Results 1 to 18 of 18

Thread: NRA statement on the public hearings

  1. #1
    Regular Member paul@paul-fisher.com's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Chandler, AZ
    Posts
    4,047

    NRA statement on the public hearings


  2. #2
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Under your bed
    Posts
    542
    If each bill becomes law, citizens will have the option of carrying under either of the two systems, as described in the bill summary here.
    I know the NRA guy said in the Cabala's meeting these two bills can work hand and hand together. So if I'm reading this right and they pass both bills, I will be able to constitutionally carry open and I would need a permit to carry concealed and (arguably) bypass the federal school zone restriction? Can anybody tell me if this is how it could work?

    I like that this would get us half there, constitutional carry openly would clear up a lot of problems other states have with open carry and the police getting confused weather some laws apply to open or concealed. Since I will most likely continue to always carry openly even if I have to get a permit this is important to me.


    The NRA lobbyist, same guy in Madison I'll have to look up his name did say the constitutional bill would be a benefit to people in lees urban areas aka as places with less schools.


    Edited to add:
    I almost forgot that the language changed a bit in the constitutional carry bill and they might be trying to slip us the big one on car carry again but I figured you would need a permit anyway in a car if we had any kind of permit otherwise the police would always say we were concealing even if it was on the dash or taped to our foreheads.

    Thanks Handy, it was Lasorte.
    Last edited by Jason in WI; 05-14-2011 at 10:57 AM.

  3. #3
    Regular Member HandyHamlet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Terra, Sol
    Posts
    2,779
    Lasorte?
    "Don't interfere with anything in the Constitution. That must be maintained, for it is the only safeguard of our liberties."
    Abraham Lincoln

    "Some time ago, a bunch of lefties defied the law by dancing at the Jefferson Memorial, resulting in their arrests. Last week, a bunch of them pulled the same stunt and - using patented Lefist techniques - provoked the Park Police into having to use force to arrest them."
    Alexcabbie

  4. #4
    McX
    Guest
    the only things i overly liked were; the written part of cops not being able to harass open carriers.
    the written part of i can run on an out of state permit- if that permit included a background check.

    the rest sucks.

  5. #5
    Regular Member paul@paul-fisher.com's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Chandler, AZ
    Posts
    4,047
    Quote Originally Posted by Jason in WI View Post
    I know the NRA guy said in the Cabala's meeting these two bills can work hand and hand together. So if I'm reading this right and they pass both bills, I will be able to constitutionally carry open and I would need a permit to carry concealed and (arguably) bypass the federal school zone restriction? Can anybody tell me if this is how it could work?

    I like that this would get us half there, constitutional carry openly would clear up a lot of problems other states have with open carry and the police getting confused weather some laws apply to open or concealed. Since I will most likely continue to always carry openly even if I have to get a permit this is important to me.


    The NRA lobbyist, same guy in Madison I'll have to look up his name did say the constitutional bill would be a benefit to people in lees urban areas aka as places with less schools.


    Edited to add:
    I almost forgot that the language changed a bit in the constitutional carry bill and they might be trying to slip us the big one on car carry again but I figured you would need a permit anyway in a car if we had any kind of permit otherwise the police would always say we were concealing even if it was on the dash or taped to our foreheads.

    Thanks Handy, it was Lasorte.
    My understanding from talking to him was that it would end up like AZ, we would carry as we like without a permit but there would be an optional permit for reciprocity. I mentioned to him that the LRB versions would need modification and he said it was being worked on.

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    North Central Wisconsin, ,
    Posts
    768
    It is critical that you contact your state Senator AND state Representative and request that they support the PPA without any amendments that further restrict your right to self-defense or cause more difficulty in obtaining a license. Specifically, ask that they oppose a training mandate
    Is something missing here? Oh, I know

    "support the PPA and the Right to Carry Bill without any amendments"

  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Under your bed
    Posts
    542
    Quote Originally Posted by paul@paul-fisher.com View Post
    My understanding from talking to him was that it would end up like AZ, we would carry as we like without a permit but there would be an optional permit for reciprocity. I mentioned to him that the LRB versions would need modification and he said it was being worked on.
    That would be awesome! The only thing I don't get is that doesn't the permit bill prohibit concealed carry without a permit? I know we have conflicting laws but how does one get around that? Like I'm required to show my permit to an officer if I'm conceal carrying but how do I do that if I'm concealing under the constitutional bill?

    Remember, I did ask him why not just use the NRA's influence to add an optional permit system for the guys worrying about travailing out of state to the constitutional bill and call it done. The answer I got after I filtered it was pretty much our law makers are a bunch of spineless wusses, I don't think I filtered it much I believe he actually said that. I guess maybe they can backdoor it in while passing a permit bill to make the lib's happy?


    I really am confused. I'll admit I didn't really look at the language in the bill to see exactly how they modified the statues so maybe it is possible. Sorry I didn't get to say bye Paul at the meeting, we had to go shopping!

  8. #8
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    SE, WI
    Posts
    7,318
    Hopefully police will not harass us because we do not have a permit.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  9. #9
    McX
    Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    Hopefully police will not harass us because we do not have a permit.
    Hopefully Wisconsin Carry will sue them if they do.

  10. #10
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    SE, WI
    Posts
    7,318
    Quote Originally Posted by McX View Post
    Hopefully Wisconsin Carry will sue them if they do.
    Hopefully it will not come to that.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  11. #11
    Regular Member AaronS's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA
    Posts
    1,497
    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    Hopefully police will not harass us because we do not have a permit.
    Still will have the 1000 foot Fed. School zone issue. With no permit, the Fed will still have a reason to take us in.
    I guess this is why I would like to see both bills pass.

  12. #12
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    SE, WI
    Posts
    7,318
    Quote Originally Posted by AaronS View Post
    Still will have the 1000 foot Fed. School zone issue. With no permit, the Fed will still have a reason to take us in.
    I guess this is why I would like to see both bills pass.
    Have there been any recent cases of people being charged with the federal GFSZ?
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  13. #13
    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Green Bay, Wisconsin, USA
    Posts
    2,839
    Quote Originally Posted by AaronS View Post
    Still will have the 1000 foot Fed. School zone issue. With no permit, the Fed will still have a reason to take us in.
    I guess this is why I would like to see both bills pass.
    While this is true, can anyone cite a prosecution under the Federal GFSZ where the State Statute was less stringent such as the proposal we have to make it school grounds only??

  14. #14
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Stoughton, WI
    Posts
    252
    I still think the signage language needs to be changed to an odd size, like 13x13, so efforts will have to be put into no-guns signs. Having a blaze orange background isn't enough, imho

  15. #15
    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    in front of my computer, WI
    Posts
    4,426
    Quote Originally Posted by protias
    Hopefully police will not harass us because we do not have a permit.
    Why do you think they'd change what they're doing?
    They've had a memo from the AG.
    They've had lawsuits.
    Still they hassle OCers.

    Quote Originally Posted by rcav8r
    I still think the signage language needs to be changed to an odd size, like 13x13, so efforts will have to be put into no-guns signs.
    I agree; it can't be something easy to make up on the copy machine.
    At least 12" square.
    White background, black pistol, red circle slash (at least 8" outside diameter).
    Plain block capital letters at least 1" high, black, saying "no concealed carry" (or "no firearms") & the # of the statute.
    Posted on every door. (Not just 'near every entrance'.)
    Posted at eye level for an average adult (bottom no less than 3' off the ground, top no more than 6' off the ground).
    Sign may not be obscured or hidden by anything, even in part. (No lettering on the door, no handle or push bar.)

  16. #16
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    SE, WI
    Posts
    7,318
    Quote Originally Posted by rcav8r View Post
    I still think the signage language needs to be changed to an odd size, like 13x13, so efforts will have to be put into no-guns signs. Having a blaze orange background isn't enough, imho
    Agreed. Texas type signage would be good.

    Quote Originally Posted by MKEgal View Post
    Why do you think they'd change what they're doing?
    They've had a memo from the AG.
    They've had lawsuits.
    Still they hassle OCers.
    Like I said, hopefully. I never said they would or would not change.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  17. #17
    Regular Member Optimus Prime's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Stevens Point, Wisconsin, USA
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    Have there been any recent cases of people being charged with the federal GFSZ?
    At the Wausau meeting the guy was saying they couldn't tell you what the fine for it was, because no one had ever been charged with it. It seems they're afraid if they did try to prosecute, it would open it up for a constitutionality challenge.

  18. #18
    Campaign Veteran Flipper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    , Wisconsin, USA
    Posts
    1,140
    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus Prime View Post
    At the Wausau meeting the guy was saying they couldn't tell you what the fine for it was, because no one had ever been charged with it. It seems they're afraid if they did try to prosecute, it would open it up for a constitutionality challenge.
    There have been convictions under the 1995 version that have been upheld through federal appeals court.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun-Fre...es_Act_of_1990
    When in danger you can dial 911 and hope for the police to arrive a few minutes later armed with guns.
    Why do police carry guns?

    The Joyce Foundation funded firearm control empire:
    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...lFundingR1.png

    "Everything that we see is a shadow cast by that which we do not see." - Martin Luther King Jr.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •