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Thread: If at first you don't succeed, fight, FIGHT AGAIN!

  1. #1
    Campaign Veteran StogieC's Avatar
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    If at first you don't succeed, fight, FIGHT AGAIN!

    For this year, we have failed to legalize common sense open carry provisions that would protect the right of Floridians to bear arms in whatever manner is appropriate to their environment and situation.

    The Florida Senate accepted a last minute amendment by Sen. Bogdanoff (R) that removed the well considered open carry provision and replaced it with language that is subjective, vague, and only intended to address the NRA's sole OC "talking point" of momentary or inadvertent exposure of a licensee's concealed, handgun.

    Florida Carry, Inc. was formed to protect all Americans who choose to exercise their fundamental right to bear arms for self defense while residents or visitors to the great state of Florida. We are quite encouraged by our recent political victories in multiple Florida counties and the pending success of HB 45 (Preemption Enforceability)
    We are working on a "hail Mary" effort to salvage the current open carry bill.

    We are also already drafting next year's pro-gun legislation and planning additional "grass roots" activities for our members.

    Remember that it took 7 years for "Shall Issue" concealed carry to pass here. This is a fight that WE WILL WIN! For it be successful, we need you to Join Florida Carry and be ready to advocate loudly (but politely) for our rights.
    Last edited by StogieC; 04-28-2011 at 08:17 AM.

  2. #2
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    I'm all for the efforts you're making, even if we don't see eye to eye all the time. I just don't have another 7 years to waste. I'm sure my absence won't make much difference. ;-)
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

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    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

  3. #3
    Regular Member ~*'Phoenix'*~'s Avatar
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    Likewise. I'll continue to support our fight, as Florida is worth fighting for; if it weren't for the full ban against open carry, Florida otherwise has some of the best preemption/vehicle/groundwork laws for gun ownership.And I'll always have family in Florida... But I'm graduating later this year, and if I have any opportunity to move my life to a free state, I'm gone.
    We'll need OC bills introduced every year. I'll keep signing the petitions, just let me know where they are.
    American Government 101:
    The Executive branch's job is to provide celebrity figureheads for the pandering populace.
    The Legislative branch's job is to progressively destroy our freedoms for the "safety" of "We the Sheeple."
    The Judicial branch's job is to look like they're defending our freedoms against the abuses of the Legislative branch, only by token gestures that do not interfere is this pivotal process, but enough to deceive "We the People" into a false sense of security.

  4. #4
    Regular Member ~*'Phoenix'*~'s Avatar
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    Don't give up yet, if the house passes the clean version of 517, it goes to a conference committee, and if the house won't back down, can't they force the senate to vote on the clean version?
    American Government 101:
    The Executive branch's job is to provide celebrity figureheads for the pandering populace.
    The Legislative branch's job is to progressively destroy our freedoms for the "safety" of "We the Sheeple."
    The Judicial branch's job is to look like they're defending our freedoms against the abuses of the Legislative branch, only by token gestures that do not interfere is this pivotal process, but enough to deceive "We the People" into a false sense of security.

  5. #5
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~*'Phoenix'*~ View Post
    Don't give up yet, if the house passes the clean version of 517, it goes to a conference committee, and if the house won't back down, can't they force the senate to vote on the clean version?
    The House can't force the Senate to do anything.

    Like our Fearless Leader said; Hail Mary.

    Oceanfront property in Arizona....

    The operative term being, Arizona. Screw Floriduh.
    Last edited by ixtow; 04-28-2011 at 01:03 AM.
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

  6. #6
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    there any chance of put the open carry part back in the bill?

  7. #7
    Regular Member ~*'Phoenix'*~'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowlux View Post
    there any chance of put the open carry part back in the bill?
    there's a chance of the house passing the clean version, then they go to conference committee between houses to try to reconcile to two. Mayne they can put pressure on the senate saying they won't settle for anything less, and make the neocons show themselves for what they are by voting against a pro-2a bill.
    American Government 101:
    The Executive branch's job is to provide celebrity figureheads for the pandering populace.
    The Legislative branch's job is to progressively destroy our freedoms for the "safety" of "We the Sheeple."
    The Judicial branch's job is to look like they're defending our freedoms against the abuses of the Legislative branch, only by token gestures that do not interfere is this pivotal process, but enough to deceive "We the People" into a false sense of security.

  8. #8
    Regular Member RRobaldo's Avatar
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    I hope and pray that open carry can be resurrected. But I'm not gonna hold my breath. If not THIS year, we will try again NEXT year, AND THE YEAR AFTER, ad infinitum!

    I'm still trying to be optimistic and see that other parts of the law aren't so bad, but I too feel the dismay of losing the open carry component.

    Personally, I don't think we need SB-234 AT ALL!

    Now that I've got your attention...

    What we really need is COMPLETE REPEAL of 790.60, 790.251, and possibly a few more and LET THE CONSTITUTION STAND!

    Doesn't ANYONE in politics understand the meaning of "SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED"?

  9. #9
    Regular Member ~*'Phoenix'*~'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RRobaldo View Post
    "SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED"?
    No. Senate made that clear.
    Last edited by ~*'Phoenix'*~; 04-28-2011 at 11:54 AM.
    American Government 101:
    The Executive branch's job is to provide celebrity figureheads for the pandering populace.
    The Legislative branch's job is to progressively destroy our freedoms for the "safety" of "We the Sheeple."
    The Judicial branch's job is to look like they're defending our freedoms against the abuses of the Legislative branch, only by token gestures that do not interfere is this pivotal process, but enough to deceive "We the People" into a false sense of security.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by StogieC View Post
    Remember that it took 7 years for "Shall Issue" concealed carry to pass here. This is a fight that WE WILL WIN! For it be successful, we need you to Join Florida Carry and be ready to advocate loudly (but politely) for our rights.
    This is a very good point. Even though Open Carry is common sense to all of us, the "fear factor" is great for those who don't understand (and those who do, but are just so anti-liberty that they are afraid of the law abiding gun owner!!)

    I am beyond pissed today, but right now I'm looking at it this way.. It took several years to get shall issue. It'll probably take a few to get open carry. But I'm 21 years old and I get a couple things out of that fact: just a couple years before my short life began, we were in a much worse place than we are today. (Looking at maps like this http://www.kc3.com/CCW_progress.htm) Also.. I understand the frustration desire to GTFout of Dodge. I lived in rural VA for a few months, what a difference! Nonetheless, I'm pretty much tied to Florida, and I got a lot of fight left. Looking forward to working with Florida Carry in the future.

  11. #11
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    2012

    P.S. I knew Florida Senate terms were an astonishingly long 8 years... but I was pleased to see that in 2012, we can send any or all of the 40 packing.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonkknox View Post
    P.S. I knew Florida Senate terms were an astonishingly long 8 years... but I was pleased to see that in 2012, we can send any or all of the 40 packing.
    We need to compile a list of them now and start campaigning against them!
    Need to email the turds too!

  13. #13
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    May as well go for the hail mary. SB 234 is meaningless now anyway. Who cares if nothing gets through? Same result for OC.

    I'm a member of Florida Carry and I'll do what I can next year.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

  14. #14
    Regular Member ~*'Phoenix'*~'s Avatar
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    Please inform me... besides the religious reference, does this "Hail Mary" effort mean anything else too?
    American Government 101:
    The Executive branch's job is to provide celebrity figureheads for the pandering populace.
    The Legislative branch's job is to progressively destroy our freedoms for the "safety" of "We the Sheeple."
    The Judicial branch's job is to look like they're defending our freedoms against the abuses of the Legislative branch, only by token gestures that do not interfere is this pivotal process, but enough to deceive "We the People" into a false sense of security.

  15. #15
    Campaign Veteran StogieC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~*'Phoenix'*~ View Post
    Please inform me... besides the religious reference, does this "Hail Mary" effort mean anything else too?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hail_Mary_pass

  16. #16
    Regular Member oogotbagsoo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StogieC View Post
    How can we help with this "Hail Mary" last attempt?
    To model our political system upon speculations of lasting tranquility, is to calculate on the weaker springs of the human character.
    -Alexander Hamilton

  17. #17
    Regular Member ~*'Phoenix'*~'s Avatar
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    Yeah, I'm all for the whole last-stand-to-the-last-breath-even-after-we-know-it's-over concept. Let me know what to do, I'll keep emailing them. Heck, I even found the balls to call both Evers and Boggie's assistants to comment on the amendment yesterday. I'll call peeps.
    American Government 101:
    The Executive branch's job is to provide celebrity figureheads for the pandering populace.
    The Legislative branch's job is to progressively destroy our freedoms for the "safety" of "We the Sheeple."
    The Judicial branch's job is to look like they're defending our freedoms against the abuses of the Legislative branch, only by token gestures that do not interfere is this pivotal process, but enough to deceive "We the People" into a false sense of security.

  18. #18
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Me three.

    Before this I was resigned to our fate of no OC in Florida. Now my appetite is whetted. I'm so PISSED!!
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

  19. #19
    Campaign Veteran StogieC's Avatar
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    It didn't work. I'm off to start drafting next year's OC bill!

  20. #20
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StogieC View Post
    It didn't work. I'm off to start drafting next year's OC bill!
    You see Dean vote against the new SB 234 too? Wonder what his reasoning was.

    Hey, look at the elegance of the TX OC bill during your drafts. Post them here for review if you want.

    In TX, they're just deleting the word "concealed" before every instance of "handgun" related to the licensing law.

    I don't want to wait 7 years. Mass protests between then and now. whatever. I'm game.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

  21. #21
    Campaign Veteran StogieC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 77zach View Post
    You see Dean vote against the new SB 234 too? Wonder what his reasoning was.

    Hey, look at the elegance of the TX OC bill during your drafts. Post them here for review if you want.

    In TX, they're just deleting the word "concealed" before every instance of "handgun" related to the licensing law.

    I don't want to wait 7 years. Mass protests between then and now. whatever. I'm game.
    What Texas is doing wont get past the FL Senate. We will have the same senators next year. Florida Carry is working on new language that may get the FSA off our backs and have a chance of passing next year.

  22. #22
    Regular Member RRobaldo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StogieC View Post
    What Texas is doing wont get past the FL Senate. We will have the same senators next year. Florida Carry is working on new language that may get the FSA off our backs and have a chance of passing next year.
    Whatever we can do to help, just give the word. I want 2A rights restored! Failing that, I want as close to it as I can possibly get.

    While I am personally not likely to OC, I want to make that choice MYSELF. Not have it shoved down my throat by some elitist who thinks they know what's best for me.

  23. #23
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StogieC View Post
    What Texas is doing wont get past the FL Senate. We will have the same senators next year. Florida Carry is working on new language that may get the FSA off our backs and have a chance of passing next year.
    I hope you let us see some of the work for comments and analysis. I don't see how the FSA can be appeased. This will be interesting.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

  24. #24
    Regular Member ~*'Phoenix'*~'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StogieC View Post
    What Texas is doing wont get past the FL Senate. We will have the same senators next year. Florida Carry is working on new language that may get the FSA off our backs and have a chance of passing next year.
    True, but we WILL NOT HAVE the same senators in 2013. I"m sure all of us here are willing to see to that. We get to throw the whole lot of them out in the 2012 elections
    American Government 101:
    The Executive branch's job is to provide celebrity figureheads for the pandering populace.
    The Legislative branch's job is to progressively destroy our freedoms for the "safety" of "We the Sheeple."
    The Judicial branch's job is to look like they're defending our freedoms against the abuses of the Legislative branch, only by token gestures that do not interfere is this pivotal process, but enough to deceive "We the People" into a false sense of security.

  25. #25
    Regular Member ~*'Phoenix'*~'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StogieC View Post
    It didn't work. I'm off to start drafting next year's OC bill!
    Please me tell what the hail mary effort was and how it failed?
    American Government 101:
    The Executive branch's job is to provide celebrity figureheads for the pandering populace.
    The Legislative branch's job is to progressively destroy our freedoms for the "safety" of "We the Sheeple."
    The Judicial branch's job is to look like they're defending our freedoms against the abuses of the Legislative branch, only by token gestures that do not interfere is this pivotal process, but enough to deceive "We the People" into a false sense of security.

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