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Thread: How Officer View Open Carry

  1. #1
    Regular Member usamarshal's Avatar
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    How Officer View Open Carry

    Thought this thread was pretty interesting and somewhat entertaining. From a few of the posts I read some "officers" knew OC to be legal, but others seem to interpret the law in their own minds or think that if someone is OCing there only having a power trip of some kind. Definitely an interesting read....

    http://forums.officer.com/forums/sho...-to-Open-Carry!

  2. #2
    Regular Member hermannr's Avatar
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    Thanks, read, and then could not help putting in my 2 cents worth. We'll see if they ban me on my first post

  3. #3
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    Saw the video, which was entertaining, however, the fella in the striped shirt should have been detained for interfering with a police investigation. He should have been placed into the backseat of a patrol vehicle until everything was sorted out. The waving the hand in the officer's face was unacceptable and uncalled for and should have been addressed, but to the officer's credit he held himself together and allowed the contact officer to continue his questioning.

    Officers nationwide should really get to know the OC laws and what they can do so when the cameras come out or the live video streams are going, they do not have to back-pedal. I do not have an issue with folks exercising their rights, however, I do not like folks that try to provoke a response. I do know that when an officer receives a call about a person who is OCing, then that person should know and understand the officer has a job to do and if the officer does not fully understand the OC laws, they (the citizen) should show patience and use the contact to try and educate the officer.

  4. #4
    Regular Member usamarshal's Avatar
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    And pray to god that the officer wants to be educated...

    Quote Originally Posted by BaconMan View Post
    Saw the video, which was entertaining, however, the fella in the striped shirt should have been detained for interfering with a police investigation. He should have been placed into the backseat of a patrol vehicle until everything was sorted out. The waving the hand in the officer's face was unacceptable and uncalled for and should have been addressed, but to the officer's credit he held himself together and allowed the contact officer to continue his questioning.

    Officers nationwide should really get to know the OC laws and what they can do so when the cameras come out or the live video streams are going, they do not have to back-pedal. I do not have an issue with folks exercising their rights, however, I do not like folks that try to provoke a response. I do know that when an officer receives a call about a person who is OCing, then that person should know and understand the officer has a job to do and if the officer does not fully understand the OC laws, they (the citizen) should show patience and use the contact to try and educate the officer.

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    I dont like when people go trying to provoke a response either. The people who do, are the exception, not the rule.

  6. #6
    Regular Member papa bear's Avatar
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    didn't read the whole thing. was fascinated that the posts read a lot like posts in this forum. some pro citizen, some pro cops, and some wanting to put all the citizens away
    Luke 22:36 ; 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

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    i you call a CHP a CCW then you are really stupid. period.

  7. #7
    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Here's a scary attitude (from a S CA officer):
    in Calif, in order to verify that the person is not carrying a gun in violatiojn (being a felon, convicted of domestic violence, or have a restraining order against them), they must identify themselves. If they refuse, they get detained and taken to the station for a livescan.
    And another:
    I'm just glad that in my state, if you don't have a permit you can't carry a firearm anywhere on your person or in your vehicle. Only on your own property. Makes it alot easier. If I see one of these wackos carrying a gun on their hip I can stop them and ask for their permit. If they don't have one-go to jail.
    This is better:
    When I get calls for Open Carry I immediately tell them, "Hey look, I know it's your right to carry and I'm not here to stop you, I got a call and I'm obligated to investigate it.
    OMG, I think I'm in love!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sheriff108
    this is America, and there are not "papers" that you have to show the police... you can't LIE about your identity, but you also don't HAVE to show papers for merely walking down the street, with or without a gun... being ARMED is not RAS.

    You are no more obligated to investigate a MWAG call, ABSENT some reason to believe criminal activity is afoot, than we are obligated to make sure a guy watering his grass has paid his water bill.
    Sheriff Berry is from Oconee County, GA. Write him: sberry@oconeesheriff.org
    Last edited by MKEgal; 06-06-2011 at 09:20 PM.
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    Citizenship is a verb.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proverbs 27:12
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    The simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences.
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  8. #8
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    I didn't read it all, but I like Sheriff108.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    To all in the OC community, if anyone wants to bang their head against the wall when stopped by a uniformed officer or engage in a legal disscussion with a uniformed officer when stopped because they have decided to OC, by all means do so. Please remember everyone, the uniformed officer is getting paid to be there and because he has nothing better to do at that moment, he will continue with any disscussion you desire. And remember folks, if you are stopped by a uniformed officer when you are walking because you decide to OC or if an officer has to respond to a MWAG call and later discovers you are OCing, you are not free to leave until that uniformed officer has completed their investigation. Therefore, I would encourage everyone to be polite, show patience and try to educate the officer (I do understand that some (okay quite a few) officers are blockheads, but try anyways).

    Please forgive me for stating earlier "I do know that when an officer receives a call about a person who is OCing," instead of stating "I do know that when an officer receives a MWAG call", MY BAD!!!!!

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    you are not free to leave until that uniformed officer has completed their investigation.
    "Officer, am I being detained?" " No".... "Bye".

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    XD Shooter, you hit the nail on the head....if not being detained, leave the location...I totally agree...

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    Officer, please understand that very few of us really try to go out of our way to make problems for you guys. Quite the contrary, we see OC as an advantage to LEO in general. Most OCers tend to think of ourselves as a couple steps above,(not better than) the average joe. Put a cop on the high end of a bar graph, the average person in the center, and the criminal at the low end, and we look at ourselves as being somewhere between the LEO and the run of the mill guy. We especially dont therefore, like to be treated as criminals. We spend the time and effort above and beyond the average joe, to be knowledgeable about, and to follow the law. We also tend to be more protective of other constitutional rights as a result.

    We understand expect, and respect that MWAG call, and that you have to come and see, that's cool with us. We just figure that if we have to know the law, that you should too. We are willing to give the officer a little more respect than the average, so long as that respect is mutual.

    My personal policy when OCing is that I will always give an officer my ID when asked, but if the officer is not respectful of both myself, and my rights, I wont. When asked, I will usually say "Sure", and as I'm handing the LEO my ID I will say,"You do know I dont have to give it, but you havent given me a reason to be a jerk.

    Typically, we hold you guys in pretty high regard, we can only guess the things you have to see, do, and put up with, not only from the outside, but politically as well. We know that you took an oath to protect our rights, and hope that wasnt something memorized and mumbled out as a condition of your employment for us, but something thjat you took to heart as sacred. The constitution was bought and paid for by the blood of citizens, patriots, soldiers, and sometimes police, so we expect that to be taken with grave respect. When an officer mocks an OCer, harasses, charges us with a crime, or enforces a law that in any way infringes on the right to both keep and to bear arms, speech, or against our privacy, many of us view this as a treasonous act. A desecration of the flag, or spitting in the face of dead soldiers.

    Take Katrina for example, that was a black eye all the way around. What should have happened, would be to have deputized those people who were willing to make a stand, and made them proud to serve the country hand in hand with LEO. Thats the kind of flag flying firework lighting patriotism many of us here desire.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xd shooter View Post
    "Officer, am I being detained?" " No".... "Bye".
    According to one of the officers posting there his response to another posters remarks.



    Officer, why are you contacting me? Am I being detained? Am I free to go now?

    His response:
    Did the Officers tell him he was not free to go? I didn't see that. Are they obligated to tell him he can go? Nope. Us giving people legal advice is not required.

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    I think most officers understand that thugs don't openly carry guns in retention holsters, nor do they dress in generally nice attire while doing so. The thing is, they cannot assume anything of the motives or character of any person they meet. ESPECIALLY not if they are armed.

    It isn't about trampling rights, power trips, self-esteem issues, or even ignorance of the law. It's the fact that police are trained to be predators whose prey is the criminal element. It isn't a cheerful way of putting it, but that's the simple fact. They can't passively wait for crime to happen, they have to be out there seeking, hunting, sniffing, and ferreting it out wherever it dwells. If they didn't, crime would skyrocket because the criminal element would know that as long as they did whatever they intended to do swiftly, they would never be caught because the police would never get there in time.

    Police can't be everywhere, but they might be anywhere. That keeps a lot of crime from happening, believe it or not. It also helps the average citizen feel more secure, whether they are or are not. Note that I do not include CC or OCers in the 'average citizen' category.
    The Dogs of War are nothing compared to the Cats

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    I agree with most of that except that I've seen too many examples of cops who were ignorant of the laws, in person, online video, and on forums.

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    Campaign Veteran RabbiVJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    I didn't read it all, but I like Sheriff108.
    If thats who I think it is...I know of him, he posts over on GPDO A LOT.
    -NRA Member, GSSF Member, GeorgiaCarry Member, Glock Certified Armorer, Glock 30SF, STI Elektra, M&P9c, NAA Black Widow .22 WMR
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    I agree with most of that except that I've seen too many examples of cops who were ignorant of the laws, in person, online video, and on forums.
    And they're out there. I won't deny it. I think though, those are the vocal minority rather than the silent majority.
    The Dogs of War are nothing compared to the Cats

  18. #18
    Regular Member CharleyCherokee's Avatar
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    I wanted very badly to post on the website over there, but didn't get the activation email for my account. Hopefully, the LEOs will grace our board with their presence as well. Considering I couldn't post there what I wanted I will post it here, though, as it will make me feel a little better.

    None of us question that LEOs have a right to ask us whichever questions they desire when they see us OC'ing. If LEOs are concerned about ANY person they should go have a talk with them. However, when a LEO walks up to me and starts asking questions I will never answer them or cooperate with them if I'm not required to by law as I have a right not to. This isn't because I'm an assh*le, or because I'm trying to be disrespectful. Nor am I trying to make your job difficult. The SOLE reason this is the case is, because when a LEO confronts you he is trying to find a reason to arrest you. It's their job. A LEO isn't asking for my ID to make sure I don't have amnesia. He's asking for it to run me for warrants and such. There is nothing to be gained by me in cooperating with a LEO who is trying to investigate me even if I've done nothing unlawful.
    Furthermore, if I am confronted by a LEO, I'm not going to feel as though I can just walk away from him as doing so could open a whole new can of worms. So to you LEOs, feel free to approach me, but if you're absent RAS don't intimidate me into feeling I have to accept your company. You will earn my respect and come across as honest and honorable if you let me know up front I am free to continue on my way instead of looking like an assh*le trying to intimidate me into doing or saying something to get arrested.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kivuli View Post
    And they're out there. I won't deny it. I think though, those are the vocal minority rather than the silent majority.
    And yet that vocal minority makes a large majority of the bad stops. Which means that if you're getting stopped chances are its by a less than stellar cop.

  20. #20
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    +1 The ones respecting my rights either dont stop you, or say, "that's a nice piece, I wish there were more of you guys out there. Maybe not, you'd eventually put me outa work lol"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aknazer View Post
    And yet that vocal minority makes a large majority of the bad stops. Which means that if you're getting stopped chances are its by a less than stellar cop.
    It's fairer to say that the vocal minority make the majority of stops that you HEAR ABOUT, but saying they make the majority of stops isn't quite accurate. Lots of perfectly reasonable LEOs talk to OCers on a daily basis, you just never hear about it because they understand the law, your rights, and can tell when something is suspicious and when something isn't after a brief investigation.

    Moreover, they don't act like dingbats.
    The Dogs of War are nothing compared to the Cats

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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    I didn't read it all, but I like Sheriff108.
    +1. He gets it.
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. Together, they protect the rest of our Bill of Rights and our United States Constitution, and help We the People protect ourselves in the spirit of our Declaration of Independence.

  23. #23
    Regular Member OldCurlyWolf's Avatar
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    Did anyone notice that the most Vociferous were officers in the "Nanny States" of the East and West Coasts?

    The others, while PO'd at the "guy in the striped shirt" were much calmer and logical in their comments.
    I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do those things to other people and I require the same of them.

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    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xd shooter View Post
    "Officer, am I being detained?" " No".... "Bye".
    WHY am I being detained works better... Think about it.
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
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  25. #25
    Regular Member SouthernBoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ixtow View Post
    WHY am I being detained works better... Think about it.
    Exactly and this is what one should ask, not "Am I being detained". The word "Why" requests an answer frome the LEO which is more than a simple "yes" or "no" and if you do get a simple "yes" to the "Why", it is more affirmative in nature.
    Last edited by SouthernBoy; 05-18-2011 at 07:51 AM.
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