is appreciative of the General Assembly's actions because this will help parents, students, faculty and visitors feel safe on our campus."
    Concerned with its public image? Does everyone here remember Hincker's own words?

    Imagine if students were armed

    By Larry Hincker
    Hincker is the associate vice president for university relations at Virginia Tech.

    ...

    Who among us thinks the writer of the commentary would not have been directly in harm's way if he showed himself to those tactical squads while displaying a deadly weapon? Would he even be here today to tell us the story? Contrary to his position, the writer's commentary actually gives credence to the university policy preventing weapons in classrooms.

    Guns don't belong in classrooms. They never will. Virginia Tech has a very sound policy preventing same.

  2. #2
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Isn't it pro forms to appeal any penalty imposed on the State?

    Note that this comment in no way should be misconstrued as support for the behavior of Va Tech.

    stay safe.

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    Regular Member Badger Johnson's Avatar
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    Note also that this protest by the AG will (shall) cost the taxpayers MORE than the $55k fine.

  4. #4
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger Johnson View Post
    Note also that this protest by the AG will (shall) cost the taxpayers MORE than the $55k fine.
    But .... But ....

    But in Va Tech pays the fine they are admitting they screwed up, and they by default lose the lawsuits and the arguments against allowing students/faculty/staff to posses handguns on campus. We can't have that happening, can we? *skidmark removes tongue from cheek using very large crowbar*

    stay safe.

  5. #5
    Accomplished Advocate user's Avatar
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    The Virginia Trial Lawyers' Association has been all a-buzz about this, too. Here's what I told them:

    Of course my view is that the University caused the excessive casualty rate by preventing students and faculty who might otherwise have been in lawful possession of handguns from being able to defend themselves and others. One properly trained person with a concealed handgun permit might well have saved thirty others. But people who believe in social responsibility and voluntary compliance with the law are prevented by University regulations from exercising their natural right of self-defense.
    Last edited by user; 04-27-2011 at 08:40 PM.
    Daniel L. Hawes - 540 347 2430 - HTTP://www.VirginiaLegalDefense.com

    By the way, nothing I say on this website as "user" should be taken as either advertising for attorney services or legal advice, merely personal opinion. Everyone having a question regarding the application of law to the facts of their situation should seek the advice of an attorney competent in the subject matter of the issues presented and licensed to practice in the relevant state.

  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by user View Post
    The Virginia Trial Lawyers' Association has been all a-buzz about this, too. Here's what I told them:
    Look here http://www.wallsofthecity.net/2010/09/pop-quiz.html for a great visualization of what the bliss-ninnies are afraid of.

    Actually, they are afraid that all the folks represented by the blue pixels will suddenly snap, go off the deep end, and turn into folks represented by the (depending on which figure you are looking at) red, yellow or orange pixels.

    But, ya know, if I were a bliss-ninny and knew how many of "THEM" were out there, as opposed to how many bliss-ninnies there were, I'd be afraid too.

    stay safe.

  7. #7
    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by user View Post
    The Virginia Trial Lawyers' Association has been all a-buzz about this, too. Here's what I told them:
    how many heads exploded when you told them?
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    bliss-ninnies
    <carefully writing that one down for future use>


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    Quote Originally Posted by user View Post
    The Virginia Trial Lawyers' Association has been all a-buzz about this, too. Here's what I told them:
    I liked the "Of course" at the front. Nice touch, that.

  10. #10
    Regular Member Neplusultra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by user View Post
    The Virginia Trial Lawyers' Association has been all a-buzz about this, too. Here's what I told them:
    User, do you have a link so we can at least watch. It would be very interesting IMO to see what is being said.

  11. #11
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thundar View Post
    how many heads exploded when you told them?
    I was wondering the exact same thing Thundar

  12. #12
    Regular Member Repeater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thundar View Post
    how many heads exploded when you told them?
    What about the shrapnel? Exploding Progressives -- not healthy.

  13. #13
    Regular Member Repeater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger Johnson View Post
    Note also that this protest by the AG will (shall) cost the taxpayers MORE than the $55k fine.
    How does it make you feel to know that you agree with Lori Haas?
    It's ludicrous that the attorney general's office is going to spend the amount of time and energy to appeal this decision when the fine was $55,000. I think it's a waste of taxpayer money.
    -- Lori Haas

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Isn't it pro forms to appeal any penalty imposed on the State?

    Note that this comment in no way should be misconstrued as support for the behavior of Va Tech.

    stay safe.
    I assume you meant pro forma, but I digress.

    As does AG Ken, it would seem:
    The relatively small monetary penalty is not the reason for our appeal," said Cuccinelli, whose office represents state agencies, including public colleges and universities.

    "The main purpose of the appeal is to treat Virginia Tech fairly and apply a very poorly defined and subjectively applied federal law consistently and correctly," he said. "There are important principles and policies at stake here that affect not just Virginia Tech, but colleges and universities all across the country."
    No, this is much more about saving face than saving money or "fairness" or anything else the AG claims.

  15. #15
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    A gift for Tech!

    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    But .... But ....

    But in Va Tech pays the fine they are admitting they screwed up, and they by default lose the lawsuits and the arguments against allowing students/faculty/staff to posses handguns on campus. We can't have that happening, can we? *skidmark removes tongue from cheek using very large crowbar*

    stay safe.
    Look look! A Gift!
    Va. Tech gets three donations totaling $45 million

    Virginia Tech has received three donations totaling $45 million, including the largest gift in the university's history and a $17 million bequest from a Richmond alumnus.

    The gifts, announced Thursday by Tech President Charles W. Steger, all will benefit the College of Engineering.

    The largest gift is a $25 million commitment from an anonymous donor to be used for the Signature Engineering Building project.
    Rather overwhelms the fine, don't you think?

  16. #16
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Repeater View Post
    Look look! A Gift!


    Rather overwhelms the fine, don't you think?
    Not in the least. The gifts come with conditions on how they can be used, and I'll be willing to bet a box of premium .45acp that without the gifts whatever project they are funding would not have been green-lighted.

    Plus, the cost of the fine, if upheld, will most likely result in an increase in the allocation of tax dollars to cover the payout. Either that or the beancounters and weasels will find a way to cover the cost via an increase in tuition or student fees. My money is on the taxpayers footing the bill entirely.

    stay safe.

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